Wow this sucks...CPA dilemma

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by swisha2k, Nov 9, 2008.

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  1. swisha2k

    swisha2k New Member

    Wow this sucks. I have been testing out most of my degree requirements prior to enrollment @ TESC for an accounting degree. 3 Months and 60 credits later, I've noticed that the state of Florida will not accept CLEP exams as requirements for the 150-cred rule. Wow!

    http://www.myflorida.com/dbpr/cpa/CPA-examlink1.html
    (Bottom of the page)

    So any ideas guys? Will I have to bite the bullet and fork out some xtra cash?
     
  2. Vinipink

    Vinipink Accounting Monster

    Probably! I did.
     
  3. DBA_Curious

    DBA_Curious New Member

    I would. Having my CPA just helped me land my 2nd adjunct position and this one's at an on-ground college, which is a 1st for me, so that's pretty sweet.

    The CPA license is a pretty decent resume blurb. I'm now licensed in two states and considering the CVA as well. It pays for itself pretty quickly.

    Plus, you only CLEP'ed the intro stuff, right? You're looking at $250 or so from LSU to get this over with and into testing.

    Have you selected a test-preparation program yet? Gleim worked very well for me.
     
  4. AV8R

    AV8R Active Member

    What is a CVA? A google search didn't reveal anything.
     
  5. Shawn Ambrose

    Shawn Ambrose New Member

    Here's the blurb form the site:

    CLEP Courses
    CLEP courses cannot be used toward satisfying the requirements of the Accounting Education Program or the General Business Education Program. CLEP hours may be used toward the 30 semester hours in excess of the degree.

    This means that CLEP can't be used for the business and accounting requirements - but can be used for the gen eds. How many business and accounting credits have you used CLEP for?

    Another option could be to sit the exam in a neighboring state.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 10, 2008
  6. OnMyWay

    OnMyWay Grand Duchess

    I got this when googling: CVA (Certified Valuation Analyst)
     
  7. DBA_Curious

    DBA_Curious New Member

    A CVA is a certified valuation analyst. They're professionals who consult on the value of a business or other asset. There are quite a few competing organizations but the CVA is one of the few that meets the IRS guidelines for being a qualified appraiser.

    You have to be a CPA to be a CVA however so it's just one of the many paths being a CPA may take you down.
     
  8. swisha2k

    swisha2k New Member

    maybe im missing something here but how will that help me? could I take it in GA (im in florida) then later practice in fl?
    hope im not sounding condescending. Thank you/
     
  9. DBA_Curious

    DBA_Curious New Member

    Ok, all of the advice I'm about to give is based on your use of the word 'practice', Because you wrote that, I assume you want to practice in a public capacity.

    Many states do have reciprocity but I wouldn't be surprised if FL requires you, even as an out of state applicant with a license from another state, to meet their requirements as if you were an initial applicant UNLESS you have been working as a public accountant for a given number of years.

    My $0.02? If you live in FL and don't plan to move to GA, I'd meet FL's requirements. In my case, I lived in one state, qualified in one state, and was licensed in one state and when I moved, I still had to submit transcripts, take a new ethics exam, resubmit experience forms, yadda yadda yadda.

    How is your state board of accountancy going to view you qualifying in GA when you have always lived in FL and then asking for FL reciprocity? My guess is they'd smile and say "Yes, that's nice but you'll need to meet all of our requirements as if you were a 1st-timer..."

    Now, here's one more thing - you may hear someone say "But what about practice privilege'. That's for CPA's who live and work in one state but have an out of state client they serve from their home office.

    That's not for people who actually live in the other state. If you live in a state, you go by their rules. In your case, you live in FL and want to practice in FL and you're a new applicant. The situation is clear - qualify in FL.

    The only time the GA thing might make sense is if you ONLY wanted it for a resume blurb and had NO INTENT on practicing in a public capacity. Only you would know if that's the case.

    And here's some final advice - and again this is because you want to be a CPA so this isn't snarky.

    You're coming to the wrong place for help. Go to the state boards for FL website and research. We can give opinions and what have you but the real answer is there. If you really want to be a CPA, you'll need to feel comfortable doing research and coming here for anything other than suggestions is akin to coming here for tax code interpretations.

    There may be some loophole on the FL website but as a burgeoning business expert, shouldn't you be the man to find it?

    Go get that CPA!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 10, 2008
  10. Paul S Rogers

    Paul S Rogers New Member

    DBA curious gave great advice. Wow, I been there and believe me he/she is a 100 per cent correct. I had a nursing license from Mississippi, but lived in Louisiana. Louisiana did not recognize the school I graduated from (University of the State of New York, later Regents College, now Excelsior University) as an approved school of nursing. I challenged the State of Louisiana based on the fact my school was NLN approved (National League of Nursing) and I passed the NCLEX exam. Bottom line, I lost my case after spending money for a lawyer etc. It was not until the Louisiana State Board of Nursing decided in their own time and terms to accept the nursing program from New York that I was allowed reciprocity.

    Save yourself some heartache and money. Do what the State of Florida says you must do. I am sure you have heard of the expression you “can’t fight city hall.” Well that goes double for the State.
     
  11. Vinipink

    Vinipink Accounting Monster

    You can fight them, but you have to pick your fights. When I was looking for the MBA in accounting to fulfill the CPA requirements, I was looking at some DETC alternatives, besides being as expensive as the local or online RA options, the Board was clear that may not accept National Accredited schools for the CPA requirements. So, to avoid this I went ahead register in a RA school.

    Even with the RA schools(imagine with DETC accredited degree),they gave me problems and according to them I was missing a class, I disagree and after months of writing emails and certified letters, they accepted all I presented them for CPA requirements. The sad thing is that after all this, I postpone the taking of the CPA exam and enrolled for the DBA in accounting(it is all good). Government is made so you can get discourage and give up due to bureaucracy. But if you hang to your guns, you can beat them.
     
  12. DBA_Curious

    DBA_Curious New Member

    Yeah but why do all that if all he has to do is take the introductory accounting courses he CLEP'ped.

    And don't forget - those people on the board aren't anonymous machines. They're CPAs from the state and some are very influential. Do you want to be that lugnut who fought the board of accountancy, all of whose members are also probably members of the state society, over a CLEP exam?

    Think about it. You could probably take those credits from LSU at $250 per class and get this whole thing resolved for $500 or you could spend months challenging something.

    And, in Vini's case, I'm assuming he referred to the code and found some way around the 'missing' class. If their code specifically forbids CLEP, you're not going to win that easily. It's one thing for someone to say "You're missing a class" and for Vini to reply "No, because it's stated XYZ in this code" and it's quite another for someone to say "Our code prohibits CLEP" and for you to reply "Oh well, I disagree with the code."
     
  13. Vinipink

    Vinipink Accounting Monster

    They are humans not gods and make mistakes, like they did in my case.
    It will depend on the circumstances and if you follow the rules then you will not have to follow other remedies.

    I just indicated that you have to pick your fights, but government can be beat, trust me I know, because I have beat them, I am aware that you cannot win them all. I also have indicated that I followed the rules and if you do, you have a case.
     
  14. Shawn Ambrose

    Shawn Ambrose New Member

    Many states have reciprocity agreements - so if you sit the exam in GA, you might be able to transfer into FLA.

    I'm not saying that you can, but you ought to look into the possibility.

    Shawn
     
  15. mhanrahan

    mhanrahan New Member

    Cva

    NACVA, which sponsors the designation, also has a similar designation for non-cpa's.

    There are 3 other organizations in the US the sponsor business appraisal designation. The Institute of Business Appraisers (IBA), The American Society of Appraisers (ASA) and the American Institute of CPAs (AICPA). The AICPA designation requires that you be a CPA. Canada has a business appraisal designation body, as well.

    After considering those appraisers I have worked, the materials each produces and requirements of each of the organizations, I would rate NACVA 3rd behind IBA and ASA. The AICPA is a johnny come lately to the valuation area.

    The IBA and ASA are the oldest business appraisal credentialing bodies, with NACVA 3rd and the AICPA 4th. It is interesting that the 2 oldest business appraisal groups do not require or even recommend the CPA for doing appraisal work.

    In many ways, being a CPA can hurt your performance in the valuation area since it is based on knowledge areas in Finance or Applied Economics.
     
  16. DBA_Curious

    DBA_Curious New Member

    That's interesting that you feel the way. How do you feel about CFA's who engage in business valuation? That's an emerging trend as well.

    The IRS has put all of these organizations on more or less equal footing with their guidelines. And CPA's are already trusted business consultants.

    While I can't disagree with your experience whatsoever, I do question the long-term movement of the field. It wouldn't surprise me to see CPA's taking more and more of that market.
     
  17. AV8R

    AV8R Active Member

    What kind of salary can a CVA expect. Does a CVA mostly do consulting work or do businesses seek out and hire CVAs to be on staff?
     
  18. mhanrahan

    mhanrahan New Member

    The accounting training many CPAs get can be a real bonus in the BV area, but the CPA alone is NOT adequate. Many CPAs seem to think it is. The worst BV reports I ever read were by CPAs, despite the fact that Rev Rule 59-60 has been around for a long time. And they still think the Treasury Method only values "goodwill".

    Often I hear that CPA stands for "Certified For Practically Anything". One reason I think the AICPA developed BV standards was to reign in all the CPA going off and doing valuations incorrectly. It is an attitude problem. I also observed that although there were BV standards out there, because the CPA was not forced to adhere to any (this is prior to the AICPA BV standards being developed), he did whatever the hell he wanted in the valuation.

    Yes, CPAs are trusted, but many have abused that trust by venturing into areas of expertise without getting the additional training.

    The CFA curriculum is more toward public company valuation, not private company valuation. And there are differences. I just finished reviewing a BV report done by some Ph.D. that was valuing a private company with $11 million in sales and he was using billion dollar publicly traded company data. When he performed his sanity checks, they all indicated the value he derived was too high, but he blew them off. The client knew the value was too high, but the appraiser was too lost in the methods and did not have other tools to address the concerns.

    I think the knowledge that both the CPA and CFA designations test can be very helpful in the area of private company valuations, but it is not nearly enough. To say that the one qualifies you for the other is like saying being a CPA qualifies you to be a CFA. It does not.

    Both the IBA and ASA have been offering their training and BV credentials for a long time. Neither require the CPA or CFA certificates to get the BV certificate. That's because, although the body of knowledge is similar in certain areas, it is different in many. Many ASA's I know also have their CFA - it can help, but it is not the proper training for private company valuations.

    NACVA, IBA, ASA and now the AICPA (as of Jan 2008) have BV standards. USPAP standards 9 & 10 speak to business valuation, as well. All of them pretty much support Rev Rule 59-60 in terms of BV development standards. Each are a little different in their reporting standards, which Rev Rule 59-60 does not have.

    Lest you think I have something against CPA's, I don't. I have been one for almost 30 years. I also hold CFE, CFP, CVA, and CMA (inactive) certifications and am a Master Certified Business Appraiser. I have also looked at the curriculum for and considered the CFA designation, but have decided not to pursue it at this time.
     
  19. Vinipink

    Vinipink Accounting Monster

    Wow!, I am thinking of Arthur Andersen a story of insane arrogance and greed.


    I have mix feelings about the CPA designation, it can be quite good but not as good as many wants us to believe (CPAs are not gods!). However, if I want to play, I will have to become one.
     
  20. mhanrahan

    mhanrahan New Member

    I have often said it was the CPA that got me the job, but my training in finance that allowed me to do the job.

    The CPAs have done a GREAT job of brand recognition and I think you should get your CPA, if that's what you want to do. It opens doors for you that otherwise might be closed. But it also sets up an expectation that you will be able to perform above average in what you are tasked, which may not be possible without additional training and effort on your part.

    As I reflect back on what I thought I knew as a young CPA (everything) compared to what I think I know and understand now (nowhere as much as I have hoped to), I gain greater understanding as to the impetuousness of youth. If I had only known then, what I know now ...... .

    I think being a CPA is kind of like being an Eagle Scout - it sends a message about what you are able to to, not necessarily what you will do. (I'm an Eagle, too). And, like in many other professional designations, to get it, you only meet the MINIMUM qualifications. What you do afterward, what you learn and how you grow as a professional are all up to you.
     

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