Alternate Agendas???

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by Myoptimism, May 29, 2002.

Loading...
  1. Myoptimism

    Myoptimism New Member

    I apologize as I know I am showing my ignorance, but this trend of members accusing other members of having an alternate agenda on the most trivial of issues both confuses and irritates me.
    Does this forum have a history of people playing confidence games against one another?
    While browsing through the archives (or whatever you want to call them, non-active posts maybe?) I haven't noted a problem of agendas as much as a problem of perception of them. A few situations, sure, but for the most part.............come on.

    Anyway.........just a little tired at the moment.
    Tony
     
  2. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

    Well, I can't speak for everyone else, but I for one do have an alternate agenda. I just can't remember what it is.


    Cheers,
     
  3. Ike

    Ike New Member

    Except for insignificant few that hate US DL schools I don't think that anybody here harbors alternate agendas that are inimical to DL. The accusation leveled by a poster in another thread only shows how some people respond to criticism. Many people simply don't like any criticism of their schools --constructive or otherwise, but no DL school is perfect. Kristin's comment about TUI website is a factual statement and I do not see any subliminal message in it. She has made comments in the past about what she had heard in certain academic circles about Nova Southeastern University. I may not like her comment about Nova but what she said is a verifiable fact. The truth is always bitter.
     
  4. simon

    simon New Member

    Re: Re: Alternate Agendas???

    Ike: "The accusation leveled by a poster in another thread only shows how some people respond to criticism. Many people simply don't like any criticism of their schools--constructive or otherwise, but no DL school is perfect"

    Response: This is a generalization and over simplification of this issue. An individual's response to criticism about their school, such as in this case, may be legitimate and may not simply be a knee jerk reaction or defensiveness. To make a blanket statement that a response to criticism about one's school demonstrates "how some people respond to criticism" is negating others' rights to percieve situations and issues differently from yourself.

    Ike: "Kristin's comment about TUI website is a factual statement and I do not see any subliminal message in it".

    Response: That is your perception and interpretation. No one has discussed this matter as being subliminal, but you. The issue here is not the relevance of her criticism, which is obviously valid, but the overt not subliminal negative inferences she infers regarding this school. Concluding her initial posting with the term "ICH" is not exactly being "subliminal".

    Ike: "She has made comments in the past about what she has heard in certain academic circles about Nova Southeastern University. I may not like her comment about Nova but what she said is a verifiable fact. The truth is always bitter."

    Response: The issue here is that all of us do not perceive and react in unison. However, please keep in mind that what you may perceive or experience as being irrelevant may not be seen in the same manner by the next person and vice versa.

    Furthermore, your statement that "The truth is alway bitter" is again a generalization and actually reflects how you perceive the truth. Many people do not see the truth in this way and in fact feel much more at ease with the truth than with intimations, inferences or "subliminal" messages.
     
  5. defii

    defii New Member

    My Perception!

    I've known posters to be quite passionate about their schools as well as the subjects about which they post. Some of the language does strike me as being a bit aggressive on this one.

    Some time ago, I was sitting in a church listening to a "sermon" by one who was supposed to be a great preacher. Everyone loved it. I did not. But then, I was perhaps the only person in the congregation who had studied the Biblical languages and could spot the flaws in the preacher's interpretation. Preachers judge other preachers somewhat harshly. I think that may be what happened in Kristin's post. She is, as I understand it, heavily involved in web design. With that professional expertise, she effectively shredded just about every element of TUI's website. I saw her post as a technical judgement of the school's website. I did not sense, however, that she meant to disparage the school. If that was her intent, then I would expect that she would deal with matters like accreditation, quality of instruction, quality of dissertations, rigor etc.

    On a side note, perhaps we could all take a lesson or two in presenting the facts without engaging in personal attacks -- or perceiving that facts are meant as personal attacks.
     
  6. Oh, for pete's sake. Simon, if I ever see you with spinach in your teeth, I'll be sure to keep mum.

    My "ick" was directed at the flashing lights animated GIF. In my opinion, it looks cheesy. I'd expect to see it on a kiddie site, not the home page of a university. I did not mean to denigrate the entire school, but to point out some very specific shortcomings in the way it presents information which could give a poor impression.

    A few years ago I consulted with the independent study program of a university to improve the accessibility, usability, and search engine visibility of their website. If you thought my comments on Touro's website were mean, you'd have been brought to tears by my report on theirs.
     
  7. simon

    simon New Member

     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 29, 2002
  8. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    "Tellarites do not argue for reasons. They simply argue"

    Sarek of Vulcan

    Could've been about this place, too. :rolleyes:

    (For the record, I've always appreciated Kristin's contributions to DL, many of which have been away from this board. :) Her comment was direct and accurate, and certainly not aimed at the school. For barbs directed at the Touro College/Touro International University arrangement, search this board.)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 29, 2002
  9. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

    When I was working on Get Your IT Degree and Get Ahead, I got so frustrated in dealing with confusing/uninformative/slow/non-intuitive web sites that I actually instituted a web site star rating system as part of the listings to get revenge for all the hours I had to spend in front of microfiche readers, phoning the school, requesting literature, etc. etc. etc. to get basic information that should have been more easily accessible.

    I would rank Kristin as one of my very favorite people in the field of distance education, and can completely understand why she finds the TUI site non-intuitive. (For the record, I would have probably given it **1/2.) And as far as Simon goes: Well, Kristin, if it makes you feel any better, he hates my guts, too. I eventually gave up and added him to my ignore filter.



    Cheers,
     
  10. simon

    simon New Member

     
  11. A very fine book, for which I thank you. The rating system is a little misleading to a casual reader because it can appear at first sight to be a rating of the school rather than the web site.
     
    • To be loved is to be fortunate, but to be hated is to achieve distinction.
      Minna Antrim
     
  12. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

    And thank you for your kind words! GYITD&GA will always have special meaning for me, because it was that book--contingent on Mariah's rather risky decision to sign on some kid John found on the Internet--that made everything else having to do with my writing career possible. (I just signed and mailed a new book contract yesterday, so this has been fresh on my mind--not everybody gets to say "Gee, I think I want to be a writer; I guess I'll co-author a 500-page book for McGraw-Hill along with the two most internationally respected authorities in the field of distance education." I was one lucky sonofagun, and I'll always be grateful.)

    Agreed; unfortunately, I didn't realize how big the stars looked on the page until the book had already gone to press. (We'd been given PDF proofs, but it didn't really hit me until I saw it in ink.) It was a silly idea anyway, and I kind of regret it because so many of the web sites--Charter Oak State College is the best example--improved so much between final proofs and press time that they weren't that useful anyway. If and when a second edition rolls around, I'll be very surprised if we end up keeping the star ratings.


    Cheers,
     
  13. Bill Highsmith

    Bill Highsmith New Member

    "If everyone likes something, it must be looked into. If everyone dislikes something, it must be looked into." --Confucius (as memory serves)

    I don't know much about TUI the school, but TUI the website is visually hidious. Just fix it. It could be improved a lot by a few days of lackluster work, dealing only with the visual aspects.
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Kristin,

    You insensitive radical you :D

    I have not followed this whole thing but in my opinion you are entitled to your opinion on the appearance of the TUI web site. It is not like you called the school a mill or said it was not accredited. As to the argument by someone that your comments may mislead people, all I can say is give me a break. If someone took remarks about the web page and determined the school was poor based on that, then I would say they were not ready for graduate level research. One of the lessons for potential students to learn is that flashy or professional looking does not equal accredited. In fact I have seen the opposite to be true (some mills have great sites). I take your remark to be....................an opinion on the appearance and design of the web site.

    I have enjoyed your contributions to DL, keep up the good work!

    North
     
  15. mdg1775

    mdg1775 New Member

    I can only speak for myself

    This forum has helped me to get my SH** together and re-focus on getting an education. I have noticed that there are those who get off on tangents and entertain arguments/attack the posture of others....sometimes that's healthy when its invited. I believe that if you cannot accept certain criticisms then you should advise readers of your posts that you wish only direct answers to your questions or concerns...and nothing else.

    The moderators do a great job on this board and believe me...it could be far, far worse. If someone attacks you personally..then I suggest you report them. As for me; school, work, and childcare are tedious enough as it is...a little drama is invited!

    Regards
     
  16. Chip

    Chip Administrator

    We (the moderators and admins) have been a little bit lax lately on moderating with regard to personal attacks.

    However, I think that it's a good time for a reminder.

    Degreeinfo is a site for discussion about distance learning issues.

    Lively debate is welcomed.

    Negative comments about the people posting messages are not only not welcomed, they are a violation of our terms of service.

    Depending on the circumstances, we may take one of several actions regarding a post that attacks an individual. For example, with any given post, we may do any one or more of the following:

    1. Leave the post intact and notify the poster via private email that the post is inappropriate.

    2. Make a general announcement asking posters to keep within civility and our posting guidelines.

    3. Edit the offending post to removed the offensive content

    4. Remove the entire post

    5. In some cases, suspend the poster's posting privileges.

    Please help make our job easier by moderating *yourself* when you're writing your posting.

    Thanks much!
     

Share This Page