When the GRE's go away...

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by David H. Wilson, Jun 30, 2002.

Loading...
  1. David H. Wilson

    David H. Wilson New Member

    What are the best sources of upper level credits?

    Dave

    KC7WGB
     
  2. Orson

    Orson New Member

    Clarify, please...

    What filed of study?
    Any?

    Any limitations (e.g., Excelsior?
    local college)?

    --Orson
     
  3. RKanarek

    RKanarek Member

    The GREs are going away? All of them?


    Cordially,
    Richard Kanarek
     
  4. David H. Wilson

    David H. Wilson New Member

    not so far...

    Dave

    KC7WGB
     
  5. David H. Wilson

    David H. Wilson New Member

    Re: Clarify, please...

    OK I'll pick: I'm a Literature in English guy.

    Currently, and till I get my degree,

    I go (?) to Excelsior

    Yes, Orson any help would be appreciated, Thank You!!

    Dave

    KC7WGB
     
  6. Orson

    Orson New Member

    Here goes...!

    Dear Dave—

    OK.
    Part of the challenge of external degree learning is the research and formulating a useful reading list that prepares oneself for the exam…I consider it one of its self-satisfying virtues, a life-lesson that spoon-fed course-taking just doesn’t cultivate!
    Therefore, consider it a challenge, one worth taking pride in to meet one’s goals!

    Any upper division course credit…so—from impossible to “easily do-able” (for me at least)-- here goes:

    It’s a shame that Excelsior doesn’t offer upper division credit for several CLEP tests that often used to be: Am lit and Eng lit, Management, Marketing, and B-law…I believe COSC does!

    Another option: Athabasca University—the Excelsior College of Canada—has begun offering most of their courses by examination; the $C exchange also makes it attractive; but does Excelsior offer credit for their tests? I don’t know—so somebody,
    please ask?

    Univ. North Carolina—Independent Study credit by exam: requires a self-descriptive letter of ones preparation, etc; I know they are pretty liberal (the prospective grading instructor must approve—a sensible policy, IMHO), but it’s still a hurdle, and I haven’t yet sent my 3-4pages off to them for 5 or 6 prospective courses…

    Ohio Univ. – CCE (Course Credit by Examination): cheap ($157), easy to start. I especially enjoy that they permit you to easily
    know the courses texts thru “Specialty Books…” I took intro Astronomy because it was in the familiar multiple choice format…but few of their upper division courses are tested that way, so if you are not used to essay exams, two lines of advice: outline possible answers in advance to focus one’s study; use Walter Pauk’s advice! His brief (60 pages) “A User’s Guide To College” covers note taking, studying, how to prep for specific exam formats, reviewing, etc.—and he tells you why to follow his advice, why it works—indispensable. (Currently in print is the 460 page “How To Study in College” –-too long, but worth a
    peak, if only for his specialized advice in how to study foreign languages, or math—and more immediately useful is the 160 page “Essential Study Strategies.”)

    I’m doing history and English lit CCE…
    Of the latter, they offer three Shakespeare courses, including the rarely tought history plays…in every case, one can get tapes of the plays from the public library—prep with Xerox copies
    of Masterplots summaries (by Frank N. Magill), also from the library. Then, to prep for the exam questions, read the intro in your textbook to the play, or else Harold Bloom's book on the Bard (he skips only a few plays). (There are also teachco.com tapes on Shakespeare...) Also, I’m going to take the Ohio CCE on English Restoration (1650-1800) lit. Why? One nice text…

    Other related options in Lit.: LSU independent study
    offers 2 semester surveys of Am and Eng. lit with
    only one textbook (and a few novels for the later Am lit),
    for only $211—plus $10 for the course guide.
    U of Tennesee, Univ. of Kentucky are similar,
    but for more moola (up to $400)—plus, LSU does it in just
    a dozen lessons, and two exams. The former is
    important because all the paperwork and preparation
    and writing of essays involved in a lesson takes valuable time.
    Cetaris parebus, shorter is better (than 15, 18, even 30
    lessons! Ugh!)
    LSU also offers nice courses on US and English novels...
    Including a unique one on Civil War literature.

    Other people have had good experiences with BYU,
    Indiana University, Kansas, and University of Iowa Independent
    Study. My only frustration? There used to an Indepedent Study
    course on Mark Twain (3, 4, 9 years back)--I've been unable to locate it, but it would be great fun!

    Now—finally!—DANTES upper division and Excelsior
    exams….

    “Drug and Alcohol Abuse”—there must be a short book/text appropriate to this, but I haven’t found it…besides, I have taken
    this subject for ungraded RA credit already…so I've stopped searching.

    “Rise and Fall of the Soviet Union”
    I read Michael Kort’s textbook, (it’s around 250 pages, in quarto format with fair sized print…easy length), and The Teaching Company’s (teachco.com) course of tapes (12? 14?) by Gary Hamburger ($25-50). The test is difficult; know in advance that
    you won’t get them all right! Too much detail (I got a 62—45 is passing)!

    “The Civil War and Reconstruction”
    Jeffrey Rogers Hummel’s recent text is concise,
    compact at much less than it’s apparent length (440p.), since it
    has lengthy annotated biographies to each chapter. The Teaching Company’s tapes are lengthy, 48-one-half hours. I may supplement this with Eric Foner’s Concise ed of Reconstruction—but I’ll not do all this until August or September.

    Another option?
    DANTES Business Law II—Barron’s "Business Law” by Emerson
    is said by an amazon.com reviewer to be suitable for CLEP intro (in 120-150 pages or so out of 500), and the DANTES upper div course in 200 some pages…. It closely follows the topics/outline, which means it’s a promising text to me…

    Excelsior UD Exams:
    The common consensus is that the multiple choice exams are the fastest, easiest to prepare for—remember, they only require recall memory, the answers are there if you can follow the prompts and avoid the distractor answers…

    “World Population” is said (elsewhere on degreeinfo.com) to be the easiest. Since I’ve read widely on this andother environmental topics, and the sample exam makes it look easily do-able, so I’m doing it! One can get the text for a mere $10 from half.com, study the text selectively (and skim as needed), as advised elsewhere….

    “Ethics: Theory and Practice”
    Again, I’ve read widely on the subject, and I did well on the
    sample—an since it looks like an UD version of the DANTES,
    I’m taking it too! Since I’m loath to take an exam cold (Lawrie Miller style—I hope that’s not a slur!), I’m going to spend a few days reading HarperCollins College Outline “Ethics,” by McInerney
    —it’s only 200 pages of fast reading primer!

    “Abnormal Psychology”
    Last fall I sat for the Psych GRE—and bombed!
    I know I know several parts of this subject well, but it was a setback…. “Knowing” isn’t the same as recall recognition…
    The textbook is quite lucid but lengthy. But the text’s Study Guide is even better! Concise, fast—some may only need this! In my self-doubts, however, I’m going to instead review using the fast reading HarperCollins College Outline “Abnormal Psychology,” by Costello. It comes recommended, and follows the needed topics rather well. I may read half, then try the sample test..then decide if I need to review with the recommended text's Study Guide or not…!

    “History of Nazi Germany”
    The study guide is quite thorough; the texts are good and on certain topic, one will , too. But most of it can be prepared for—assuming one is a good essay test writer—by studying Klaus P. Fischer’s book…“Nazi Germany: A New History”—a thorough intellectual history. Study this text, then use the Excelsior Study Guide to prepare oneself—know the outlines of an answer, know the examples for one’s theses–above all else, know the thesis statements one can best defend! The Teaching Company has a brief set of lecture tapes…ALSO, remember that Teachco.com also provides wonderful lecture notes on outline form…can make studying much faster and easier than going without their help or contriving ones own!

    Well Dave—now it’s your turn to get on top of your planning…
    Best of luck!

    --Orson
     
  7. RKanarek

    RKanarek Member

    Orson:
    Fantastic Post, thanks!

    Mr. Wilson:
    If the GREs aren't going away, what was the meaning of this thread's subject line?


    Cordially,
    Richard Kanarek
     
  8. David H. Wilson

    David H. Wilson New Member

    At the RATE they ARE going away, they WILL GO AWAY. Sorry if it was alarming!

    Orson, your post is fantastic. I will copy it. I will study it. It has moved me beyond John Bear's little book.

    I Thank You Again

    Dave

    KC7WGB
     
  9. Orson

    Orson New Member

    ADDENDUM to "The Civil War…"

    Thanks all above--it's my pleasure to help...

    ADDENDUM:
    My above recommendation of Hummel’s text for preparing for the DANTES exam must be amended.

    Hummel goes into all sorts of historiographical issues raised in the 90s. Now, as a history major, these are of interest to me, but they are assuredly NOT tested. (One of the pluses and minuses of
    external learning and gaining credit via testing is that older texts are no obstacle...In fact, a newer text like Hummel's can be a hindrance!)

    For those of you who do not care, or find these details distracting, let me suggest Bruce Catton’s The Civil War. From the mid-80s, it too is a briefer treatment (380p.) than James McPherson’s 700 page Battle Cry of Freedom (which reads wonderfully and expansively on many more topics than needed); it too is in a larger print format (and thus shorter).

    Unless you are a Civil War buff, Teachco.com’s lengthy and detailed lectures are also unlikely to be necessary. Ken Burn’s
    PBS series, “The Civil War,” available for free at your local public library-–in a dozen or so hours-–is briefer and of course quite visual.
    The learner unexposed to the civil war may want to use it as either introduction, or else to review or outline their textbook in preparation for sitting the exam. However, with the Reconstruction period so large a component, you may still want to read into Eric Foner’s concise ed of Reconstruction, "A Short History of Reconstruction, 1863-1877"
    [ABRIDGED version of Reconsrtuction] by Eric Foner, 320 pages (1990).
    But those just looking to pass with a 'C' may want to forego it; one could simply read the relevant chapters on Reconstruction in Battle Cry of Freedom instead...

    Perhaps others will volunteer to help with other upper division credit tests I haven't covered?

    All the best.

    --Orson
     
  10. Orson

    Orson New Member

    and a PS...

    More corrective detail to the above:

    The full DANTES exam title it "Civil War and Reconstruction."
    However only a mere 13% is on the Reconstruction period (1865-77). Therefore, almost everyone can safely skip even Foner's
    abridged version of Reconstruction!

    In place of it, just read a chapter (Yes, there's almost always one!) in a full length textbook, i.e., 20-30 pages (Often they are two volumes in paper). Bernard Bailyn's "The Great Republic" is my favorite, but there are many others from Arthur Schlesinger to Alan Brinkley (yes--sone of David to those old enough to care),
    on down.

    --Orson
     
  11. irat

    irat New Member

    Orson, great post!!!!!

    Orson, that was a super post!!!! Great work!
    All the best!
     
  12. Orson

    Orson New Member

    Further ABOUT UPPER Division CORRESPONDENCE COURSES

    In studies of traditional students, the capacity to get
    “busy work” done ranks high in doing well. One suspects this is even more important for correspondence students since self-motivation, and self-organization play essential roles in getting-the-work done.

    BYU correspondence, for instance, includes a scheduling form
    for completing reading assignments, submitting lessons, and taking exams.

    Thus, my preference for courses with the fewest lessons…
    This means fewer rounds of preparation and submission.
    (Exceptions? Some courses, often in science fields, use many
    self-tests or brief quizes. BYU uses this in the study of the
    Bible too. These may be a single tear sheet out of 20 or so.)

    But most upper division liberal arts correspondence courses include a series of essays, from a paragraph to a page or so in length, for three to five questions in each lesson assignment. If your course has 30 lessons, that means you’ll be writing a short book before you finish! Obvioulsy, this is a barrier in meeting efficient degree completion goals. Even if one writes fewer but longer lesson-essays, I argue that this is a more efficient degree-completion time investment because it requires fewer periods of focusing, and thus fewer periods to time manage one’s efforts.

    Perhaps the WORST offender in this regard is University of Idaho
    Correspondence Study. Most have 19 lessons—many, including all
    the history courses have FOUR exams! AS daunting as the 19 lessons are, where most, like BYU, simply have a final exam, U of I HAS FOUR!!! Just the doubling of exams adds at least ten days to course completion!
    Inevitably these are daunting obstacles, and I can’t imagine any but the weakest student “enjoying” the frequent feedback (i.e., each is an opportunity to demonstrate improvement!) But such a student isalso least likely to enjoy the Credit By Exam route of the Excelsior/
    TECEP/COSC kind, anyway.

    At the other end of the spectrum is LSU, with very affordable 12 lesson courses, and Southwest Texas State University’s Correspondence Study program, at San Marcos. Let me explain the latter in some detail

    SWTSU has RA courses in a wide variety of fields, 17 in all, including Dance (actually, it’s “intro to the arts”)! But upper division offeringsare naturally more limited. Nearly all require just one text-book—appropriate exceptions are English courses on the British and American novel; most require about 10 lessons and a final exam. Tuition is also quite miserly at $214 for 3 credits (which includes $25 for admin. processing).

    Now let me summarize their neglected and out of the way Udiv offerings:

    SUBJECT / # of UP. DIV. Courses / # of LESSONS / # of EXAMS

    English 6 2 to 7 1 or 2
    History 3 usually 10 2
    Psychology 4 4 to 11 1 or 2
    Politics 2 4 to 6 0 or 2
    Sociology 2 10 2

    SO those of you looking to speed their way to complete their degrees quickly, SWTSU offers very agreeable options; may it find you in their midsts!

    Personally, in history, I find their western civ (lower division, natch) courses (I and II) to be the most commendable. They use the best of the “brief” editions in the field: “Western Civilization: Brief Edition,”by Perry (Vols I and II, 296 and 400 pages respectively). These are the only texts!
    (Note: both are also suitable for preparing for the CLEP exams in the subject: use with REA’s “European History Builder--” which uses summaries and multiple choice quizes-- to check one’s self-study. But now,of course, there is no possibility of gaining credit with grade via CLEP exams; hence, here’s an almost painless alternative to achieve the same!)

    If one is so inclined, the full length texts—and, mind you, I own and use all of these books, both Brief and full length editions (e.g., double columns! from which the “Brief” edition with single column and larger print is drawn)—are used in the Western Civ correspondence courses offered by University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill:“Western Civilization: Ideas, Politics, Society” by Perry, Chase, von Laue, Jacob and Jacob.

    To my mind, this series is the best one on Western Civ because of its balanced
    treatment of topics, as well as for the clarity and concision desired by students.

    --Orson

    PS Irat: thanks; do know that your encouraging, optimistic closing
    in your posts are
    "All the best!"--at least with me--warmly infectious
     
  13. irat

    irat New Member

    I guess the gre is not going away

    I guess despite the title of this thread, the GRE is not going away?
    All the best!
     
  14. Orson

    Orson New Member

    Re TESC exams...

    Another source or resource for upper division credit is the
    Thomas Edison State College Examination Program

    A fairly wide range of choices....what to comment on?

    Psych:
    Psychology of Personality
    Jerry Burger's texbook covers all the topics nicely and is rather much briefer than its almost 500 pages would suggest.

    Social Psychology
    There are a couple of shorter books on the field (250-350 quarto sized) out there (but may be out of print: use abebooks.com to get, if needed), but I have yet to examine them.

    Literature in English

    Shakespeare I
    This asks you to study at least 8 plays.
    Judging by the sample exam, in the second ID section they are looking for turning points or climaxes of plays; how to find them?

    Go to Masterplots (Magill). In 1998, a Shakespeare volume of Masterplots came out with useful essays. These will help you to find the most famous sections of the play.

    A very useful reference work (available in university libraries) is
    "Longman Guide to Shakespeare Quotations" (1985).
    This gives famous quotations from Shakespeare's plays, situating each in chronological order, explains archaic usages, and--in short--gives you a condensed version of the play! In other words it's shorter than the play itself (average length 20 quarto pages),
    it's much more substantial than Magill's summaries--a great time saver and prep for watching the plays on video! And FAR better than any of the Cliffs Notes booklets--it gives you the literature instead of commenting endlessly upon it!

    (If English is your concentration and you are thinking of more than one Shakespeare course, buying the book--used, out of print, but available for $30--is the smart thing to do. Otherwise, photocopies will do.)

    The first part of the TESCEP exam is of ID's--you'll pick these up as you study. The third part consists of brief 150 word essays (3 out of 9 choices). This is challenging. It demands concision, editorial skill, even precision.

    To gauge by the samples, they will be on obvious comparative themes in Shakespeare.

    THIS exam ought to be fairly quick to prepare for. And the 3 hours to complete it are very generous. One shouldn't need but less than half of that, even less than one hour, even if one write slowly!

    --Orson
     
  15. Orson

    Orson New Member

    Another DL Upper Division option...

    The Ohio University correspondence (and CCE) course catalog mentions that they will try to make regular courses available to non-trad DL learners provided it is not already offered at a distance (and, I think, is NOT a "readings" course).

    A related albeit different option crops up in the University of Tennessee Independent Study Catalog (online):

    "Directed Readings Courses:  In these courses, the student and instructor contract for certain study assignments on an individual basis. Unlike a standard correspondence course, a directed readings course does not include a pre-printed study guide. The student must confer with the designated instructor before enrolling in a directed readings course.

    "Directed readings may also be arranged for UT college credit courses that are not listed in this catalog, if the course objectives can be achieved in this mode, and if a UT instructor is available to teach the course. Students interested in this option should contact the academic department on campus that offers the course or the Department of Distance Education and Independent Study."

    Comment: this is particularly suitable for the self-directed DL learner--deciding in advance what on wants to study and then finding someone to study it under, in a degree credit bearing situation.

    I wonder if this method works better at Tenn, than at Ohio U? By contrast, this method depends upon making informed contact FIRST with an instructor, and then to the DL people. At least that's an inferrence I took from a failed attempt to go through OhioU: in their printed directions, you check their regular course catalog to see if they offer something appropriate that they do not already offer via DL--they say to submit registration without payment, and then the DL people will try to make the course available DL style. But as I say, this failed once; perhaps taking control (as at Tenn.) from the start works better!

    --Orson
     

Share This Page