South University - Doctorate of Ministry opinions wanted

I would like a Doctorate or Phd in Biblical Studies or Ministry.

I found the Doctor of Ministry at South University.

Any opinions on the Dmin or South University ?

I would like to use the degree for teaching and also from a non-denominational school.


Regards,
Michael

 

If you want to teach at the university / seminary level you need a Ph.D. There are exceptions of course. But if you want to teach at a traditional seminary or even Bible College you should pursue the Ph.D.

I have a D.Min. and teach but I do so in the third world (Haiti) where my credentials are so far ahead of most pastors that to gather a group of pastors, as we have done, and start a Bible College really falls into a very different category than applying for a position (even part time or adjunct) at an accredited seminary in the U.S. Perhaps if you want to teach Bible at a Christian Highschool and pursue a career in Christian Ed. in that way sure, a D.Min. (particularly in Christian Ed. would probably be great way to go, even overkill)

I have served some unaccredited, but highly credible, seminaries and universities with my accredited seminary degrees and accredited D.Min., but again, this is kind of an exception in that I do that simply to extend ministry and influence and enjoy mentoring students and pastors, especially in ways that cost them far less than traditional programs.

BUT if you want to pursue a traditional teaching career at the Christian University / Seminary you would do well to pursue an accredited Ph.D. from a good program with respected scholars as faculty. There are just way too many of us with D.Min.s who would happily teach at a University. A few do. But a Ph.D. is the way to go and even then there is a lot of competition.

 

With a D.Min. even from one the most highly respected schools in the country, finding a full-time teaching position would be rather difficult. Even people with Ph.D. degrees often find teaching positions difficult to find. Deans in more progressive/liberal seminaries and universities are likely to be able to pick from Ivy League graduates and graduates from other elite institutions. Deans in evangelical schools are likely to look for denominational "fit," and the combination I have seen very, very frequently is for a student to earn an M.Div. (and possibly also a Th.M.) from a denominational seminary and a Ph.D. from a "name" school. Connections are perhaps the most important factor though. I attended college with a seminary professor at one of the six Southern Baptist seminaries, and he actually completed his MDiv, ThM, and PhD all from the seminary where he is now teaching. Of course, this is not the norm, but this fellow is truly an exceptional scholar, teacher, and minister. His seminary would have been insane to let him leave.

IMO, the D.Min. from South University is an interesting model and a throwback to one of the initially proposed models of the D.Min. of having it as the first professional degree instead of the MDiv with a D.Min. earned later. I don't think it would open that many doors teaching. Whether it would open doors in ministry is a matter of one's church setting.

 

Both Stefan and Pilgrim offer solid advice. The DMin is a professional doctorate (as is the MD for medicine, the DDS for dentistry, the DBA for business, etc.), designed to practice the profession. The PhD (with its strong emphasis on research) is the degree of choice for most academic positions. As stated, there are exceptions to the rule, for example, the DMin is used at times for teaching ministry oriented courses at a two or four year Bible college. However, accredited institutions--especially at the seminary level--lean toward the PhD. I earned both a professional doctorate and the PhD. Believe me, there is quite a difference between the two.

 

Agreed: the MD and DDS do not require the completion of a dissertation, which makes them professional doctorates. However, the DBA does require the completion of a dissertation (unless you can prove otherwise). What is your qualification for describing a DBA as a professional doctorate, like an MD or DDS?

 

Most of the time I've seen a listing of professional doctorates the DBA was included. The DMin requires a dissertation as well, but it is considered a professional doctorate. The professional doctorate I completed required a dissertation of 100-150 pages. My PhD dissertation was 336 pages. This is the difference I was citing.

The DBA is view by the University of Wisconsin, per their website, as "UW-Whitewater is home to one of only six AACSB Accredited Doctorate of Business Administration (DBA) programs in the United States. Our program is a professional doctorate that enables students to develop in-depth expertise in a specific business area."

 

In the old days (which wasn't very long ago), professional doctorates did not have a dissertation component, such as an MD, JD, DPT, DNP, etc. Conversely, research doctorates did require a dissertation, such as a PhD, DBA, EdD, etc. It appears that there is a push to give the term "professional doctorate" a new meaning to include any and all doctoral designations that are not designed for academic research. Thus, that new classification lumps non-dissertation-doctorates (such as an MD and JD) in the same category as dissertation-doctorates (such as DBA, EdD, DPA, etc). That new definition does not have a universal agreement.

Standards can vary by institution. Rajani Naidoo, director of studies for the DBA in higher education management at the University of Bath, said: "Our School of Business Management has a high research rating, so we were very clear from the outset that the DBA would be the same standard as the PhD."

Conversely, do they offer a PhD in business and, if so, what are the requirements? Harvard University offers a DBA, but does not offer a PhD in business. Nonetheless, the Harvard DBA remains a research doctorate, despite the allegation by some people that the DBA is allegedly only a "professional doctorate."

Again, it appears that there is no universal agreement on the new push to classify all non-PhD degrees as being "professional doctorates." Harvard has not yet jumped on-board this new definition, but maybe they will in the future. Time will tell.

 

I agree, there seems to be a lack of universal consensus on what constitutes a professional doctorate.

 

The DMin project is a kind of dissertation but in most cases, mine not withstanding, it is not the same as a PhD dissertation. I often refer to the DMin project as an applied dissertation. Completing it enhanced my skill for ministry and helped my writing but it was for a distinctly different kind of purpose than a PhD dissertation. Not lesser, but different, applied, professional, not at all distinctly research to add to the field of knowledge through a unique contribution in the same way.

 

That is clearly true with DBA and EdD but I think for the most part the DMin is a fairly clearly defined professional degree. Mine was in Expository Preaching and I feel very qualified to mentor pastors and preachers but the primary emphasis of that degree is upon enhancing professional competency of practitioners of Christian ministry. Some DMins are more rigorously academic in orientation than others but for the most part that degree seems to be pretty well defined.

 

A government site once listed degrees like the MD, JD, and MDiv as "first professional degrees". Even though some may have doctor in the title they are not traditional academic doctorates.

This is quite different from Professional Doctorates such as DBA, some EdDs, DMin, DMus., PsyD., etc. These doctorates are geared to practice and build upon a bachelors and masters degree and have a dissertation or professional application project.

Then you have research doctorates like the Ph.D. and some EdDs.

Those advising you about the competitive market for doctoral level grads be they DMin or PhD are correct.

 

Ah good catch on noting the subtle distinctions:
1. Professional degrees: MD, JD, and MDiv
2. Professional doctorates: DBA, some EdDs, DMin, DMus., PsyD., etc.
3. Research doctorates: PhD and some EdDs

The proponents of the Harvard DBA might dispute the above categorization.

 

Actually, the MD and the DDS are first professional degrees.