A "Creative" Dissertation for a Theology Degree

I've searched far and wide for a school that would allow me to submit a body of original poetry/songs in fulfillment of dissertation/thesis requirements for a theology degree but have found none. The most anyone will go for is allowing me to quote from some of my work as a reference within a traditional research format; one school would allow me to attach about ten pages of my original work as sort of an "appendix", but that's not what I wanted to do.

It seems to me that a person should be allowed to do a creative thesis or disertation, especially in the field of Practical Theology, but I have not found a school willing to allow that.

There is another option: I could include Christian/spiritual poetry in a Creative Writing degree offered by an English department; there's only one problem with that, though--I'd much rather teach theology than English.

So, I guess what I'm saying is that I've found it's much easier to theologically-orient a creative writing degree than to creatively-orient a theological degree.

Any thoughts, opinions, comments, or suggestions?

 

This has been done at The Union Institute and University. One faculty member with a Ph.D. in Psychology decided to become a learner and pursue another doctorate, this one with a specialty in religion. The bulk of her PDE (Project Demonstrating Excellence) was a series of poems on the nameless women in the Bible. Of course, her PDE was constructed with research questions, a literature review, etc. Her poems were based in her research into who these women really were.

The Union Institute and University embraces interdisciplinary study at the doctoral level. You will be encouraged to blend theology and creative writing, if that is your goal. How much of each will be up to you and your committee. It might be worth exploring; it seems your purposes are very much aligned with The Union's mission.

 

You might also see if you can tailor a Doctor of Creative Arts to Sacred Literature--I've been told that this can be done in theory, but I don't know how viable it would be as a teaching credential.

I've also heard rumblings that the DETC is now authorized to accredit D.A. (Doctor of Arts) programs, though I haven't confirmed this; it might be worth a call to Mike Lambert to see if any schools are about to offer one in something that can be tailored to your field.

But yeah, here again, Union is probably your best U.S. option for this sort of thing.


Cheers,

 

Rich and Tom,

Thanks for your replies! Yes, I like the Union Institute, but I wonder if the residency days would be a problem for me. Of much greater concern is the cost--I don't see how I could afford the degree.

 

If I could make a suggestion--maybe one idea would be to talk to one of these South African universities about doing a dissertation on sacred literature and using your creative work as an appendix. That's what I did when I wanted to do a retelling of Genesis 4:1-16 as part of my HUX thesis.


Cheers,

 

Tom,

Latley the topic of the D.A. degree seems to come up frequently. I first heard about it when someone reliable indicated to me that American Christian College and Seminary was considering renaming their 60 credit hour D.Min in Christian Counseling a Doctor of Arts (for whatever reason this did not happen). Trinity Seminary (unaccredited - Indiana) suddenly renames their Ph.D.'s as D.A.'s and now you mention that you heard this in regards to DETC. Must be something in the water.

North

 

I can't afford it, either.

 

Have you forgotten what happened last time when you couldn't afford it? ...remember?

You got a job working for them, called yourself a candidate and the Trucker went spastic, and then a little later the college fell over ....

... well a little later after a little later ...

Good luck Dr

Peter

 

Ironically, soon after Steve's tirade the paperwork came through for my candidacy with the ephereal MIGS. I "afford" part was a joke, however. As in, "Even free can be too expensive."

I'm just glad I got out of there when I did. Too bad others cannot say the same.

 

It will be interesting to see how the D.A. community would view a potential DETC D.A. degree. For information and background on D.A. programs you can check out the National Doctor of Arts Association and the Doctor of Arts Center. Links are:

http://www.isu.edu/departments/graduate/ndaa/

http://www.isu.edu/departments/graduate/doctor.html

John

 

prepare to teach theology thru writing poetry??

Michael

I know age brings often resistance to new approaches but this throws me. Why would you suppose that expressing yourself in poetic form prepares you to teach theology and that you should be given a degree in Theology for such expression?

If you wish to apply your interest and skills in that discipline then why not tackle a problem in one of the several forms of Scriptural poetry rather than suggesting that you should receive the qualification to teach Theology by poetisizing?

Has your formal theological education to this point prepared you to teach theology?

 

Bill,

That's a fair question. I suppose a little background info and explanation are due. My bachelor's degree is in English and social studies with a religion minor. I'm a musician and published poet--including a book of original poems. I've also studied theology and church history for more than twenty-five years.

Just as I thought that a postgraduate degree in creative writing would allow me to teach same in a university, I thought that a postgraduate degree in a theological discipline such as practical theology that included an original creative component would allow me to teach worship and liturgy. Of course I realize that such a teaching position would only apply to a seminary or Bible college and probably not to a secular university. And of course I also realize that such a path effectively narrows my chance of a teaching position even more, but one must make choices based on primary interests--at least at this point that's what I've decided to do.

 

Michael

Thanks for your reply.

So is it an MA your'e after? You only mentioned your BA. Were it an MA seems as though you could work your aspiration into it in some way.

God's best,

Bill

 

Bill,

MA or MTh--at this point I'd do whichever I could make work.

Thanks for the encouragement!

 

either MA or ThM?

Michael

In most schools the MDiv is a prerequisite for entry into the ThM.
The ThM is a degree (by,eg,ATS standards) which requires four years of grad work. two languages, and generally a thesis. This is about 126 grad semester units. I know of no MA that is more than half the ThM work.

Your'e probably up on this stuff, I just wished to point out to any who were not the the disparity between these masters.

 

Michael

By the way we share some experience in common. My first teaching credential was in English and currently I teach both English (writing) and SS to academically disabled Junior High kids. While I , of course, took several courses in poetry, my own originals only were to woo my wife. Sometimes I wish my compositions had had less efficacy (naw, not really!).

 

Whoops--sorry, Michael, I've given you some funky advice, then. For some reason, I got the idea that you were looking for a doctorate rather than a master's. If you're looking for a master's, I recommend the program I graduated from--California State--Dominguez Hills, HUX--where you could do a Humanities concentration in Literature with a creative project instead of a thesis, while earning at least half of your credit in fields relevant to religion and theology. My mentor (William Hagan) has an S.T.D. (the degree, not the...well, you know), and would probably be delighted to supervise some independent projects in theology, if you want to go that route.

The trouble with doing a master's that concludes with a creative project is that it probably won't get you into a research Ph.D. program; you'd have to either earn a second master's or go with a Doctor of Creative Arts or somesuch.

Maybe the real alternative is to earn two inexpensive degrees concurrently--maybe the HUX MA (or an even cheaper humanities-related master's) with a creative focus on one hand, and an Aussie or South African ThM with a liturgical focus on the other. You could conceivably have both done within 3 years, though it would mean a pretty serious amount of work.


Cheers,

 

Bill,

What you say about the MTh is true in this country, but apparently things are somewhat different overseas--in some countries, anyway. Based on my background, I've been accepted into three MTh programs in South Africa, one in Australia, one in England, and provisionally into one other South African school.

Do you, or does anyone else, know if there are significant differences in the MA and MTh in foreign countries? It also seems that some foreign MDiv's are different than their American counterparts--for instance , the U. of Pretoria's is a two-year degree and has Hebrew and Greek language prerequisites.

Bill, I, too, teach English and also math to learning disabled seventh graders; so, yes, we do have some common experiences.

Best wishes,

Michael

 

Tom,

Actually, your advice was right on. I did want to explore the possibility of getting into a doctoral program in creative writing; I've seen some English departments that would in some cases allow a person with only a bachelor's degree to enroll directly in a doctoral degree program.

You know, I've strongly considered doing both a creative writng master's and a theology master's at the same time; it would increase my chances of getting a teaching job, but you're right--it would require a LOT of work, and my public school job has already got me reeling. Anyway, I'd have to settle on one or the other for my doctorate, so I guess I need to decide on one or the other at this time and go for it. What I'd really like to do, though, is combine the two areas in one degree program, if possible--and I don't know if it's possible.

Peace,

Michael

 

FWIW: I think what it all comes down to is the capstone project. I don't think you can do a doctoral-track academic master's in theology and use a creative project instead of a dissertation--but... Hold on, flash of brilliance coming: Why don't you do an interdisciplinary master's of some kind--HUX's or Laurentian's or maybe even Potch's--and do a creative project and a thesis, with the thesis being the "official" capstone and the creative project counting as course credit? I'm 99% sure this can be done at HUX; you could do a thesis on 19th century Russian Orthodox liturgy, and do a 594A (Independent Study) where you write a chapbook of Christian poetry. Likewise, Potch might be willing to let you do an elective Th.M. module where you do some creative work to go with all the academic research. Maybe the solution isn't two master's, but rather one master's with two capstone projects. Whaddyathink?



Cheers,