I have been in contact with professors from CU about their MTh degree. I am considering enrolling in this after I finish my MFA. I asked if their MTh was adequate preparation for doctoral study, and one prof told me this: "At the present time the 30-hour M.Th. is not enough, on its own, to get you into doctoral study. You will need a Master's degree and a minimum of 60 hours at the graduate level." Is that the case only for doctoral study at U.S. schools, or would it also be true for South African and other foreign schools?
You can check with someone but from what I can see the answer is no it would not be acceptable. They do not accept our 90 credit MDiv unless it had a thesis since they consider it a non academic degree. Here is what one school (South African - SATS) said about the MTh: i) If it is the Master of Theology built on the MDiv plus 1 or two years of study (eg I imagine DTS' program) then they would take it. ii) If it is just a Masters they would accept it with enough theology courses. They define enough as being 64 credits and a thesis component. What I would do is check with the school you are interested in gaining entrance to. Is there a thesis with the program at Campbell?
No, there is no thesis with CU's online MTh. I was surprised and not aware that you had to have 60 graduate hours to study for a doctorate in theology in the U.S. You can get into a doctoral program in English with 30 graduate hours, for instance. Why not theology?
Additional thought but too late for edit functions: I would think if you were trying to take this short MTH and gain admission to a US or South African PhD program in Theology....fuggedaboudit. But what you might do since it is an accredited Masters is see if you can get into a basic PhD program at Northcentral University or University of Phoenix (etc) and the answer might be YES. In other words a US based non theological program might well take it (no reason not to since it is not dissimilar to other Masters programs). PS The problem with South African schools is they generally expect the BA Honors to be built upon by a Masters with thesis component in the same subject with thesis followed by the PhD (depth). Here in the US (at least with for profits) there is much more flexibility and the depth is not necessarily required. So you might take a 30 credit Masters from Campbell and enroll in a UofP or NCU general PhD (not sure what to call it but where you have some flexibility on background and maybe even topic as with the Union PhD).
Don't take this as "gospel" but according to my research, re entry requirements for PhD: Christian schools (seminaries) generally want an MDiv (at least) as entry into their PhD or ThD or DMin programs. They will make exceptions of course but usually only if a person has many years of experience or is somehow otherwise credentialed (ex, they wrote a best-selling book, friends with the dean, etc). I contacted SBTS to ask whether a MTS degree plus a two-year master's degree in world religions from a well-known secular school would be adequate for entry into one of their PhD programs with a world religions concentration. Their reply was basically "No, we require an MDiv." Frustrating since IMHO MTS+MA in world religions would be much BETTER preparation for a PhD in that field than a generic MDiv! Secular schools generally want at least a two-year secular master's degree including a thesis. To many secular schools your Christian seminary degree(s) don't "count". For example, I contacted a secular b&m university in Canada to ask whether I could potentially be permitted entry into their Master of Religious Studies program (not PhD, just masters) with my BA and MTS degrees. Their reply was basically "No, you need a Bachelor of Religious Studies degree. Your 54-credit MTS degree counts for nothing." Apparently in their eyes the 18 courses I took at an ATS and (Canadian equivalent of) regionally-accredited school are worthless! Anywho, both types of schools want to see a master's level thesis, though not all MDiv programs require one. This may be why some people do one-year research only ThM degrees after their MDivs. (Not the Campbellsville style ThM, which IMHO is incorrectly named, their degree is really more like a Master of Arts in Religion at most schools, ex Liberty).
I was referring to a South African School but yes theology (in the US too) is a tough field in terms of amount of study (all that and no job market). But that is why I made the other suggestion that if you do not mind the added expense of a US based for profit and could find a PhD in a general area or that had general Masters admission requirements, you could probably make the Campbell Masters work for you (check NCU and U of P).
Here are U of P's entrance requirements for most doctoral programs. have a master’s degree from an approved college or university that’s regionally or nationally accredited, or a comparable degree from a recognized institution outside the United States. A master’s degree is not required for the Doctor of Philosophy in Industrial/Organizational Psychology program and an undergraduate degree may be used. Please contact an enrollment advisor to learn more about this requirement if you are interested in the Doctor of Philosophy in Industrial/Organizational Psychology program. Ph.D. Programs - University of Phoenix Northcentral doctoral programs (except Psych): Admission to Northcentral University's Doctoral program in the School of Education or the School of Business and Technology Management requires a conferred Master's degree from a regionally accredited academic institution. Doctoral Degree Admission Requirements | Northcentral University Also suggest looking at Grand Canyon U. Seems to also just require and accredited Masters http://www.gcu.edu/College-of-Doctoral-Studies/Admissions/Admission-Requirements.php As emmzee points out Canadian (and South African programs and US based competitive programs) are likely to be far more picky that US based for profits. PS Interesting to note that UofP takes nationally accredited degrees. Also, with these for profits you may earn a PhD but will not likely be a theology prof just a guy with an accredited doctorate.
Garp and emmzee, I very much appreciate your thoughtful, detailed replies and all the information you supplied me with. I just have to say this is amazing! And Garp, as you said, "...theology (in the US too) is a tough field in terms of amount of study (all that and no job market)." So true. Well, all of this has helped me to clarify what I need to do: Get the MFA, and then probably get an 18-hour grad certificate in theological or religious studies. This would give me the minimum necessary to teach religion at the community college level. I might keep the option open for completing a master's in this area, but all I want to do is prepare for the possibility of a community college job. This path would prepare me to teach English, writing, and religion -- including the college/university level, at least with English and creative writing. So, I finally feel my path is clear. Now it's a matter of deciding between National and Ole Miss for the MFA. And, although Ole Miss would be much better for me financially, and possibly some other ways, I must say that National has been much more helpful, interested, caring, and welcoming so far. And that goes a very long way with me. It's easy to be loyal and committed to such a school.
