Well I'm back. I am sure many here are getting sick of listening to me go back and forth but I wanted to get some final opinions on my dilemma. After doing a lot of narrowing down as to what my goals are they are 2 fold: I want to obtain my license for private practice as both a LPC and a LMFT. I also want to eventually be able to teach perhaps part time at the community college level. I am stuck between SCU and Capella. I have been accepted into the Human Services program at capella but not the Psych program. I could get an MS in Human Services (general track) which has no residency. This program is only 48 quarter hours and I would have to do some maneuvering to get in most of the classes that I need for my state since it covers several classes I don't need. However if I continued to the PhD with this program I would be able to pick up those additional classes (and the additional price tag too unfortunately) After adding it up this comes to a whopping 35,000 dollars total which to me sounds like a LOT! SCU is not much better on price. The masters degree program is impressive to me though. Would someone on this board who is more knowledgeable in this area please go to the SCU website and check out the info on their program. It offers everything I need for dual licensure in both counseling and marraige and family therapy. They are Candidacy Eligible for the COAMFTE (Commission On Accreditation for Marriage and Family Therapy Education) accreditation awarded by the American Association of Marriage and Family Therapists and expect Full Candidacy status in late 2002, and Full Accreditation around 2005. By the state I have to have a 60 hour masters and Capella will only give me 48 quarter hours at that level. The price is not much better. It still will be about 23,000 by the time it is all finished but no residency requirements. The programs are done very differently. Capella from what I can tell has no tests and is done probably more independent learning perhaps. SCU is still trying to keep distance learning equal to in classroom learning. The classes are live feed over hte internet using real audio. You take tests through a proctor. It sounds a lot like Liberty minus the residency. So why haven't I heard more about SCU. Am I missing something? Is it a good deal? I understand about the religious affiliation but other than that are there people out there going for this program? Why do I hear more about Liberty than SCU? It seems like SCU is a better deal with no residency requirement. Of course going this route leaves me at the masters level and I would still have to go back through Capella to get hte PhD but I could transfer in 50 credits. Any thoughts?
Holly: The program at Capella is billed to the student by the quarter - not by the course. So, theoretically, you can take as many hours as you need, therefore; the 60 is possible if you stay focused and busy. You can choose courses you need in addition to the ones required and end up at the end of two years with the 60 hours for the same price (with the exception of books) as the 48. No tests - sounds easy. It is NOT! Every course requires interaction with the mentor for the course and if it is an online course you must post and respond to post each week. And there is the final project. This is not a formality. If the original submission is not acceptable you get to do it over, and over, and over.......... The $35,000 for the PhD is for tuition. If you can finish the degree in 2 years - the shortest time allowed - I believe the total cost is going to be between 40,000 and 50,000 by the time you count books, travel costs for seminars - 3 are required and the 1,000 per seminar is not included in your tuition - the 2 week extended session - another 1500 plus travel, lodging, meals, materials, etc. And then there is the dissertation. Do you have a topic in mind, a place that will allow you FREE access to resources, someone to manage your research data. I am not trying to blow you out of the water, just giving you information to make an informed decision. Maybe you should concentrate on your Masters and make sure it meets your needs (Simon very eloquently offers suggetions that I also believe are worthy of processing) and then complete this. I suspect you will be accepted at SCU - they try to find a way to admit everyone. They only difficulty they have (I taught for 5 years at an affiliate institution -Faulkner University) is the religions quirks and a lack of finances. Liberty - also one of my schools is good and solid, Jerry is way out in RIGHT field but does not restrict academic liberty and the counseling and psychology departments are very good, as is the school. Simon last statement - go for it - YES! ------------------ Howard Rodgers
Well that was depressing! Every time I think I have this figured out I don't. I can do the work. That is not my issue. It's the $$$$. If what you say is true and that it comes out to be 50,000 for Capella then I think that price is too high for me. Of course I could do it all through loans but I won't pay that much for the convenience of any degree when I could go to a state school and pay a trillion dollars less. My problem is that we are military and we move a lot. I would like the convenience of distance learning but if Capella is going to take me to the cleaners then I don't see the point. So for me that is not going to be worth the price. I would be willing to pay the amount worth the masters degree through distance learning which would be around 23,000 at SCU. My father has already offered to pay for my books so all I would pay is tuition and the residency is not an issue with them. The hours needed for licensure in my state have to be done post graduate anyway so that is not an issue. When I mentioned doing college level teaching I certainly did not mean as a career seeking tenure. I realize it is competitive in some arenas but I am talking about teaching classes on the base to soldiers out of the ed center perhaps on contract for Troy State or some other local school that teaches intro level classes on the base. They will hire anyone with the qualifications. A totally different arena. If I am going to only focus on getting a masters degree then I will have to do it through SCU which covers dual licensure areas. The Human Services masters at Capella just does not cover the main content areas like SCU does. I like Capella a lot and I want to do that program!! But I can't do it. The price is too high. I guess I'll have to wait around until I can find my way to a land based PhD program!!! There are reasons why I can't do Liberty's program. A few years ago I applied to their teacher licensure program and had the worst experience ever. I would have a few choice words for Jerry Falwell if I ever had a face to face meeting with him. In fact I detailed my experience with Liberty in an Epinions review on distance learning if you ever want to know what happened. If you had a good experience with Liberty you might want to write a review on there as well so people will know there are 2 sides to that coin.I believe we shortly converted to the Catholic church after this. I figured this was as far from Southern Baptist as I could get and after my harrowing experience with Liberty's admissions person I wanted to never be associated again with the Southern Baptists!
Holly, one additional issue you might want to address is the course prefixes that your potential degree utilizes. I teach psychology full-time and have evaluated numerous ajunct faculty transcripts. In my area the Southern Association is VERY picky about teaching creditials. For example, my college interpretes the SACS regulation as requiring a graduate degree with 18 hours in the area. For instance, we do NOT except the following prefixes to teach psychology fam, cous, edp, edc, hums, educ and so on. The masters could be in anything however must have 18 hours reflecting PSY or a straight psychology prefix. An example of how strick this is would be that I have 36 hours in education and many in psychology at the graduate level. They will not let me teach an edp educational psychology class. I can teach either straight education or straight psychology. Before thinking about a program make sure that the course prefixes match exactly what you are wanting to teach. Other regional bodies may be more flexible...however the safest route is to obtain the desired prefix to begin with... Good luck, Rob Hayes Assistant Professor of Psychology
Holly, I agree. 35K for tuition sounds very expensive to me too. I work in a teaching hospital and I often reflect on how good my generation had it when students (not just psychology but medical, OT, social work students etc.) talk about the expense of higher education. There was enough money around when I started graduate school in the early 70s that the only people who didn’t receive support were those who didn’t want to take on the really modest requirements of an assistantship. My wife and I sort of rotated being the breadwinner and we lived in genteel poverty but throughout graduate school I only ever took out one loan that I used for absolute necessities. I bought a motorcycle and a stereo . I have lots of respect for your generation; your cohort has to pay it’s own freight. I do have one thought you might wish to factor into the long-term equation that may afford a few degrees of freedom. Should you be able to attend a bricks and mortar school if/when you go on for the doctorate, coursework taken in a counseling masters program should transfer into a counseling psychology doctorate. This may not be the case in a clinical psychology program. My degree is in counseling psychology from Indiana State where practically all of the students entered with a masters. Years ago one used to encounter a bias against counseling psychology graduates but that’s long gone. The licensure is identical and counseling psychology grads are eligible to go into specialty areas like forensics or neuropsychology if they so choose. Still, 35K does seem like an enormous expense for what is not an especially lucrative job. Especially when you think that if there was a state school nearby you could probably complete the degree for <10K. I don’t envy you your decision. Do keep us posted. David
That is the main reason why I decided against Capella. I have no desire to do the work of a full-time student while I'm also working full-time (been there, done that), but I have even less desire to pay full-time tuition while taking a part-time credit load. I really think there is a market for a non-traditional doctoral program where you can pay by the credit and avoid the always-ticking tuition clock. Bruce [Note: This message has been edited by Bruce]
Thanks for the encouragement and great advice about Counseling Psychology. I have finally made a decision so if any of you are still following my saga I have decided to go for the Masters at Southern Christian. It is accredited and it has all the coursework plus some that I need for the state of Alaska. It has no residency requirement which is fine since I am not required to have that by the state. My hours of supervision have to be done post graduate anyway. I'm not thrilled about the price but I will be doing this little by little. I am a stay at home Mom and I really need the convenience of a distance learning program. I am in no rush as my daughter won't be kindergarten age for 4 more years so I will probably only take 2 classes at a time. I am thinking of working part time to pay for some of the cost on my own so that it will lessen the loan amount on the other end. My husband is in the military and we will be stationed in Alaska for the next 3 years however he is already slated for a teaching position at Ft. Sam in san Antonio after that (more than likely) so if possible I will try to find a doctorate level program hopefully in Counseling psychology that is land based and less expensive that I can possibly transfer into. In the meantime I will be accomplishing something!!! Thanks for the advice along the way. I will come back on occasion to let everyone know how my experience with SCU is going!
