Sources for ET/EET/EE RA Courses &/or Credits

Greetings.

I'd like this thread to be a repository of links to sources
for RA credits in Electronics Technology (aka Electronics
Engineering Technology) and Electrical (Electronics)
Engineering.

Eligible (for this thread) credits would involve credits in
subjects that are obviously electronics related (i.e. AC
Circuits, Electronics 101, etc.) as well as closely related
ancillary topics (electromagnetic physics, etc.).

Allow me to lead by example:
- ISCET (International Society of Certified Electronics
Technicians, www.iscet.org) offers several ACE reviewed
exams, all assessed at 3-credits. Their Associate level
exam (http://www.iscet.org/certification/associate.html)
covers a hodgepodge of electronics and electronics related
information. They also have "Journeyman Speciality" exams
in a variety of subject areas
(http://www.iscet.org/certification/journeyman.html).
Aside: When I took it (Dec '00?), ISCET's "computer"
journeyman's exam was a splendid flashback to computing as
it was in the late '80s/early '90s. <g>
- Ohio University, College Credit by Examination
(http://www.ohiou.edu/independent/ccewords.htm),
Electronics Technology Exams
(http://www.ohiou.edu/independent/list.htm#etch): As of
this date, OU offers 9 exams in ET or ET related subjects.
The fee is $50 per QUARTER HOUR credit. OU is also willing
to create an exam for any course in their (brick-and-
mortar) university's catalog, DEPENDENT upon the
cooperation of the faculty of the department involved.
According to someone I wrote to at OU's CCE department,
the chances of getting a special CCE in an Electronics
Tech. subject are "... slim to not (sic) at all."
- University of North Dakota (www.und.edu): UND offers
courses by distance learning
(http://www.conted.und.edu/creditcorre/program.html). They
also offer engineering courses by distance learning
(http://gocubs.conted.und.nodak.edu/dist_engr/). Of
course, the distance "anything" courses and the distance
engineering courses are not described in the same place.
Why? For the same reason that intelligent and academician
are two different words. <g> The engineering courses are
expensive for out of state residents, and the lack of a
reply to my email of several days past does not speak well
of their administration. For information on their current
engineering courses, follow the link for "future courses".
Information on their future courses can, "logically", be
found under the same link.


Okay, I've done my part; now its your turn. Lets have YOUR
suggestions. Notice how each of MY suggestions included a
web site for more information. References without contact
information or URLs are all but useless; the web sites of RA
colleges are generally as confused and indecipherable as
their administrations.

Thanks in advance!


Cordially,
Richard Kanarek, CET

 

UND Update

Greetings.

As no one else can be bothered to reply to this topic, I guess I'll have to. <g>

I just received a very nice & detailed reply from UND. My original message asked/complained about the high cost of their distance EE course work for some out-of-state students. I learned that there is some thought being given to adjusting the tuition schedule. *PERHAPS*, if I start getting some quality replies, I *MIGHT* keep you informed. <g>


Cordially,
Richard Kanarek

 

Richard,

It is interesting that UND might adjust the out-of-state tuition for out-of-state students.

Excelsior's DistanceLearn database lists many EE courses from the University of Southern Queensland (www.usq.edu.au). USQ offers a BSEE (ME, CE, etc) via DL, but also requires campus visits for the labs. The individual courses appear to cost much less than UND.

Maybe UND would accept some of the USQ EE courses as transfer credit. It would certainly reduce the cost of a UND BSEE. My company will only reimburse me up to $5000/year for undergraduate course work.

I wonder how long ago did UND open up their DL undergraduate Engineering programs to the general public? Several years ago when I first found it, it was only open to employees of certain corporations.

Regards,

Jim

 

BSAST/EET/BSEE-- UND/TESC

What 's your take on TESC -- BSAST programs in Electronics & Electrical Technology? I recently enrolled at TESC; I'm awaiting evaluation.
http://www.tesc.edu/prospective/undergraduate/degree/bsast/bsast_electronics_eng_tech.pdf. I recently found out about the BSEE at UND, seen that my only learning option is DL, and, they offer an ABET accredited degree, it's very inviting. Any Info. on other colleges ofering an ABET accerdited degree via DL?

 

Greetings.

Dear Jim:

("glennmari"'s reply follows.)

I should reiterate that I wrote that UND *MIGHT* adjust its rate
schedule. Of course, they MIGHT not. Also, any adjustments they
make might (or might not) effect all UND students, for good OR
for bad. All I have heard is that the matter is being considered.

I must confess, it's awfully swell of them to even consider
adjusting their prices. After all, they currently have an
absolute monopoly. I guarantee you'll not find such consideration
at my lousy state university system (NY).

I have heard that Australian universities were bargain priced,
but, when I checked USQ, I was quite disappointed. Yes, I did
adjust for the differences between AU$ and US$, but their
technical/engineering course work (which, as I recall, is charged
at a higher-than-normal rate schedule) seemed quite pricy to me.
Then again, perhaps men like you, Bill Gates, or Dr. Bear have a
different outlook on prices. <g>

UND does seem happy to accept RESIDENTIAL, non-major (?) transfer
credit (they have a limit on credit from correspondence courses
UNLESS it comes from UND <g>). They also have a sort of
portfolio-review program of which I know nothing. I didn't
receive as much of a clarification on their credit policies as I
would have preferred; I anticipate making further inquiries some
time in mid/late '03. I wouldn't suggest waiting for me to post
an update. <g>



Dear "glennmari":

As I recall TESC's ET degree is ABET accredited. *Assuming* I'm
correct, than the TESC degree is the best you could hope for, at
least on paper. Of course, the actual quality of your education
will depend upon where you secure it from (among other
variables).

Comparing TESC's ET degree with UND's BSEE degree is rather like
comparing learning how to be a butcher with learning how to be a
veterinarian: both are useful & important jobs that demand highly
specialized skills, and both involve animals, yet there are
"subtle" differences between them. <g>

I would hardly suppose that an ET/EET/etc. <g> degree is a
gateway towards being an employed engineer. If you're keen on
engineering, perhaps you need to reconsider your educational
goals. Alternately, if you're keen to complete the TESC degree,
perhaps you need to reconsider your vocational goals. <g> There
are hoards of silly, frivolous courses (lower level) credits to
be completed in either case; you can still work on satisfying
them whilst you (re)consider your major.

As far as alternate ABET & regionally accredited degree choices,
that depends upon whether your keen on an ET or EE degree. For an
ET degree, there are certainly a few other choices (don't ask me
to name them), but I *think* (???) TESC is your only choice as
far as an assessment college is concerned. The people at ABET
feel that its too much trouble to record which colleges offer EE
degrees partially by distance means (every ABET EE degree
currently requires on-site lab work so there is no totally
distance ABET BSEE). It is, therefore, impossible to be sure, but
UND seems to be the ONLY college to currently offer mostly
distance ABET BSEEs.



Best regards (to all),
Richard Kanarek

 

ET/EET/BSEE

Richard,
Thanks for your response. Your philosophical analogy was well taken. For your info. TESC is not ABET accredited, the Middle States Association of Colleges accredits them. Upon receiving my eval. from TESC, I'll pursue their electronics option (BSAST). Looking at the abreveation after your name in the initial thread, I take it that you're a certified electronics Tech. If not -- and you don't mind I asking, what do you do?

 

Another ABET program to consider is The BSET in Mechanical Engineering Technology at: http://www.odu.edu/ao/vstream/degree_programs.htm

Now, mind you, this program only covers the upper level courses. You would have to either A: take course at ODU or a Virginia/NC comm college or B: transfer lower level work completed somewhere else. The residential requirement would be the upper level work so, I don't think they would have a problem with transferring a majority of the lower level coursework.

Richard, is right on the engineering compared to engineering technology programs. It's like comparing apples to oranges (they are both a type of fruit though <g>). If you still want to be a "technician" (ie. trouble-shoot and fix stuff), but you want to be more than just a technician (ie. actually use theory to solve complex problems, failure analysis, reverse engineering, etc.).... then an engineering technology degree would probably fit better in your career. If you dig sitting on your butt in the cubical and design stuff or manage lower level engineers/technologists, then maybe an engineering degree is what you want.

If you choose eng tech or engineering I will tell you this... JOBS in electronics are really rare these days! I lasted through this round of layoffs at my company, however, I don't know if I will last much longer! I have been to headhunters and been submitting my resume to numerous companies and I am getting limited opportunities. Maybe we all should ditch the engineering ideas and pursue degrees in human resources or something of that nature!

Best Regards,
Bill

 

ET/EET/BSEE

Bill,
I'm reposting my reply. I did not see it in the forum.


As always, thanks for the feedback Bill. I've been involved in electrical & electronics installation/troubleshooting for a number of years. My present education comprises: City & Guilds of London -- Electrical & Electronics Engineering Technician's diploma; Electrical & Electronics Engineering Technician certificates; Electrical Installation diploma; & electrical license. All foreign credentials, being evaluated by TESC. They are all over 13 yr. old. Their course work is similar in content to the courses offered in the EET, ET, and BSAST…. (Technology degrees) etc. Hence the reason why, I'm 'tinkering' with the BSEE offered at UND, in the future. But, my main objective is to complete a BS degree, in which I can CLEP or Portfolio out of a number of credits, given my background, & pursue a MBA. Therefore, the BSEE is not a priority. For the last 5 yr. I've changed fields to Telecommunications, presently I'm one of those 'cubicle' engineers, I don't manage a group, I just design networks.


As I become more involved in the forum, I'm been enlightened about various DL programs. My main concern with TESC is, they don't give GPA for CLEP & other exams, like Excelsior does. I'll have to check with graduate program to see if that will 'pose' any problems.

As far as the market for electronics Technologist, I know it getting very hard due to bulk manufacturing & miniaturization. The troubleshooter will soon be obsolete….., but, they'll always need installers & field engineers. Anyway, I hope TESC gives me a generous amount of credits.

Glenn

As always feedback is welcome from every one.

 

Glenn,

While not having as much experience as you, I too have been in electronics for a couple of years. I worked component level avionics for five years and have been working as a field service engineer for the last two years in the semiconductor industry.

Now, I don't know if the "trouble-shooter" will ever be extinct. With that said, with modular designs, redundent circuitry, and that other stuff that makes a technician's job all the easier, I can see the trouble-shooters role being reduced to a mere labor. I just know that equipment is made by man and it WILL fail. When that operator/tech can't figure out why something is not working, they will need someone with expertise in that equipment to come fix it.

You would think the field engineers would be a position that would always be need. However, with the economy the way it is, I think companies (customers) will find ways to NOT depend on vendor support. For example, the customer I work at has been attempting to train all their operators to become level 3 certified techs. A sort of "all in one" philosphy. They have asked if we can train them (OJT) and recommend when they are ready for certification. A lot of vendors don't want to train them because they are trying to get in the position that vendor support is not necessary! We are literally digging our own graves! Another example is a company I had an interview with recently. The interviewer bragged on how they supported them selves w/o vendor support for their tools. He said that they took the vendor training, became proficient with their equipment and told the field support to go screw!

I think the engineering technologist will be a very valuable trade in the future. Companies will want a hybrid of the engineer and technician. They will be hands-on and know how to use testing equipment and read schematics. However, unlike technicians, they will be fluent in electrical theory and analysis (super-techs if you will). They may not be too keen on pure theory and design, however, there are SO many different positions in engineering that require actual hands-on equipment that are already designed. They will need an engineering technologist to figure out why their equipment "uptime" (or lack of) is crippling their production (be educated enough to understand what percentage of availability is a minimum standard and be fluent enough on the equipment to understand what it needs [PM's,retrofits,corrective mainentance, etc.]). I think the technologist would save companies money putting them in positions (where originaly had engineers that needed additional training to become familar with maintenance) that had qualities of engineering and hands-on technical work.

Best Regards,
Bill

 

You know, with all that crap said in my last post. I can see a BSEE grad with former technician experience would be ideal. The reason that this is not common, I think, is because the formal training required to become a technician does not fit into the BSEE curriculum. Who wants to go back to school and start all over again when you can take your technical diploma or degree and apply for transfer to a 4 yr. degree?

If you look at both an ET curriculum and an E (engineering) curriculum, they are not very similar:

The first two years of an engineering degree comprises of math and natural science. An engineering technology degree jumps straight into electronics courses. The junior and senior level courses in an engineering degree start concentrating on the electrical part of the degree. An engineering technology degree's last two years consists of theoretical part of the degree (thermodynamics, circuit analysis, blah blah blah). It's 300 and 400 level courses contain the material BSE's learn in their freshman/sophmore years. Now I'm sure there are programs that vary, but thats the impression I get when comparing the two degrees.

Best Regards,
Bill

 

Richard,

I am sorry I didn't give you any courses in electronics.

The upper level engineering technology course work required for the BSET at ODU can be taken as a non-degree student, provided you have met the prerequisites of the course (which is usually coverage of differential and integral equations).

http://www.odu.edu/dl/navycollege/bset.html

There are courses like fundamentals of electrical tech, communications principles, and programable machine controllers. They also have MET classes like thermodynamics, funds of mechanics, fluid dynamics, etc. Lastly, they have a few classes in engineering management.

These courses (and 2 lab courses) are available via cdrom. I believe some of them are available through videostreaming (and teletechnet if you live in the virginia/carolinas).

As far as calculus is concerned (if you havn't taken calc yet..):

http://www.grad.usda.gov/Catalog/
(put correspondence program for training center and click search)

Grad school/USDA has correspondence courses for differential and integral calculus (each ACE recommended for 2 credits)

Both costs $205 and the book required is fairly expensive (around 100 bucks?) however, I saw the book sold on amazon for 67!

I am not sure if these courses would be accepted anywhere (I am going to ask if this would be accepted), but if it is, it's fairly cheap..

Best Regards,
Bill

 

Hi Guys,

I’m sorry I couldn’t reply earlier.

Glen,

I’ve looked at the TESC BSAST, but feel that Excelsior’s programs would better suit my needs. Although, their BA’s in CS, Math or Physics do appeal to me.

Richard,

I haven’t extensively researched this option, but Excelsior’s DistanceLearn database does list tuition of $375 per class. This could be incorrect. I personally would prefer to take all my classes from U.S schools, as I think this would cause less confusion and red tape. But, this is still an option for me.

Bill,

I would prefer a BSEE or BSME, but ODU’s BSET does sound interesting. Its subject matter would fit well with my current job as a Software Test Engineer. The software I test is used in Plant Process and Instrumentation design. The BSET links you provide point to the Navy College program. Is the particular BSET program you mention restricted to Navy/Marine Corp personnel, or is it open to the general public?

At this point in my career I have to decide on which path to take. Automated Software Testing (i.e. writing programs to test other programs) for which Excelsior’s BSCIS would be my best option if I choose to go this route, especially since I need just one MS exam to reclaim my MCSE. The other path I could take is to become somewhat of a Subject Matter expert. A BSEE or ODU’s BSET would be a better option for this route. This would probably open my options from strictly Software QA/Testing to Hardware/Software Testing, or to Product Management in Software Development.

As you can see I have a few decisions to make.

Regards,

Jim

 

No it is not restricted to Corps or Navy. However, you will need to find a source of lower level engineering credit to cover the first two years of the program (all that is available via cdrom is the upperlevel engineer/engineer management/labwork).

Here is the url for the BSGET w/o the Navy College Program:

http://www.et.odu.edu/get.html

I think (not sure) that if you have any technical MOS/MOS school training from the military (that is ACE evaluated) you may be able to satisfy the technical base on the NCP BSET. If not, then I'm sure an AAS/AS in a technical discipline will have transferable credit. This program seems to be pretty flexible when it comes to the lower level requirements.

Email Dr Robert Curry (his email is on the NCP BSET program webpage) and ask if he could give you a ballpark idea on what will transfer. He was very helpful to me.

Best Regards,
Bill

 

Greetings all!

Wow, look at all the replies my wee little thread has
attracted! And almost all (somewhat) off topic! <g>

Lets see if I can catch up:
Bill:
Thanks for the link to ODU
(http://www.odu.edu/ao/vstream/degree_programs.htm).
Also, thanks for the link to the USDA's distance
learning courses
(http://www.grad.usda.gov/Catalog/). Although I
greatly appreciate the link, your description of
their calculus course(s) doesn't seem all that
appealing. They are hardly excessively cheap.
Presumably they are of high quality, as the USDA
certainly isn't wasting its time insuring the
quality of our food. <g>
As chance would have it, I just completed an
unaccredited Beginning Calculus I course, and I
intend to take/complete the follow-up Calculus II
course. I will then attempt to obtain RA credit by
testing or other means. Thanks just the same!

"glennmari":
ABET accreditation is always in addition to regional
accreditation, hence TESC's (www.tesc.edu)
accreditation by Middle States Association of
Colleges would not preclude their accreditation by
ABET. (I think the technical term for ABET -- or at
least the term that can be used in a family forum
such as this one <g> -- is "professional"
accreditor, but I could easily be mistaken.) You
appear to be quite correct, however, as ABET doesn't
list TESC as being accredited by them
(http://www.abet.org/accredited_programs/TACWebsite.html).
I should have warned you that I am not nearly as
sharp as some of the other members on this BBS, and
that you ought to read my pearls of wisdom with
care. <g>
You might recall that you asked what I did for a
living. Quite simply nothing. I used to be an
Electronics Technician of some worth, if you'll
pardon my saying so. About a decade ago, I became
employed by a quasi-federal (USA) agency as an
"Electronics Technician." I have yet to do anything
legitimately electronic, nor do I expect to again
until I manage to secure my emancipation and my
restitution to productive society. Pray for me. <g>
BTW, I read your description of your qualifications,
and I am duly jealous. It seems the more my
abilities atrophy, the more I am paid, and the more
I forget, the more college credits I gather. Good
luck to you!

If I failed to reply to anyone, please understand that
no offense was meant!

Cordially,
Richard Kanarek

 

Sources/ET/EET/EE_RA

Hi to all,

Bill,

Your points were well taken, good luck with your future endeavors. Keep me posted as you go forward.

Richard,

Sorry I did'nt include any links in my previous post, as you indicated in the initial thread. Going forward I'll make sure I do. The topics may be a little off, but, I'm getting the most feedback here, no offence meant. Good luck in your emancipation attempt from your current job, I'll keep you in my pray.

Let's get down to business!

I've been trying to obtain a copy of the syllabus (City & Guilds of London Electrical & Electronics Engineering Technicians, part 1,2, & 3) from C&Guilds http://www.dit.ie/eng/csee/cou...
for the past 3 mths to no avail. Any help/suggestion from you or fellow forum members will be greatly appreciated. I've had the diplomas evaluated by AACRAO http://www.aacrao.com their eval stated the part 3 yields ULD (yr. 3 & 4) credits in a US college. But, I belive a course by course description will be very helpful to me. I'm awaiting my eval from TESC, I hope they have a copy in their repository. Any/All feedback is welcome.

Jim,

The BSEE option will clearly put you ahead of the field, check this link
http://www.conted.und.edu/dist_engr/
To all: Keep me posted.

 

EE/EET/ET

Jim,
Ignore my previous post to you. I was reviewing the thread, I see where you are aware of UND.