PHD Th: SATS vs UNIZUL vs UNISA

I've caught bits of conversations on these institutions...and after a while they all 'merge' in my mind. I'm hoping to differentiate the schools/programs a bit, with the help of those here that are in the know.

1. differences in the programs?
2. theological bent? receptive to those of other persuasions, or not so much?
3. strengths/weaknesses of the schools/programs
4. if you attended one, why did you choose that one over the others?

I'm sorry if that seems vague, but I'd just like to get a general feel for how these differ from one another....and if one is more highly recommended than another, from those that have been there ahead of me.

I realize the reasons we choose one school over another vary, and can be personal, but standing at the beginning of the process, they all seem very similar, and I wonder which one to pursue.

Many thanks in advance.

 

I am not "there ahead of you," but I've read a lot of posts about all of these schools and I'll venture an opinion based upon that.

Both SATS and UNISA are, by definition, distance learning institutions. This is not true of UNIZUL which is a B&M institution where virtually all of the students reside on campus.

UNISA and UNIZUL are "comprehensive universities" offering degrees in a wide range of subject areas. SATS is a seminary and is designed specifically for people interested in ministerial stuff (sorry, I know I said that poorly).

I'm guessing that denominational distinctions might be less of a big deal at UNIZUL and UNISA because they are academic (as opposed to ministerial) in their orientation. If your interest is ministerial you can't assume your dissertation topic will be acceptable at UNISA or UNIZUL because they might not have the appropriate staff to support your research (because they're more academically oriented). You can't assume that you'll be allowed to do a DL PhD at UNIZUL because it's not a DL institution.

Again, all of this is just stuff I've gleaned from reading the posts of others and I could easily be off the mark. I've decided to post it in response to your question because I don't know that we have anyone on the board who has enough actual experience with all three schools to do a full-scale "compare and contrast" analysis. Certainly I can't.

 

Thank you, Kizmet.
The 'comprehensive school' vs. 'theology only school' is a most helpful delineation and start.
Hopefully others will show up shortly.

 

UNIZUL does not offer distance learning programs but a few people have successfully convinced the school to allow them to undertake their research-oriented docoral degree program from a distance in the same way that Brad Sweet did his PhD at University of the Free State. That is why I said (above) that you can not simply assume that they will allow you to do so, it's an exception to their rule and you have to approach them with your request to make an exception to that rule. That it is so inexpensive is one of the main factors that lead to people to be interested.

 

I once talked with the head of the English Dept at Unizul about doing a DL Masters. She was agreeable and we had some very nice conversations. She knew that the theology Dept had done that in the past (Bill Grover had just finished at the time) and was going to discuss it with them, to see how they handled it.

I don't remember exactly why I stopped pursuing it, but Dr. Hooper certainly seemed open to the possibility. But I initiated the conversation about DL. There was nothing online or elsewhere that hinted at the possibility.

 

A note for clarification........ prior to the collapse of Apartheid South Africa, there were both white and non-white universities. With the post-Apartheid reconfiguration of the South African system of higher education, the mandate of many schools was changed. This included the creation of 'comprehensive' universities, which are blend of traditional university studies with technical studies [e.g., agriculture].

When I enrolled with Uzulu in 2005, the university was configured in traditional university structure, because it was one of the traditionally non-white schools. As such, the department of Theology and Religion Studies was large, with [as I recall] about eight full-time faculty [e.g., Bobby Loubser] and various support staff. After reconfiguring Uzulu into a 'comprehensive' school, the department was diminished to one full-time faculty member.

Some of the traditional white schools -- like Pretoria -- maintained their traditional status and seemed quite unaffected, save for the fact that they were to welcome non-whites for study. My doctoral mentor [Alrah Pitchers, Cape Town -- seen in one of the promo pics for SATS] was among the faculty who either retired, or moved on -- several to SATS [e.g., Arthur Song]. Thus, the old Uzulu faculty has left its more conservative imprint upon the SATS family -- a growing, solid faculty indeed.

Unisa remains the primary distance education university in South Africa. It's faculty is necessarily ecumenical, but thankfully includes a number of theologically conservative scholars.

After finishing my MTh [Unisa - Missiology] in 2005, I was invited to study for my doctorate at Pretoria, U-Wales [Lampeter], Unisa and Uzulu. I chose Uzulu because it was smaller [more 'user friendly'], and more closely tied to non-white South Africa and those whites who opposed Apartheid. It was also, at the time, the keeper of research data on African religions. Just months after beginning work on my Uzulu doctorate, the change was implemented [2005] and the reconfiguration took place. Apartheid essentially ended in 1994.

As things are today, Unisa is the most friendly toward DEd students, because that is their primary function [like the Open University, UK]. The other universities who have theology/religion faculties are less likely to welcome non-resident [at least part-time] grad/doc candidates.

SATS [founded in 1996] is intentionally 'Evangelical,' and thus theologically conservative. As a private entity, it does not have to be politically correct like the state funded departments.

Which school to work with? With all due respect to Uzulu, the department is no longer equipped to [properly] mentor doctoral candidtates [in my opinion].

SATS is by far the best choice for conservatives.

Unisa is a good choice for anyone, but conservatives must bear in mind the more Liberal, Pluralistic slant.

Pretoria is one of the top schools in the world, their theology faculty still among the best. Their doctoral offerings [via DEd] are limited however, unless you want to make trips to campus.

If you want a purely DEd doctorate, you only real options are Unisa or SATS.

SATS is gaining credibility/reputation globally, but Unisa still has the 'big' reputation for obvious reasons.

Sorry for rambling a bit. Glad to attempt to answer any additional questions.

 

Don't overlook North West University (Formerly Potchefstroom University).
Their degrees are very much in line with Pretoria as they were both largely conservative, reformed theology schools. The biggest advantage is that they have various partner institutions offering their degrees through DL.

 

Thank you, Haggai. And no need to apologize. That is exactly the kind of thing I am looking for.

Also, thank you Lukeness.

I am not reformed in my theology, so I am thinking SATS, NorthWest, Pretoria may not be the best fit for me. Seems like UNISA would be it for me in SA. I am also considering a couple of British schools; trips to campus once a year is doable.

Thanks again, all.

 

They are reformed and evangelical.

 

Thanks Lukeness..

I overlooked GST/North West.... another excellent choice, and quality theology faculty.

 

All three are the equivalent of accredited. Here are a few thoughts:

1. SATS is a relatively new school without an extensive track record (drawback). On the positive side, they have a good record as far as dealing with foreign students.

2. UNISA. Large and well known. There are doctoral faculty at reputable institutions in the US with doctorates from UNISA. The drawback is that they have had a reputation in the past for some difficulty navigating their system. However, it can be done. Paige Patterson's wife has a doctorate from UNISA as I believe does Ergun Caner (former head of Liberty Baptist Theological Seminary).

3. UNIZUL. The one main drawback in the US would be the name University of Zululand. It has an odd sound to western ears. Positives include cost and at one time they had a very good and receptive theological faculty. They worked with SATS as it was starting out. Prof Song was at UNIZUL and now I believe at SATS.

If I had my choice and all things in terms of cost and ease of navigation were equal, I would choose UNISA for history and reputation. Are you going to try and secure a faculty position with the degree?

 

Thank you, Garp. That was very helpful.
The degree is mostly for me - interest, enjoyment.
I'm not sure there would be any vocational change because of it. There are no theological schools where we live, and we enjoy where we live!
But, I think I'll not cross UNISA off my list just yet.
I am still leaning to British schools, yet the SA costs are very attractive.
Thanks again.

 

How long would it take to get a DL theology doctorate?

 

Presently as SATS I supervise three PhD and one MTh theses, also the three grad level bridging courses required for those entering a MTh without having a theology undergrad degree, also the six courses of the masters in Biblical studies, and also one of six soon to be courses in the BTh honors. At nearly 71 years of age, I'm very thankful I have this to do.

In the USA I completed grad programs-classroom work- in five RA institutions ; I also did the DTh at Unizul which took four years after my Western ThM (which also took 4 years as I had to complete the MDiv equivalency first) .

I can assure the reader of SATS' rigor, but, yes, it is Evangelical. Non -Evangelicals in SATS'grad degree programs may find that to be constrictling. The school generally is very user-friendly.

Thank you,

Bill Grover

 

To acknowledge my association with SATS: I supervise two PhD dissertations, one MTh thesis, and about a dozen grad courses in Theology for SATS. I've been with SATS about four years. I've finished work in four USA B&M RA accredited schools plus the DTh with Unizul. It is my impression that rigor I require in the curricula and see of other supervisors of SATS is the equivalent of any degree programs in my experience including the ThM at WEstern and the unfinished EdD at Oregon State. I will confess that statistics at OSU was a killer!

 

Congrats on your many accomplishments, Bill!

I look forward to reading your posts.

Roscoe

 

Hello Roscoe

I cannot be proud since it took me 45 years to do what could be done in 12! But at least now, at nearly 71, I'm finally where I should have been at 35.

Thank you,

Bill

 

Thanks Bill for joining the forum! Glad to have your additional insights.

 

'Unisa remains the primary distance education university in South Africa. It's faculty is necessarily ecumenical, but thankfully includes a number of theologically conservative scholars. '


Haggai12 -- or anyone else -- could you point out some of those for me?