Looking for General Advice on pursuing a MA

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by cframe, Dec 27, 2008.

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  1. cframe

    cframe New Member

    I've been a "reader-only" fan of this board for a while and am hoping to benefit from those who have already traveled this path. Excuse the long post, but I felt it essential to get the information I am seeking.

    As a homeschooling mom, my role as facilitator has taking us down the Clepping path for 2 years. My 10th grade son is 70 clep credits into a BA in History from TESC, though not yet formally enrolled. He will be eligible for free dual credit courses for his 11th and 12th grade years (State of MN program) where he will finish up his degree with a 2 foreign language classes and 2 UL history courses.

    Because of his age, and the fact he can't drive yet, his plan is to start 11th grade at the local community college and take his history courses distance ed ... where is yet to be determined, just within the State of MN. This finishes out his history degree, but since he still has at least a full year of free tuition at any MN college for his 12th grade year, he's interested in filling up those credits with a second degree from TESC in Political Science. It is unusual to take UL credits during dual enrollment, be he has found two B&M colleges who will allow it, and plenty of OL courses.

    Fast forward two years ... he's graduated HS and holds a BA from TESC. He's academically-gifted but still has a teen's (im)maturity level and needs some life experience before moving up the educational ladder. Possibilities are YWAM and Americorps for a year or two before continuing on for an MA and ultimately a PhD. He would like to be the first "doctor" in the family. Ha. He's looking at his first stopping ground as prof at CC, then (hopefully) acceptance in a PhD paid program, then a political career... analyst, senator, foreign ambassador ... are all "what if" dreams.

    My job as Educational Facilitator is and has been, to plot a course the would keep as many dream-options open as possible while still heading toward a goal that is somewhat hard to nail down simply because he is so young. Hence, the reason for the long and personal post.

    He is financially responsible for his education but has not needed any dollars up until this point and probably won't for his BA. His MA and PhD are another story. Cost is a big consideration, so living at home might continue to be his first-choice upon returning from his gap-year travels. Should he have a MA program chosen now to line up the necessary BA courses? That seems such pie-in-the-sky planning at this point, but I'm looking for comments/advice on what doors are available that I should look into now to set him up for future options.

    Thanks for your help and insight.
     
  2. TEKMAN

    TEKMAN Semper Fi!

    Is that his dream or your dream? :), Anyway, if he earns a BA and HSD as the same time. I would recommend to take a year off for traveling. Check out this: http://www.youtube.com/user/TheGapYear2008

    Since he wants to have a career in Politic. Have you ever thought about for him to go to Law School? Honestly, I think he is too young to know what he wants to do. I thought I did, but now I am 25 and I want to steer to a different direction. Maybe I want to go Law School after earning my Master.
     
  3. airtorn

    airtorn Moderator

    No. After experiencing life a bit after leaving the home, he may figure out what he wants to do. There is a good chance that it is a lot different than what he thinks he wants right now.
     
  4. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    I'm not a big fan of DL students blowing-off their undergraduate educations, madly clepping through everything with some strange idea that their real academic life will start in graduate school. An undergraduate degree is the intellectual foundation of one's entire discipline. If that foundation is shoddy and weak, then the whole structure is in danger of toppling.

    So my suggestion is to stop pushing your son to do everything as quickly as humanly possible. Let him stretch out a little and grow. If his TESC major is (or will be) history, and if that was his choice and not yours, then encourage him to read meatier things than clep-exam study-guides. Encourage him to read more accessible scholarly writing on the historical periods that interest him. (By 'accessible', I mean books intended for an undergraduate/educated-layman audience.) There are countless academic press titles out there at that level on every aspect of history. Introduce him to the huge periodical literature in history, (but don't expect that he will master it). If you aren't an historian yourself, you will probably need to think about finding him a history tutor.

    Think about expanding things out. He should have a broad synoptic view of all of world history, from prehistoric times to the present, non-Western as well as Western. (A good place to start might be to give him a copy of William McNeill's extraordinary 'The Rise of the West'.)

    If he is interested in political history, think about encouraging him to read some political theory and political philosophy. If he is interested in the history of science, then he's going to need to learn some math and science. If it's economic history, then he needs to have some familiarity with economics. If he's interested in cultural history, then he should know about art, religion and philosophy. History doesn't happen in a vacuum.

    So I guess that my point is that you probably should slow down with him. It's all going to take some time, that's natural and it's how it should be. Don't rush. If your son wants to read a book slowly and think about what he's reading, then let him. Encourage him, don't push him. He'll almost certainly want to talk to other people interested in these matters, so you need to think about how he can do that. (That's a big draw-back of this board's lone-ranger DL model.)

    One thing that he might think about doing is volunteering. If there are any history museums or heritage sites in your area (they are everywhere), then encourage him to check out what's happening there and introduce himself. Not only will he make contacts and gather references, he'll get a feeling for historic preservation and education.

    Seriously, I think that if your son is only in the 10th grade and not even out of high-school yet, then it's way too early for you to be plotting his progress through graduate school. He hasn't even started his undergraduate career yet. If he really is as talented and superior as you believe he is, then give him some opportunity to use his talents and to expand on them. Help him to do his undergraduate education right, well and strong.

    Personally, I suspect that your son might be best off in a good selective B&M undergraduate history program. There are many well-regarded liberal arts colleges like Carleton in MN and around the Midwest that might be wonderful places for him. If you think that you can't afford it, then investigate what kind of scholarships are available. You might find that with all the clepping and with references from volunteer work and stuff, coupled with family financial need, that your son might qualify for a hefty financial aid package. The University of Minnesota is another good possibility. I'm inclined to think that clepping isn't really a good substitute for actually taking the classes, especially if it's a demanding academically intense class with a high-poweed professor and full of highly-selected over-achieving kids that are constantly stimulating each other.

    And keep in mind that your son's young. Most kids his age have no idea what direction their whole life is going to take. They are experimenting and building a general education foundation. There's freedom in being young, that's the wonder of it. Don't stifle it. Your son shouldn't specialize too soon, he still might change course. Maybe history isn't his thing after all and he'll go off in an entirely different tangent as he matures. You can't hold him back and lock him in, fearing that he'll waste all those cleps that you had him do. History is a good background for almost any subject, so whatever he learns now isn't going to be wasted.
     
  5. 03310151

    03310151 Active Member

    Incredible!

    Excellent job on the home-schooling front. Wow.

    Possibilities are YWAM and Americorps for a year or two before continuing on for an MA and ultimately a PhD. He would like to be the first "doctor" in the family. Ha. He's looking at his first stopping ground as prof at CC, then (hopefully) acceptance in a PhD paid program, then a political career... analyst, senator, foreign ambassador ... are all "what if" dreams.

    I'm more interested in your home schooling experience, and his development as a person, so I will fire away with some questions if you don't mind.

    Did he come up with all this on his own (bolded above)? Sounds like a very forward thinking young man.

    Does he play sports?

    What are his other interests?

    What kinds of friends does he have?

    Is he happy?

    All of those careers mentioned are very conducive to some military experience. Has he/you though of that?

    It would round him out immensely and also provide some much needed financial aid for school.

    Good luck to you, and especially the kids.
     
  6. cframe

    cframe New Member

    Well, I asked for opinions, so I guess I should be ready to take all that are offered, even if they are in the direction of parenting instead of educational opportunities. It's all food for thought.
     
  7. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck

    Cheri,

    there is a reason (actually many reasons) that only 3 schools in the US allow for the testing methodology for an entire degree. Here is the link to the University of Minnesota's acceptance:

    UM CLEP Acceptance

    The U of Minnesota only accepts 3 CLEP tests. You might inquire as to why they have this policy. I would really examine if a TESC degree is the best course for a young "academically-gifted" student. If the cost of attendance is the issue then a strong standardized test score can result in a full scholarship at many schools. In fact, I wouldn't finish the TESC degree until after I had explored all my options. Once completed he will no longer be classified as a freshman. UofM (for example) allows for a secondary school student to complete AP and dual enrollment and still be classified as a freshman. Once in school he could easily apply and complete the TESC degree as a second degree or as a fall back. Although he might have many options for a school to attend.

    I admire and commend you for your effort and thanks for letting us throw some thoughts at you.
     
  8. Sowak777

    Sowak777 New Member

    cframe,

    Congratulations on homeschooling your children. Yes, you opened Pandora's Box when you asked for advice as a homeschooling parent. In general, people have absolutely NO clue.

    The popular culture in America says that teenagers are worthless, lazy morons that will spend ten years of their lives getting drunk while they "figure out what they want to do." KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK! Keep leading, guiding, and shepherding your children. When they are grown and supporting themselves, they can choose a different course for their lives, if they so desire.

    Keep up the good work.
     
  9. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator

    Hi Cheri - I've read through your description of your sons achievements and goals. You've really only asked one question: Should we choose a Masters program now so as to line up courses, etc. My answer is "Not necessarily."

    I think that education is a process that goes beyond the simple acquistion of factual knowledge. There are elements of inspiration involved. Many young men and women have plotted their courses through life only to run into that special teacher who showed them an entirely different course that catches their imagination and sends them off in an entirely different direction. Your son is only beginning to understand his own identity and how he'll fit into the world. Planning too far ahead is an exercise filled with assumptions, most of which will turn out to be poorly made. If it seems that people have not actually answered your question it might be because many of us have found ourselves in careers that are not to our liking. We made decisions early in life only to find that we were not entirely happy with them. So now many of us are trying to get onto a track that fits us more properly. I think that people might be just a little worried that your son might find himself in that same position someday. We'd like to prevent that, if possible. It's clear that you have been doing research on our site. That's great. Has your son registered? He could check out all the possibilities himself. In any case, there are not a lot of distance learning History programs or Political Science programs around. If you can't find them by scanning through the threads or using the search function them come back and we can make a list for him.
     
  10. cframe

    cframe New Member

    I suppose how one views the purpose of education really determines the direction and hoped-for results. That is the beauty of public school, private or homeschool choices as well as B&M, online and independent study options.

    Some links that have influenced our CBE decisions include:
    an interesting blog about why the U of M only allows limited clep credits:
    http://suburbdad.blogspot.com/2006/03/transfer.html

    Gary North's view on Education for $11 a day
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evJeAAJedbY

    Combining Highschool and College
    http://www.collegeplus.org/highschoolstudents


    "If it seems that people have not actually answered your question it might be because many of us have found ourselves in careers that are not to our liking."
    This statement seems to be the rule rather than the exception. If 40-ish-year-olds are re-evaluating choices, I really don't expect an under-20-something to make life decisions any more clearly so redirection is expected. Rather, What education options open doors rather than close them was the ultimate question.

    Thanks
     
  11. AV8R

    AV8R Active Member

    TESC used to require applicants to be at least 21 y/o before enrolling. Has this changed?
     
  12. cframe

    cframe New Member

    You're correct. A letter of appeal needs to be submitted, which is commonly accepted if the applicant has already earned 30 credits.
     
  13. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck

    still does:

    http://www.tesc.edu/admissions/admissions.php

    "To apply to an undergraduate program at Thomas Edison State College, you must be at least 21 years old and possess a high school diploma or a General Educational Development (GED) certificate."
     
  14. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator

    I'd say that a solid liberal arts background is the best bet. While I believe that writing skills are indispensible, I also believe that in todays world mathematical skills are equally valuable. Best of luck in your quest and thank you for being so graceful in regards to my unsolicited opinions.
     

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