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  1. #33
    Anthony Pina is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garp View Post
    I think at one time the National Science Foundation (NSF) and the US DoE classified this way:
    (they keep changing the classifications titles)

    Professional Degrees: These were first professional degrees and included those with 'doctor' in the title that were not true doctorates. Eg MDiv, Doctor of Chiropractic, MD, JD

    Professional Doctorates: This included Doctor of Music (DMus), Doctor of Business Administration (DBA), Doctor of Education (EdD ) and Doctor of Ministry (DMin)....etc. These required a Masters degree for entry.

    Research Doctorate: PhD and whatever else they threw in (cannot recall)

    Yes, even though MD and JD are prestigious degrees, they are not true doctorates (even in the sense that DBA's and DMin's are).
    You are really close. The U.S. Dept. of Ed and the NSF have, indeed, published a classification system for degrees. However the "professional doctorate" degree is not included, since the professional doctorate, by and large, was just a way to allow individual schools/colleges within a university (e.g. business, education ) to offer their own doctorates. The Ed.D. and D.B.A. were but invented at Harvard due to the fact that Harvard Corp. allows Ph.D.s to be awarded only by the College of Arts and Sciences, so any doctorate offered by one of the other graduate schools must have a different name than the Ph.D. These are the classifications at the graduate level. You can find them at the U.S. Dept. of Ed. Structure of U.S. Education site http://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ous/international/usnei/us/edlite-structure-us.html.

    Unfortunately, the unofficial "professional doctorate" title is used by accrediting bodies (such as DETC, which mixes up first professional, intermediate and research doctorates into a single "professional doctorate" category), CHEA and even the U.S. DoE itself, which has given the DETC the authorization to award professional doctorates when it does not even officially recognize that classification. If we took things to their (il)logical conclusion, we would have a research doctorate category with only one degree: the Ph.D.

    First Professional Degrees

    Doctor of Chiropractic (D.C. or D.C.M.)
    Doctor of Dental Science (D.D.S.) or Doctor of Dental Medicine (D.M.D.)
    Doctor of Jurisprudence or Juris Doctor (J.D.)
    Doctor of Medicine (M.D.)
    Doctor of Optometry (O.D.)
    Doctor of Osteopathic Medicine/Osteopathy (D.O.)
    Doctor of Pharmacy (Pharm.D.)
    Doctor of Podiatric Medicine/Podiatry (D.P.M., D.P., or Pod.D.)
    Master of Divinity (M.Div.), Master of Hebrew Letters (M.H.L.) or Rabbinical Ordination (Rav)
    Doctor of Veterinary Medicine (D.V.M.).

    Intermediate (6 yr) Graduate Degrees

    Doctor of Ministry (D.Min.)
    Doctor of Psychology (Psy.D/D.Psy.)
    Education Specialist (Ed.S./Sp.Ed.)

    Research Doctorates

    NOTE: This is the list of frequently awarded research doctorate degree titles accepted by the National Science Foundation (NSF) as representing degrees equivalent in content and level to the Doctor of Philosophy (PhD) degree.

    Doctor of Arts (D.A.)
    Doctor of Business Administration (D.B.A.)
    Doctor of Church Music (D.C.M.)
    Doctor of Canon Law (J.C.D./D.C.L.)
    Doctor of Design (D.Des.)
    Doctor of Education (Ed.D.)
    Doctor of Engineering (D.Eng./D.E.Sc./D.E.S.)
    Doctor of Fine Arts (D.F.A.)
    Doctor of Hebrew Letters (D.H.L.)
    Doctor of Industrial Technology (D.I.T.)
    Doctor of Juridical Science (J.S.D./S.J.D.)
    Doctor of Music (D.M.)
    Doctor of Musical/Music Arts (D.M.A.)
    Doctor of Music Education (D.M.E.)
    Doctor of Modern Languages (D.M.L.)
    Doctor of Nursing Science (D.N.Sc.)
    Doctor of Philosophy (Ph.D.)
    Doctor of Public Administration (D.P.A.)
    Doctor of Physical Education (D.P.E.)
    Doctor of Public Health (D.P.H.)
    Doctor of Sacred Theology (S.T.D.)
    Doctor of Science (D.Sc./Sc.D.)
    Doctor of Social Work (D.S.W.)
    Doctor of Theology (Th.D.)
    Anthony Piña, Ed.D.
    Dean of Online Studies

  2. #34
    shawn3500 is offline Registered User
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    yeah it seems alot of people go into masters programs because when they get their bachelors they dont want to work and moma and dada give them money so they figure well let me just continue living this life, my gf also pays for her own stuff so i can just continue.. LOL. So they continue on living with mama and dada and have no real world work experience and get their masters. Anyone else seen this?

  3. #35
    Garp is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Pina View Post
    You are really close. The U.S. Dept. of Ed and the NSF have, indeed, published a classification system for degrees. However the "professional doctorate" degree is not included, since the professional doctorate, by and large, was just a way to allow individual schools/colleges within a university (e.g. business, education ) to offer their own doctorates. The Ed.D. and D.B.A. were but invented at Harvard due to the fact that Harvard Corp. allows Ph.D.s to be awarded only by the College of Arts and Sciences, so any doctorate offered by one of the other graduate schools must have a different name than the Ph.D. These are the classifications at the graduate level. You can find them at the U.S. Dept. of Ed. Structure of U.S. Education site http://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ous/international/usnei/us/edlite-structure-us.html.

    Unfortunately, the unofficial "professional doctorate" title is used by accrediting bodies (such as DETC, which mixes up first professional, intermediate and research doctorates into a single "professional doctorate" category), CHEA and even the U.S. DoE itself, which has given the DETC the authorization to award professional doctorates when it does not even officially recognize that classification. If we took things to their (il)logical conclusion, we would have a research doctorate category with only one degree: the Ph.D.

    First Professional Degrees

    Doctor of Chiropractic (D.C. or D.C.M.)
    Doctor of Dental Science (D.D.S.) or Doctor of Dental Medicine (D.M.D.)
    Doctor of Jurisprudence or Juris Doctor (J.D.)
    Doctor of Medicine (M.D.)
    Doctor of Optometry (O.D.)
    Doctor of Osteopathic Medicine/Osteopathy (D.O.)
    Doctor of Pharmacy (Pharm.D.)
    Doctor of Podiatric Medicine/Podiatry (D.P.M., D.P., or Pod.D.)
    Master of Divinity (M.Div.), Master of Hebrew Letters (M.H.L.) or Rabbinical Ordination (Rav)
    Doctor of Veterinary Medicine (D.V.M.).

    Intermediate (6 yr) Graduate Degrees

    Doctor of Ministry (D.Min.)
    Doctor of Psychology (Psy.D/D.Psy.)
    Education Specialist (Ed.S./Sp.Ed.)

    Research Doctorates

    NOTE: This is the list of frequently awarded research doctorate degree titles accepted by the National Science Foundation (NSF) as representing degrees equivalent in content and level to the Doctor of Philosophy (PhD) degree.

    Doctor of Arts (D.A.)
    Doctor of Business Administration (D.B.A.)
    Doctor of Church Music (D.C.M.)
    Doctor of Canon Law (J.C.D./D.C.L.)
    Doctor of Design (D.Des.)
    Doctor of Education (Ed.D.)
    Doctor of Engineering (D.Eng./D.E.Sc./D.E.S.)
    Doctor of Fine Arts (D.F.A.)
    Doctor of Hebrew Letters (D.H.L.)
    Doctor of Industrial Technology (D.I.T.)
    Doctor of Juridical Science (J.S.D./S.J.D.)
    Doctor of Music (D.M.)
    Doctor of Musical/Music Arts (D.M.A.)
    Doctor of Music Education (D.M.E.)
    Doctor of Modern Languages (D.M.L.)
    Doctor of Nursing Science (D.N.Sc.)
    Doctor of Philosophy (Ph.D.)
    Doctor of Public Administration (D.P.A.)
    Doctor of Physical Education (D.P.E.)
    Doctor of Public Health (D.P.H.)
    Doctor of Sacred Theology (S.T.D.)
    Doctor of Science (D.Sc./Sc.D.)
    Doctor of Social Work (D.S.W.)
    Doctor of Theology (Th.D.)
    This is the new(er) list. There was one from a few years ago with the categories I mentioned and no intermediate category. I smiled when you mentioned that these categories above are not universally used since I saw the same thing with how National Accreditation is defined and the difference between US DoE and CHEA. Rather confusing.

    PS I like the DIT degree. Instead of, "Are you a PhD?", "Why no, I am a DIT".

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  5. #36
    soupbone is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by truckie270 View Post
    I graduate with my DPA in May. Since I started the program in 2007 the opportunities that came my way as a result of being in a Doctoral program have paid for my degree several times over. The return on investment is there, you just have to invest wisely to get it.
    Considering we are in similar fields, would you mind giving a bit more detail? My own consideration has been to either pursue a grad cert to complement my masters or proceed to a doctorate. Most of the opinions I received (from you and others) made me realize it made more sense to seek a grad cert, however I haven't discounted the doctorate option yet.

    What kind of doors did just being in the program open up? If it's too personal I understand, but I was just curious.

  6. #37
    SteveFoerster is offline Resident Gadfly
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    As an aside, it seems a bit unfair to call a DMin a sixth year degree when it requires an MDiv for entry, which itself take three years beyond the Bachelor's.
    BS, Info Sys concentration, Charter Oak State College
    MA in Educational Tech, George Washington University
    PhD in Leadership, U. of the Cumberlands (in progress)
    More at http://stevefoerster.com

  7. #38
    Anthony Pina is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveFoerster View Post
    As an aside, it seems a bit unfair to call a DMin a sixth year degree when it requires an MDiv for entry, which itself take three years beyond the Bachelor's.
    You make a very good point. It is just another evidence of the confusing and inconsitent nature of degrees in this country. The MDiv seems to have a lot more in common with other first profession degrees (nearly all of which now use the title "doctor of...") than it does with other masters degrees. If the Doctor of Divinity degree did not already exist, perhaps the MDiv would have taken that title.

    There may be exceptions, but most DMin degrees that I have seen require as many post-masters units as en Ed.S. degree and are not equal to the research-based Th.D. and Ph.D. degrees in religion.

    Had the MDiv followed the pattern of the other first professional degrees, it would have been called a "doctor of..." (like a J.D.) and the DMin might have been a masters degree in ministry (like the LL.M.). So someone would get a B.A., then a DDiv, then an MMin.

    It's too late for that, however.
    Anthony Piña, Ed.D.
    Dean of Online Studies

  8. #39
    imalcolm is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garp View Post
    PS I like the DIT degree. Instead of, "Are you a PhD?", "Why no, I am a DIT".
    I got a laugh out of this one:
    Doctor of Sacred Theology (S.T.D.)
    MS ISA - WGU (in progress)
    MS Space Studies - AMU (2011)
    BEET - World College (2009)
    CEH, CCNA

  9. #40
    Abner is offline Registered User
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    Cool

    I like this quote from number 56:



    "If Dante had been familiar with graduate school, he probably would have added a level of Hell to his Inferno".

    Abner :)
    A.A. Cypress B.S. - California Coast University, M.B.A. - Aspen University
    "If a Samurai's head were to be suddenly cut off, he should be able to perform one more action with certainty" - Hagakure

  10. #41
    thyslip is offline Registered User
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    Can someone explain how this works

    "with Lifetime Learning tax credits and almost free textbooks through Amazon"

  11. #42
    PilgrimPastor is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurfDoctor View Post
    I agree....
    Agreed. I am doing mine for knowledge, to do research, for credibility, but also for the same reason I write (big one anyway) for my kids and there kids to know what I really believed and taught. I want to set a high educational standard this didnt exist in my family where a HS diploma was in short supply...
    “Lord, stamp eternity on my eyeballs.” ― Jonathan Edwards

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  13. #43
    PilgrimPastor is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by imalcolm View Post
    I got a laugh out of this one:
    Doctor of Sacred Theology (S.T.D.)
    The doctor of sacred theology is an ancient and regal sounding degree but I sure wouldnt want the STD after my name! Ha!
    “Lord, stamp eternity on my eyeballs.” ― Jonathan Edwards

  14. #44
    Abner is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by PilgrimPastor View Post
    The doctor of sacred theology is an ancient and regal sounding degree but I sure wouldnt want the STD after my name! Ha!

    I don't blame ya!!!!!!!

    Abner :)
    A.A. Cypress B.S. - California Coast University, M.B.A. - Aspen University
    "If a Samurai's head were to be suddenly cut off, he should be able to perform one more action with certainty" - Hagakure

  15. #45
    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by PilgrimPastor View Post
    The doctor of sacred theology is an ancient and regal sounding degree but I sure wouldnt want the STD after my name! Ha!
    If one doesn't want an STD after their name, that rules out studying at the Schools of Theology at Dubuque.
    Theo the Educated Derelict
    BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
    MBA, Entrepreneurship, City University of Seattle, 1992
    MBA, Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993

    Politics is made from two words: "poly" meaning "many" and "ticks" meaning "blood-sucking insects."

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