Would PhD/DBA would it be considered useless if...

If I went on to get a PhD/DBA would it be considered useless if I did not hold a position that required a PhD/DBA or hold a position that allowed me to use that education? I am currently a technical person (field service engineer) with some management experience but it is limited. I would not want to spent the time and money and end up having to “dumb-down” my resume.
I will be completing my RA BS shortly and plan to complete my MS in 13-16 months. I am just thinking ahead.

 

The "uselessness" of the credential is in your hands. Why would you want to go through all that work and be satified to sit in a job that does not give you the satisfaction of contributing on your level of expertise???

FWIT, I believe it is useless if you do nothing with it. It's kind of like taking the hogs to market in a cadillac. Do you really need to do this???

Good luck in your future studies.

Dick

 

I'd keep my eyes open and look at the qualifications of others who have the kinds of position that you would like to have in your field.

I know a couple of individuals who decided to stay ABD because they perceived that the work it would take to finish up would not be worth it. Then again, their goals had changed after working in the field -- your assessment and your final decision may be different.

 

If you finish a program ABD, could you complete the dissertation at anytime in the future?

 

Most doctorate programs have time limitations. While you would always be ABD, if you wanted to complete the PhD you would have to do it in the time limit (I think 7 years is pretty standard) or you would have to start all over. Different schools have different regulations as to how long you can go in between enrollments and still be considered for the PhD. Good Luck.

 

My opinion is that in business there are very, very few positions requiring a PhD in Business or Management or a DBA. Because the PhD is the academic degree, holders of those degrees generally gravitate toward research and teaching. The DBA, being the professional doctorate, is not in demand, despite the fact that it emphasizes the application of theory in the field.

In some Fortune 500 companies, you might encounter a doctor heading up Organizational Development (more than likely a PhD in Psychology, not Business) or Education & Training (usually an EdD, not a PhD or DBA). R&D docs are most often PhDs in scientic disciplines or ScD engineers. I will admit that the CEO of my former company did hold a DBA from Harvard. By and large, the MBA is still considered the terminal business degree within Corporate America. And from just reading the want ads, you already know that certain management positions do require the MBA (or similar master's degrees such as the MSB, MSM, MS/Finance, etc.) Thus, for most managers, I would not recommend the hassle of attaining a DBA, given the grim prospects for putting it to use.

BUT... on the other hand, if one were at mid-career or later, wished to have the credential for personal satisfaction, were to view it as a further validation of career achievement, and had the time, energy, and money to pursue a DBA, then I would say, "why not?". Thus, I would not rule it out in every conceivable situation.

David April
BA, University of Massachusetts/Amherst
MBA, Boston College
ACM, Boston College
DBA, California Pacific University
CAM, Institute of Certified Managers
CM, Institute of Certified Managers
CRM, Institute of Certified Records Managers

 

I don’t want to start another fight with CCU degrees since we have a lot of supporters of this school in this group. One of the major reasons to get a DBA or PhD is to teach at the university level, it seems that universities put a lot of weight in this qualification at the time of selecting their candidates. If you decide that teaching is your passion, then make sure that the university is RA or GAAP, schools will screen you out if the school is not accredited. The only reason to get a PhD or DBA from a school like CCU is for personal satisfaction or to use it legally if you want to sell yourself as a consultant to general public. The degree of course is legal (Except for Oregon state), but if people find out that is not accredited it can make you more harm than good. General public doesn’t understand the difference between accredited and state approved.

Regards,

 

Hi there:

Like you, I’m a technical person pursuing a DBA in information technology. There is great demand at the moment of professors with business and information technology background, you have to know business but also understand the technical side. Besides teaching and research, there is not much utility of the degree, industry won’t pay you for a DBA or PhD, so if you decide to further your education make sure that it is with a RA or GAAP degree, even unaccredited schools are looking for professors with RA degrees.

Regards,

 

Is any learning useless?

I can see where and why the original question was posted and I think there have been some good responses here. Doing a doctorate though isn't easy for most people. Whether it's a reseach only, or so-called taught professional doctorate, you've got to passionately want to do it. I did my own PhD fairly late on in life and was constantly told I didn't need it. I disagree. I wanted to show I was capable of it and it has opened doors since I achieved it. I have just finished supervising the Director of Personnel of a major international organization that many of you would know if I mentioned it. The lady in question is about 46 years of age and has two masters degrees. She did the PhD for two reasons. She wanted to do some indepth rsearch into how organizations recruit and retaiun and 'indoctrinate' new people recruited to the organization. The organization in question spends approximately $70,000 per person recruited! These are middle to very senior managers/directors. She wanted to know whether this was value for money. So, her work had an impact on the organization and they were prepared to pay her tuition fees. Secondly she hopes to eventually take up an academic appointment teaching in a business school, hopefully in California. She has joint UK-US citizenship.

In compl;eting a doctorate though you learn an aweful lot of new things, especially writing, presentation, analytical and research skills which will be of use to you and the organizations that employ you even if the doctorate itself is not immediately relevant. You view the world differently once you've done the PhD or DBA and that, for me, it sufficient - not just the utility if the degree.

The DBA is a relatively new programme in Europe. The older and first DBA was offered by Henley Management College and its student body comprise very senior managers/directors from all over the world. Of those who make the grade and get the degree, 60 per cent of people, two years after graduating, are found to be involved, to a greater or lesser degree, with an academic institution in some form or other. There is still some stigma attached to the so-called professional doctorates in Britain if you want to get a full-time academic job! They expect a PhD because it's seen as being more 'academic', 'scholarly' and so on! Of course, largely by academics!

I've mentioned this before, but have a look at Glasgow Universioty's new DBA that can be taken by anyone, anywhere in the world, and you can design your own programme format within limits working with your advisors. There is absolutely no residency requirement, other than attending the viva voce (oral) examination at the end of the programme to defend your thesis.

Telfax

 

Re: Is any learning useless?

You have interesting posts Telfax and your perspective adds much to the discussion.

I have to agree with you regarding reasons for pursuing the degree. I am pursuing a doctorate in Christian counseling without much concern over whether it results in a financial benefit or any career utility. It had to be accredited and it had to be in a field I am interested in. I have the luxury of using GI benefits to pay for it, but the degree is purely for me. It is a personal goal to earn an accredited doctorate in a field I am interested in.

I remember in grad school someone from the admissions dept. was relating a story in which he told a husband and wife that if the husband wanted to make money he would major in business not counseling. The husband wanted to major in counseling. The wife heard *money* and said he would apply for the MBA. I don't know what ever happened but it is certainly easier to study something you are interested in.

North

 

North-thank you!

I'm relatively new to all this posting business! You do what I hope I try to do - that's stand back and try to be objective without going 'over the top'. On another thread at the monent, for reasons I cannot explain or understand, I seem to have offended a regular Australian contributor - but he also seems to be getting 'up the nose' of other contributors on the same topic! Hey ho, there we go! That's life!

Thank you for your comments about my postings.

Telfax

 

I would want to try to earn a PhD/DBA simply because I have a desire to learn and I get tuition reimbursement from my job and that will pay a portion of the bill. If I can further my education and someone else will help pay the bill...I say go for it.
I really want to do it, mostly, for personel satisfation. When I finished high school I said, "I will never want to go to college, tech school will work for me." Then 10 years later I started going back to school. Now 5 years have gone by and my wife calls me an "education junkie". I have earned an AA, BS from Cal Coast, I am close to my BS from COSC, and have a MS program selected. I am just looking into the future.
Bottom line - I am not looking to get a salary increase for a doctrine (but it would be nice), don't want to teach, just want to do BUT don't want to be viewed as someone with a doctrine that does not deserve to use the title because I don't apply the education to my job. Hope this makes some sense.

 

Hopes this makes sense!

Not really!

Telfax

 

Did COSC give you any credit for your CCU BS? If so, was it direct credit or portfolio credit?
Thanks.

 

I think that you mean 'doctorate' rather than 'doctrine'. Or maybe not, the latter word certainly fits too.

But yeah, what you say makes perfect sense. It kind of represents my situation too. And more generally, it speaks to the ultimate purpose of adult higher education.

Some ideas:

Are you interested in pursuing a doctorate because you have this burning interest in learning scholarly and technical things about finance or something? Is it a desire to always keep a goal in front of you to strive for? Or is it the *title* that you get with a doctorate that attracts you?

Concerning the title "Dr.", if you don't use the doctorate on the job, you may not want to use the title either. Your co-workers might be put off by it and see it as a bit of arrogance on your part. In fact, my experience is that Ph.D.s rarely call each other "doctor", except perhaps in formal introductions or something. In the sciences it's considered uncool.

Being perceived as *overqualified* might be a problem if you ever want to change jobs. Having education way in excess of your desired job classification might require you to leave the degree off your resume (which technically is not being entirely truthful, I guess).

Frankly, I notice that a number of Degreeinfo paricipants collect degrees, and I wonder how that looks to prospective employers.

If you don't have a vocational plan in mind for a doctoral degree, you probably need some pretty strong scholarly interests to justify earning one. My feeling is that somebody with those kind of interests just knows it. They have a passion for their field, and their home is already cluttered with books. They read constantly. So they are gonna be studying their stuff school or no school.

It's a calling, and graduate school just facilitates it.

Even here, there may be alternative ways of pursuing academic interests at an advanced level without actually doing a complete degree program. Perhaps you could take individual graduate classes or something.

 

BillDayson thank you for your reply, I am happy someone understands.

Ian Anderson, I did not sent my transcipt from CCU to COSC, they said I would not get credit. All of my credits for COSC can from RA schools, military, and CLEP's.

 

When I complete my doctorate and any other I may do in the future I will put it on my office wall, and list it on my resume, and possibly on business cards whether or not it is applicable to my job. There is *NO WAY* that I would use the title "Dr." on the job with my co-workers or those I supervise. At an official function with members of the public I might allow myself to be introduced as "Dr." and then go by first names with anyone I met. I work for a large organization and the culture is that everyone is referred to by their first name. I am a supervisor and even my bosses boss is referred to by his first name.

I remember a group of army Chaplains once laughing about a group of clergy who met together. The civilian clergy were not educated but had obtained doctorates from who knows where and were deliberately calling one another "Dr." in a social setting after the meeting almost as if they just enjoyed hearing themselves called "Dr.". To use TA terminology, they were giving one another *strokes* based on a mutually understood though unspoken rule.

North

 

The company I work for has an internal website where you can edit your personal information (address, etc.). I discovered that there's a dropdown list where you can select your title. I used to be Dr. (along with several thousand others) but I found they also had Chf, Sgt, Ofcr, and Capt in the list. So I changed my title to Capt. I received an ominous email about the change being forwarded for management approval, but that was several months ago. Now all my company correspondence comes with the Capt salutation. And I finally do truly have "the admiration of all." Except for one of my co-workers who insists on calling me "Cappy," which just ain't right...

 

Randell1234,

I'd be interested in hearing your answer to this, pretend I'm the one asking the question.

I currently hold a Bachelors in IT and a Masters in Administration, I am finishing a Graduate Certificate in Project Management (am a PMP) and will have completed several certificates from Stanford including one from their Graduate School of Business. My IT Background includes 20 years in the field and 30+ IT Certifications. I am currently an IT Project Management consultant which is extremely lucrative. I'm thinking about moving into Executive Management and am unsure if a DBA would have a good ROI, or if I am near the end of my education. For this instance, I am not concerned with Academia or becoming a professor.

 

Ha ha! Well, any way you look at it, it is the Mount Everest of education. Climb it if you want, but recognize that not everybody is going to want to hear about it