WHY does California appear to have so few degree completion opps?

On another thread, someone from Bakersfield I think was wondering what to do to complete a BS in Business.

On looking at a couple online lists, including John Bear's Guide, it struck me: only Golden Gate answers this call! How come there are so few degree compleyion programs in California? I remains the largest state in the US by population! So where are the opportunities? (Strange.)

--Orson

 

Maybe WASC makes it difficult.
Or the philosophy of California's state system is not congruent with this approach.
Or the CA approved schools fill this niche in California (in the minds of many, anyway), and schools who would otherwise offer such programs don't believe the market is there.

Tony

 

Define "degree completion": just about any school (including the entire Cal system) will let you transfer in all but your last year's credits for a BA/BS. Even the heavily-marketed "hey, working adults, come & complete your degree for big bucks" programs make you spend the equivalent of an academic year (30 credits) in residence.

 

Define degree completion--?

How about "flexible," as in those schools listed in John Bear's Guide to Non-traditional Education.

You DO know that a little place called Silicon Valley is in California--and that "online courses" are the latest non-trad DL buzzword! And that the two are intimately connected--!!

SO--where are those flexible degree completion programs in California?

--Orson

 

The University of Phoenix has many California locations.

 

Re: Define degree completion--?

 

A number of CA schools offer online or DL courses. In addition to CSUDH, which everyone here knows about. The UC's all offer online courses thru their extensions. JFKu offers some sort of degree complettion deal they market heavily on the radio here.

One gem is Foothill College. Admittedly, its a comm college, but their online offerings are plenty, and their tuition is dirt-cheap. My wife investigated their offerings awhile back to get a few gen ed credits for her teaching credential, and found the courses very well done. I think a few other comm colleges have similar setups.

So if you don't want the UoPx route, or step foot of California's many, many colleges, universities, etc., pick and choose among the sundry online courses and transfer them all to on of the "big three" for the ultimate degree.

 

The reason that you don't hear about them is that their administrators are all spending their winter soaking up the sun on those warm Colorado beaches.

Actually, the undergraduate residency requirement at the California State University is only 30 units, so there's 23 of them right there. I see ads for degree completion programs offered by the local Catholic colleges and universities periodically on BART. CIIS has a rather "alternative" bachelors completion program.

So the question really isn't why they don't exist, but why more of them aren't offered by DL. Of course, some fascinating DL options do exist.

CSU Chico offers bachelors degree completion programs online in social science (breadth option), sociology, nursing, liberal studies and (check this out) a CSAB/ABET accredited BSCS. That's in addition to their DL masters offerings, which include a matching MSCS.

http://rce.csuchico.edu/online/programlist.asp

CSUDH has its own NLN accredited bachelors completion program in nursing, as well as a new BS program in quality assurance.

http://dominguezonline.csudh.edu/programs.php

That's just two of the 23 CSUs. I'm sure that anyone sniffing around the rest of their websites will find more opportunities.

Many California colleges and universities operate bachelors completion programs from remote sites scattered around the state. CSU Hayward operates a center in Concord and another in downtown Oakland. Golden Gate U. is all over the state. JFKU operates a remote south bay site. San Francisco State offers bachelors degree completion programs remotely at Canada College in Redwood City. The San Mateo County government contracts with CSU Hayward for degree completion programs offered at its Redwood City facilities for county employees. San Jose State operated a remote center in Salinas, but they may have handed that off to CSU Monterey Bay. Sonoma State operates a remote site up in Mendocino county.

There are lots of these things. (I haven't even mentioned Southern California.) BTW, I believe that Vanguard University operates a remote bachelors completion program in Bakersfield.

 

thanks BillDayson

Thanks BillDayson,

this is a huge list from all.

just for the record, i don't see any version of Vanguard here in Bako. I was told by someone else recently that it did have a campus here, but it had been closed down. In bako the options seem to be:

UoPx
Cal State Bako.
National U.
U. of LaVerne
perhaps San Joaquin Valley College

Chris

 

I am here in Sacramento, the capital of the 5th largest economy in the WORLD. There are NO options for a PhD in Business, which still amazes me.......

 

Summary...

So--

Bill Dayson thinks there are hidden opportunities; Christopher, in southern Imperial Valley and Kristie7 up north see holes in available offerings.

Certainly Californian HAS a proud tradition of non-traditional education in--psychology. But also in state supported access.

Thus, it strikes me as odd that the leaders are back East: New York, New Jersey, Connecticut, even Illinois. Its not as though, as in Alaska or Wyoming or the Dakota's, there are no complementary technologies or channels of delivery for providing and completing education.

Clearly, BYU, serving a Mormon (LDS) religious base densely spread among eight or more rural states, fulfills its duty in being available to a spread-out constituency. Could "backward" Utah be ahead of progressive California in making its services more flexibly available?

My only insight into this paradox is the fact that New York came late to the game of state supported education--didn't SUNY emerge after WWII?--swallowing up fomerly private schools like The Univerity of Buffalo? Perhaps the once daring Regents College approach could only emerge in the embrace of more experimental times, obviously assisted by the temper of the 60s and the University Without Walls movement. Perhaps such experimentalism was still-born in the West, where a world-famous
state educational system helped stomp out these fragile flowers.
(And, of course, it took other forms like UofP.)

--Orson

 

Hi Orson

I think your last post hits very accurately. California has immense educational opportunities and resources yet DL opportunities are limited with only a few exceptions. All of the UC schools fail to offer ANY DL programs?! While private universities and CSU DH have done an admiral job it is a shame that the major CA institutions have total ignored this market. Ultimately it is there loss.

 

USC has some really attractive graduate CS and Engineering programs available through its Distance Education Network. I wonder if there are any plans to add undergraduate programs.

 

Re: Summary...

It's really not that unusual. The East Coast typically leads the way.
Jack

 

As a native Californian, I would certainly disagree with Orson's choice of adjective for California education. "Digressive" would be a more accurate descriptor of our current California system (especially with regards to our Dept. of Education and K-12 system). Any attempts at improvement or reform (e.g. charter schools) are being squashed.

However, we do have some shining stars in our constellation of over 200 colleges and universities. CSU Dominguez Hills DL masters programs are familiar to many of us here. San Diego State is offering a masters in instructional technology (they have an excellent program in that area), CSU Fresno is working to put a liberal studies degree program online (a boon to those who wish to become elementary school teachers). Fielding has devoted much effort to develop online learning communities. Several community colleges are stretching their limited resources to deliver online programs at a reasonable cost.

WASC (which accredits schools in California) has been the most provincial of the six regional accreditors, which can account for its being a bit behind other states. But the tide may be changing. I am working with La Sierra University to put their Master of Arts in Teaching degree online. This program allows budding teachers to meet credential and masters requirements simultaneously. I am also developing an online masters in instructional technology for them. La Sierra has contacted WASC and it looks like we are getting the green light to proceed with the degrees.

Tony Piña
School of Education, La Sierra University
&
School of Education, CSU, San Bernardino (Adjunct)

 

Re: Summary...

If I want a bachelors completion program, I've got over a dozen choices within easy commuting distance. I can pick and choose to find one that matches my very idiosyncratic desires. There's nothing secret or hidden about it.

The issue isn't really whether California offers degree completion opportunities to its residents. It does. The complaint voiced here on Degreeinfo seems to be that it doesn't offer them in easy one-stop-DL-shopping form to people outside the state as well.

Perhaps this marketing front-end that gathers many (not all, I noticed that ITP and Pacifica are missing) of California's DL offerings together in one place might be useful:

http://www.cvc.edu

Here's a rather cumbersome eight page alphabetical listing of programs, from associates and certificate level up to the doctoral level, offered by California institutions.

http://www.cvc.edu/catalog/programs.asp

Adding ITP and Pacifica's offerings, I counted 74 different DL degree programs at the bachelors level and above. That includes 14 RA doctoral programs. If these programs were all gathered together in one place, it would be the equivalent of a good size doctoral-research university.

There are also over a hundred certificate and associate level programs.

I'm not saying that this lineup is the best in the US, let alone the world. But there's a gap beween being best in the world at everything and sucking. That's my point.

I don't see any evidence of evil conspiracies in this state trying to quash non-traditional education. In fact, we seem unusually open to creating new and unusual stand-alone institutes.

In just the last year, City of Hope got WASC accreditation for its Ph.D. program in biotechnology and Hsi Lai University became a recognized candidate. In addition, we have CIIS, Saybrook, the Wright Institute, ITP, the American Conservatory Theater, Pacific Graduate School of Psychology, National Hispanic University, New College, Pacifica Graduate Inst., Fielding, the Rand Graduate School, the American Film Institute, the Salk and the Scripps Institutes (both of which have produced Nobel laureates in the last five years) and many more including several stand-alone law schools. Most of these aren't DL, but they certainly are evidence of non-traditional thinking and educational entrepeneurship.

 

Bill - Thanks for the links, but my concern is for national accreditation, not RA offerings. There are ZERO in my area. I don't think it is a conspiracy, just disappointing.

 

The issue is not local degree completion programs, but distance learning programs. If you go to the links provided you will find programs in the metro areas. If you go to the link for state wide/rural programs you will find almost nothing. Yes, the private schools do a good job picking up the slack, but almost no involvement from the major schools? You can get an undergrad dl degree from NYU but not from UCLA, USC, UC Berkeley, etc.? California has unbelievable educational resources, but why so little distance learning? I do believe it is fair to say the education bureacracy sees dl as a threat and have done what they can to stifle it. No I don't see it as any sort of conspiracy, just the way bureacracies tend to perpetuate and protect themselves. Is it a big issue? No. Other states are providing the leadership and filling the need. It is just a shame that CA is, at least in this one way, being left behind.

 

Which is the reason I am enrolled at Colorado State, even though I live 15 miles from Bezerkeley, and 25 miles from Davis. The only DL options at the doctoral level are either true fuzzy subjects or "less than wonderfulls".


Also the UC system has an interesting twist. While many of their extension progam classes are listed as graduate level, few if any can be used for credit in thier own progams. A friend was working towards his masters at Berekeley, and took an engineering course through the extension office. The course was held in conjuction with a regular program course (differnece was an X in front of the course number). Turns out he could not use the course for credit towards his degree, even though it was required. He had to take it agian (same professor, book and everything). Could have been a department rule, but it really frosted him at the time.

 

Some Cal State offers.
http://www.gateway.calstate.edu/extension/off_campus_degrees.shtml