My professor has a degree mill

I just registered into an online graduate course at a RA University, and I was very shocked to see in the outline the credentials of the instructor with a M.Ed from Columbia Pacific University (San Rafael California) and a PhD with no university source. The instructor has just been hired and I don’t know if the chair knows about her credentials. So the question here is what to do, should I drop out from the course since I have no more confidence about the knowledge of the instructor? Should I inform the chair about this ? I don’t want to cause harm to anyone, but I was very annoyed to see someone with a degree from Columbia Pacific teaching a university level course in education. Help please.

 

I think you could without vindictiveness indicate that you are concerned as someone who has paid to take a course that the instructor is teaching a graduate level course with a graduate degree from a school which was ordered closed. This of course is providing his PhD is also unaccredited. I am concerned that the source is not listed. It may just be that someone slipped up and hired the guy as an adjunct without checking. You are paying for a course at an RA school and it should be from faculty with some sort of GAAP credential at the level you are taking the course at. This is not *outing* it is a consumer issue.

North

 

I agree with North, but do keep us posted.

 

I would do both: drop the course and make sure that everyone at the school knows why. You are paying for an RA graduate course, but you aren't getting instruction from someone with RA graduate credentials. This could very well become an issue if you ever want or need to transfer the course to another RA school, since often they will want to know the credentials of the course's instructor before granting transfer credit. In fact, if your school attempts to charge you a fee or penalty for dropping the course, you should protest very, very loudly about it. However, I imagine that they aren't aware of the situation and will appreciate that you brought it to their attention.

 

I agree with everyone else so far....drop the course and let the department chair know why. Also, accept nothing less than a full refund, and make a big issue of your reason for dropping the course if they refuse. If they still refuse a full refund, let the RA agency know why you're less than satisfied with the school.


Bruce

 

I find this thread troubling.

If Mr. Valve finds himself unable to continue on with the class because it is being taught by somebody he doesn't respect, then he probably should withdraw. If he wants to make his reservations known to the university, that's certainly his right.

But addressing the general tone of this thread, I have to say that if the intent here extends to getting people fired and to destroying careers, then I want no part of it.

In its heyday, Columbia Pacific was one of the best of the CA-approved schools. In the Bay Area where I live, it actually had a pretty good reputation. CPU graduates are teaching a good many places today.

I like some of the CA-approved schools, and the idea of burning their graduates at the stake as witches scares me.

I would ask that people try to be thoughtful, discreet and humane here.

 

Wouldn't the RA people have something to say about the issue regardless?

Darren.

 

Possibly, but the original poster expressed a desire to not harm anyone, so there's no need to let the RA agency know unless the school wants to play hardball about a full refund.


Bruce

 

I don't see that at all. If the department chair is aware of CPU's status, then telling him about it certainly isn't going to matter. If he/she isn't aware of it but doesn't care, once again it won't change things. But....if the chair is not aware of CPU's status and does care, wouldn't you be doing a service to the school by pointing out the obvious?

I find it very hard to sympathize with people who publicize fake, questionable, or simply unaccredited degrees, and then cry foul when it's pointed out that their degrees are fake, questionable, or simply unaccredited. To me, that's tantamount to admitting that they're trying to pass off their degrees as legitimately accredited. Why would they care otherwise??


Bruce

 

This approach cannot be right!

I find this thread quite distasteful. Some of the approaches suggested cannot be right. What if the person concerned earned his/her degree before the institution closed/went into decline? What if s/he earned the degree at a time when the institution was more than legitimate and was state-approved? What if this operson actually did some good, hard work to earn the MEd? Because the institution has been closed does not, per se, negate this individual's earned degree. Only this weekend the UK education press is full of stories about Luton University more or less being put on probation by the government quality agencies. This status does not negate every adcademic department nor does it negate the hard work of many Luton students/graduates. Even if the institution is closed by the government agencies in due course, this does not mean that I should go around debunking all those who have previously earned a Luton degree.

The person with the MEd may be a very good teacher and know his/her stuff!

I was watching a TV programme the other evening about Patrick Moore (now Sir Patrick Moore). He is regarded as one of the world's leading atronomers. He has had one of the longest running television series on astronomy for the masses ever televised. Now in his late 70s, I think, he still has his TV show. He speaks at major UK universities. He never went to school nor university! He is completely self-taught. Would we want to 'rubbish' him because he doesn't have a degree and insist he does not appear on Tv or speak at universities? Personally, I would not. It is society as a whole that needs to look at itself and consider why it is requiring people to have endless credentials after their names. Credentials do not make a person a good teacher.

If the teacher has deliberately mis-led the college authorities about his/her qualifications then that is another matter but, as far as I can tell, there is no evidence of this and to start 'stirring the pot', and potentially ruining a person's career, is dangerous.

'telfax'

 

It's interesting that Sir Patrick never had to document his expertise by getting a diploma of any sort. In this respect, he's different from the graduates of unaccredited schools discussed in this forum.

 

What do we mean by document?

Gert:

In many ways he did 'document' his expertise! His pearances on television testify to his expertise. When intrerviewed by other experts , or when is Tv discussions, he 'holds his own, with the best! He has written many books and so on and so on..... . I think we have to become far more liberal. Perhaps it's my age! All I see, both in the US and the UK, is the creation of administrative educational bureaucracy that seem to have little to do with learning. It's all about process and systerms rather than a focus on learning outcomes. I could go on....but won't!


'telfax'

 

Re: What do we mean by document?

I agree with you. My point was that he didn't need a diploma to establish his expertise.

 

Re: This approach cannot be right!

I see no connection between your complaints and example and what has been suggested in this thread. It seems that you're painting this situation as a personal issue. I believe that it is a simple matter of accepting the truth and reality of the situation.

When a person teaches for an RA school the student has every right to expect the teacher to be trained to the proper level by an RA school or the equivalent. If a student finds that this is not the case then, said student has every right to demand a refund.

Proper level in this context means that teacher is at least one level above the class. For example, an undergraduate class must be taught by a graduate with an RA bachelor degree. It is okay if they have a masters from an unaccredited school.

 

Re: Re: This approach cannot be right!

A great many people with state-approved degrees teach at the university level. Here in California, they are attorneys and clinical psychologists.

The FAA's Flight Test Pilot/Engineer classes are taught at National Test Pilot School, a CA-approved institution. NASA Langley contracted with NTPS to teach 'Piloted Handling Qualities Assessment Techniques' for NASA. NTPS heads up the First Flight Readiness Review Team for Lockheed Martin and Korean Aerospace's T-50 supersonic jet trainer program. The Canadian Defense Forces and the Australian RAAF send personnel to be trained by NTPS. The Naval Academy at Annapolis lectures on a NTPS method for minimizing global positioning system errors. US military special operations manuals refer personnel to NTPS for training. NTPS is a member of the Australian 'Defense Teaming Centre'. NTPS is one of only five test pilot schools worldwide recognized by the Society of Experimental Test Pilots, and is the only civilian school on the list. I could go on...

These guys roll out an M.S. program in Flight Test and Evaluation, and our Degreeinfo yahoos threaten to try to hound its graduates out of any position they might hold?

Cover your butts, assholes. This CA-approved school has a 30-plane airforce, including supersonic jets. They just got done testing Leigh Aerosystems' 'Longshot' guidance package to "educate" dumb iron bombs and make them smart. These bombs only have CA-approved educations and may not be smart enough to teach rarified RA classes, but they make great suppositories.

 

RFValve

Columbia Pacific is dead but the controversy continues. The success of Columbia Pacific graduates is legendary. A search turned up over 1200 hits with about half? seeming to be people in responsible positions with CPU degrees.

CPU was the most successful and best respected unaccredited CA approved schools and perhaps that is why it was selected to die.

I would suggest that the administration of the school is fully aware of the instructor's qualifications and accepts them as such. An endless stream of academic staff at RA universities have Columbia Pacific degrees, however, probably at a level above minimum qualifications for the position or with a higher accredited degree.

Hold your nose and take the course. You probably won't make any friends doing otherwise.

Either CPU was very adept at choosing candidates who were already in responsible positions or they actually did teach them something. If universities were ranked based on student outcomes CPU certainly wouldn't be lacking.

 

RFVALVE,

The North Central Association's "General Institutional Requirements" , notes in regard to RA schools' hiring of faculty the following:

"It employs a faculty that has earned from accredited institutions the degrees appropriate to the level of instruction offered by the institution".

This provision, provides significant room for RA schools to manuver in terms of the criteria used to hire faculty. Notice that it does not state that the faculty degree must be from a "RA "accredited" insitution.

In addition, it states that the degree should be "appropriate to the level of instructon" which can also imply that a faculty member with a masters degree from CPU may qualify to teach specific courses.

In fact, as long as the RA school has a specified number of RA doctorates on their staff, they can hire additional faculty with state approved degrees or possibly from less respected institutions.

http://www.ncacihe.org/resources/policies/edinstia.html#1c



In terms of your dilemma, consider the following:

1) If you feel uncomfortable with the educational background of this faculty member then ONLY you can decide whether it meets your needs and expectations.

2) It may be in your interest to determine where this individual obtained their doctorate. If from a less than credible institution then this may provide you with additional data to base your final decision.

3) Contrary to what some posters may advise you that it does'nt matter who teaches this course, this is incorrect. One never knows when their credentials may be carefully reviewed and this is especially true for DL programs where legitimacy of faculty is of primary importance. If one is in a doctoral program it is even more essential that faculties educational backgrounds be unquestionable.

Remember, that DL learning is still in its infancy and it is important for the administrative officers of these institutions to provide their students with the high level of assurance that their degrees and coursework will be accepted without question by future employers, schools or licensure agencies.

4) If after considering these factors you cannot accept the level of this indivdual's educational background than it is definitely withiin your rights to speak witht the administrative staff regarding your perspective and expectations.

It is not a matter of having this indivdual terminated but your right to have your needs and expectations met especially in light of the fact that you are attending a RA educational institution.

It is also not a popularity contest in terms of "stepping on others toes". If one does not assert what is in their best interests, they can potentially run into a sitution where questions may arise re: the credibility or substance of one's credentials.

 

Re: Re: This approach cannot be right!

I disagree. The student has every right to expect an educated and effective teacher. Some instructors with a CA approved degree may well be more effective than the RA instructor. What a student definitely does have a right to, is not to be caught in an accrediting situation. To sum it up: If it is okay with the school and the RA body, and the teacher is effective, it should be okay with the student. There may even be a few rare examples of highly effective instructors with no degree.

With my edited premise of the student, I agree with you.

This is true as far as standard procedure. There are always exceptions.

Tony

 

Oh yeah, I almost forgot.

I had a teacher who had a BS and MBA from PW, a lot of real world experience, and a totally unaccredited PhD. He no longer works at this school and has been replaced with an instructor with a RA doctorate. While I find him as effective in his own style, I fear my classmates are planning a lynching or something similiar.

The best,

Tony

 

no more witchhunting and lynching!

Do not engage in witchhunting! Or, like Monthy Python said: "You can not take back the Spanish Inquisation"

adelheid