Using a BA degree from AMU to get into a graduate program at brick and mortar school?

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by MichaelRea, Sep 8, 2011.

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  1. MichaelRea

    MichaelRea New Member

    What's the feasibility of using a Bachelor's degree obtained from AMU to use to apply for graduate schools at brick-and-mortar public schools in California?
     
  2. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator

    If you've got good enough grades you should have no problem.
     
  3. davesaint

    davesaint New Member

    I work for Boeing and AMU was just added to Boeing's list of preferred schools.
     
  4. MichaelRea

    MichaelRea New Member

    If it helps, my degree path with AMU for my BA is International Relations with an emphasis in Asian Studies. The completion of my BA and the time that I am supposed to separate from the military should coincide. I plan on applying to grad school at either one of the UC schools or CSU schools in California, in something relating to Chinese or Japanese.
     
  5. StefanM

    StefanM New Member

    Well, it would seem that the CSU schools would be more likely, but with a solid GRE score and letters of rec, the UC schools might be an option. Berkeley would probably be a stretch, though.
     
  6. MichaelRea

    MichaelRea New Member

    Yeah, no. Lol. I would never wanna go to Berkeley. Not a fan of the school. It is reassuring that I should be alright with a BA from AMU insofar as applying for grad school at a CSU.
     
  7. Cyber

    Cyber New Member

    AMU is a very good online school. However, there are several instance where B & M schools reject degrees from online-only schools. A smart thing to do is to call the school and inquire whether AMU will be acceptable for entry into their program.
     
  8. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    In theory, the basic requirements for admission to a CSU graduate program are a bachelor's degree from a regionally accredited school with decent grades (GPA = 2.5 or higher). Many CSU graduate programs are non-competitive; they admit all candidates that meet the minimum standards. An AMU degree should work fine in such cases.

    In practice, however, some CSU grad programs are more competitive, and in such cases an AMU degree might not be ideal. Competitive graduate programs are more likely to favor degrees from competitive undergraduate programs. CSU puts it like this:

    Unfortunately, the CSU system is facing harsh budget cuts, and so the number of affected programs is likely to rise over the next few years. Your future chances of graduate admissions at CSU are likely to vary, depending on which exact campus and program you are interested in. A couple of general guidelines:

    -- enrollment demand is generally higher at the coastal CSU campuses, and lower at the inland CSU campuses

    -- enrollment demand is generally higher for more applied programs (i.e. something like "International Business"), and lower for more "liberal artsy" programs (i.e. something like "East Asian Studies").

    It's not too early to start thinking about the possible options within the (very large) CSU system, and to start asking about admissions statistics for specific graduate programs.

    At UC campuses, you can probably assume that all graduate programs have competitive admissions. You would probably need strong GRE scores and letters of recommendation, in addition to a regionally accredited degree and good grades.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 11, 2011
  9. MichaelRea

    MichaelRea New Member

    Thanks, CalDog, for your response; it's very enlightening. To elaborate on some of your key points, the schools in question that I'm considering are SF State, Cal State Long Beach, CSU Northridge perhaps, and if I were to attempt a UC, it'd be UC Santa Barbara for it's Chinese/Japanese Linguistics program. I'd definitely be going into the more "artsy" programs; no hard sciences for me. It'd either be a linguistics degree in Chinese/Japanese or a hybrid program with history as well.
     
  10. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    In that case, the bigger issue may be with your undergraduate major, not your undergraduate school. Linguistics is a very technical field of study that requires a lot of specialized undergraduate coursework. For example, CSU Long Beach requires the following kinds of courses as undergraduate-level prerequisites for their MA degree in Linguistics:

    - Modern English Grammar
    - Language Acquisition
    - Phonology
    - Syntax
    - Language Variation

    Your major is in "International Relations"-- which doesn't seem like the best place to get this kind of preparation. If you haven't taken basic linguistics courses like this, then you might only get accepted to a linguistics graduate program on a conditional basis; i.e. you would have to first take the undergraduate courses and get satisfactory grades before you were allowed to take graduate-level courses.

    The other thing that a graduate-level program in linguistics will expect is proficiency in any non-English languages that you intend to study. And again, a DL International Relations degree may not be ideal preparation. If you are already fluent in Chinese and/or Japanese, then this may not be an issue. Otherwise you might consider applying to Language programs, rather than to Linguistics programs.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 12, 2011
  11. MichaelRea

    MichaelRea New Member

    I've already done about a year and half's worth of coursework in the Chinese language, although I plan on retaking them as it has been quite a while and am a bit rusty. I do concur with you on the point that perhaps I should focus on a language program instead of doing a specific linguistics degree. I do not, however, mind doing the prerequisite coursework in order to be eligible for it, either.
     
  12. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    Note that "languages" programs and "linguistics" programs will commonly be in completely separate departments, with different prerequisites and different admissions standards. At CSU Long Beach, for example, you would study Chinese/Japanese language/culture in the Dept. of Asian and Asian-American Studies, while there is a separate dept. for Linguistics. At SF State, the linguistics program is in the English Dept., while Chinese/Japanese language/culture is handled by the Dept. of Foreign Languages and Literatures.

    The CSU system publishes an annual list of "impacted" undergraduate degree programs. The list shows the specific programs and campuses that have more applicants than they can handle at the undergraduate level, and which therefore have competitive admissions. I don't think there is a similar list for graduate programs, but there is probably some correspondence. You will see that programs like Asian Studies or Foreign Languages are not listed as "impacted" anywhere, but some campuses are now "impacted" for English (which may include linguistics, as at SF State). You might want to keep an eye on this list, because the number of impacted programs is likely to grow over the next few years.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 12, 2011
  13. Jeff Walker

    Jeff Walker New Member

    I used an Excelsior bachelors to get into a top 5 computer science program (I was originally accepted into the B&M masters program, though I switched to the online masters program). Specific programs will vary, but I would suggest the following:

    1) Pay attention to pre-reqs. If there are things that the grad program says you ought to have and you don't have them, find a way to fill those pre-reqs as it will make your application stronger.

    2) If the program requires a "statement of purpose" or something similar, take it seriously and personalize it to the program you are applying for. Make them believe that you are both qualified and really want to be there.

    3) Do well on standardized tests if they are required (or even merely recommended). Don't give them an easy excuse not to accept you.

    4) Take the subject GRE, if applicable, and take it seriously. This one probably doesn't apply to most people in most subjects, but an easy way to show you are qualified in your subject, regardless of where you got your undergrad, is to show that you know the material on a standardized test in that subject.

    Just like getting a job, you have to sell yourself. Pay attention to their rules, and within their rules, make yourself look as good as possible.
     
  14. MichaelRea

    MichaelRea New Member

    CalDog and Jeff both make great points. I've been doing some digging, and, at least at SF State, the GRE isn't needed, just letters of recommendation and writing samples both in English and Chinese along with your statement of intent. Nonetheless, I think it'd be a good idea to eventually study for it, just in case I need to.

    Also, over the years at looking into colleges/universities, I've never really seen any Asian Studies/Japanese/Chinese degrees as impacted. I can't predict the future; however, I don't really see it changing all that much. Not using that as an excuse to not make myself as competitive as possible, I just don't see those degree paths ever becoming impacted to the degree of hard sciences and math.
     
  15. MichaelRea

    MichaelRea New Member

    I agree with both points you and CalDog made. I've looked at the Masters program in Chinese at SFSU, and they don't require the GRE at all. I still intend to keep my options open and practice/study for it, because it'll only make me more marketable in the long run.

    Another trend that I have noticed, is that some schools are not accepting Master's only students, and funneling them into the PhD pipeline. I'm not against this at all; I'm quite interested in pursuing that route, actually. It's just a bit surprising, at least to me, to see that some graduate programs are doing that.
     
  16. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    This is actually quite normal for a school that is oriented towards research, rather than teaching. Master's-only candidates are of little value from the perspective of academic research: you give them some advanced training for a year or two, and just when they know enough to be useful, they graduate and leave.

    The PhD candidates, on the other hand, get advanced training and then stick around the department for years while they work on their doctoral dissertations. They are incredibly useful during this period; they can be used to teach introductory undergraduate classes (so the faculty can focus on research), work on complex research problems (of interest to the faculty), and publish research papers (with faculty as co-authors). And they are willing to do all this for low pay. Modern research universities couldn't function without them.

    Even if a school says that they accept both Master's and PhD candidates, the PhD candidates may get first priority for admissions and financial aid. If any extra admissions slots or financial resources are left over, then they may look at Master's-only candidates.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 13, 2011
  17. MichaelRea

    MichaelRea New Member

    That does go with how the UC system is geared toward research and the CSU is more about teaching. I only saw that whilst looking at UC campuses. There's nothing wrong with that, it's just two different ideologies.

    I know the Post 9/11 GI Bill will cover a graduate degree, but would it cover a doctorate as well? Even if I do go into a Master's program, I eventually want to get into a PhD program. That's my hope, anyway.
     
  18. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    You shouldn't expect to see it at CSU campuses, because the CSU system is not authorized to issue PhDs or professional doctorates. That's a UC monopoly.

    There are actually some limited exceptions: CSUs are now allowed to issue EdDs, and they sometimes offer PhDs or other doctorates through "joint degree programs" with UCs.

    The principal concern is that many students are encouraged to enroll in PhD programs without an understanding of how bad the academic job market is, particularly in the humanities. It is quite possible to spend many years pursuing a PhD in a field like linguistics or Chinese, only to wind up with a degree that has very little value on the academic job market, and even less in the "real world".

    Research universities consistently overproduce PhDs relative to the number of tenure-track openings. As a result, there is a huge pool of underemployed PhDs looking for academic work. Many schools (perhaps including AMU) increasingly draw on this pool to hire "adjunct" professors, who work part-time for low pay, no benefits, and no job security.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 13, 2011
  19. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    According to College Navigator, the American Public University System had 1,461 faculty in Fall 2010.
    Of those, 1,208 (or 83 %) were part-time.

    Part-time faculty are paid $130 for each undergraduate student, or $150 for each graduate student, with no health benefits. Adjuncts can teach a maximum of 225 students per year, with no guaranteed minimum.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 13, 2011
  20. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator

    Of course, we are talking about highly educated people who are capable of making independent decisions. Not small children who can be easily confused.
     

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