I Don't Get It - CA Baby Bar

I don't get why the passing rate on the California Baby Bar is so dismal. Why wouldn't someone pass the test if they've thoroughly studied the material? Is there something about the test that makes it particularly difficult to someone who has worked hard learning the three tested subjects?

Thanks,

Christian
CGEN, USQ

 

As I understand it, the only thing "Baby" about the FYLEX is that it is limited to three or four Bar subjects instead of the fifteen or twenty on the Bar exam. It is graded to the same standards as the full Bar.

I would speculate that the problem is in the WAY a student approaches the question. Law school teaches a particular kind of reasoning; difficult to describe. The first year is spent learning this way of thinking as much as learning sustantive law.

Classroom participation and study group arguments are very valuable in developing this skill and these are the very things missing from the D/L experience.

I think you can examine "model"answers to FYLEX questions at the CalBar site, www.calbar.org

Nosborne, JD

 

I did just that and was somewhat shocked (to say the least) at the first question on the 10/2002 exam and second question on the 6/2002 exam.

I don't know about you, Nosborne, but I didn't take Sales (i.e. UCC) until my second year in law school. In Contracts (first year), we covered the basics (offer, acceptance, consideration, damages, etc.); we did NOT cover issues such as implied warranties of merchantability & fitness, perfect tender, merchant-to-merchant rules, et. al. and the contracts questions seem to contain many of those issues.

 

I graduated in 1986. We did cover the UCC sales warranties in first year contracts but that's not to say every school does it the same way.

Nosborne, JD

 

I graduated in the same year. Basically, we just scratched the surface of Article 2, which was covered (comprehensively) in a separate course, Sales. Contracts plus Article 2, in-depth, is a lot to cover in one year (particularly the first year).

 

Kajidoro raises an excellent question, but then limits the explanation to students who prepare themselves poorly. There could be other reasons, including bias by the graders, poor instruction, excessively difficult tests, etc. Or it could be just as it's supposed to be!

To my knowledge, this has not been explored. I wonder what's in the literature?

 

I noticed a few things while doing some FYLSE research.

First off, the California Bar has moved to a new URL:

http://www.calbar.ca.gov

Also, the list of subjects covered on the exam does include Article 1 and Article 2 of the UCC:

http://www.calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pdfs/40sf03010.pdf

Hope this helps,

Christian
CGEN, USQ

 

Low Performance on Baby Bar

I think most of you are missing the issues here.
Please note that most of people who pursue the law through on-line or correspondence schools are highly educated professionals.
The low passing rates on the baby bar and eventually the bar exams are due to the fact that these people don't have the luxury of taking three months off from work to prepare for the exams.

 

Well, if a person doesn't have time to prepare for a limited Bar type exam, is the answer to eliminate the requirement? Law study is HARD. It is very time consuming which is why the ABA standards place severe limits on outside employment during the first year and continues looser limits throughout one's study. Besides, bar review for the whole EXAM need not take anything like three months full time. At least, it didn't for me.

Nosborne, JD

 

Passing Bar Exam...

I agree with what you said.
For some people, it doesn't take three months of full time study to pass the bar exam. However, most of ABA graduates I know took that three months off for the exam.

 

Okay, lots of theories. Any reason we should accept that one preponderates? Or are we limited to informed opinion?

 

Re: Passing Bar Exam...

Which state(s)? The IL and FL exams are administered twice a year at around the same time; third week in July and third week in February. As a result, the typical examinee simply doesn't have 3 months to prepare. Those graduating in the winter are usually concentrating on finals administered in December while those graduating in the spring are similarly busy through about mid-May. After finals, you're basically left with roughly two months to prepare for the next administration of the bar exam.

However, as I recall, I finished my finals around the middle of December but the bar review course didn't start until around the middle of January. Thus, I wound up with a total study time (for the exam I took immediately following law school; IL) of less than 6 weeks.

 

Hmmm. Given my current obsession with obtaining the DL JD, this conversation is of interest. I have read on various forums and even a woman's website who passed both FYLX and GBX on the first try that

1. You must practice taking tests over and over under timed conditions; lock your door and take the test then have an instructor review the result if you have the luxury.

2. You must study on a consistent, disciplined schedule

3. Most normal IQ people probably should take a baby bar review course in addition to their regular study material

In addition, this woman has children and was VP of a computer products company at the time she took both exams. She says she did not use secondary bar review programs, although she recommends them for those who are unsure about their ability to pass.

Several other posters who are in 2L and 3L confirmed her conclusions.

 

Nosborne, Homer,

Just FYI, I am a current 2L, and we covered UCC sales, warrantability, merchant-to-merchant transactions, etc., at least to some level in our first-year contracts course. My school also offers an in-depth class in UCC and commercial transactions for those who just couldn't get enough the first time...

 

Richards --

I'm curious about why you interrupted your MS in Physics for the JD. From your signature, it looks like you intend to finish the MS.

Thanks.

 

wannaJD --

I didn't really interrupt my MS for the JD. I started on my MS, got most of the way through it, then sort of got interested in other things, and never quite got around to finishing it. Then I got my MBA, now law school. I still do intend to finish my MS after law school if I can -- the school I went to for my MS is right down the street from the law firm I hope to be working for after I graduate (the firm I'm working for now, and will work this summer), so hopefully I'll be able to finish it up. It probably won't impact my career in any meaningful way, but it nags me that I never finished it...