Any other accredited university that had a checkered past?

After going through the KW-WNU and Columbia Southern threads, now I'm wondering if there are other currently accredited universities that used to engage in deceptive practice prior to being accredited. Is California Coast or Ashworth U among these? Thanks!

 

Note that while Columbia Southern is now accredited by DETC, WNU is not presently accredited or even a candidate for accreditation. They have simply stated on their website that the process has been kicked off with a self review and discussions with HLC.

From what I have read on this (and other) DL boards, Cal. Coast was considered to be a mill (or at least "millish") prior to DETC.

Tom

 

I don't know if Ashworth has a history of deceptive practice, but by experience in a way they do, they tell you that they will do an evaluation to see what credits transfer only if you enrolled, when confronted as per why they don't do it before, to see whats transfer first, they completely ignore you, and this seen to be supported by the DETC because they have done nothing when informed about this.

Also to mention they are deceptive to students when the University indicates they have qualify instructors when they don't, DETC was email about this about 3 months ago and have done nothing.

Ashworth University hires people with either unaccredited degrees or fake degrees this is a example:Kathy McCollister, B.A., Columbus University ( www.columbusu.com. See faculty profile
http://www.ashworthuniversity.edu/about/college-faculty.html#M

 

I don't agree with this at all. CCU was insufficient in some obvious areas (assessment, mostly), but they've always offered an education to go along with one's degree.

CCU was the first non-residential school to have all of its programs approved by the State of California back when such approval meant something.


CCU had to make some improvements to get accredited by DETC, but that didn't make them "millish."

Now, AJU claiming WAUC accreditation prior to DETC accreditation....

 

Rich, Andrew Jackson University claimed to be accredited by the WAUC at one time?

 

Rich: "CCU ... always offered an education to go along with one's degree."

John: Not in the early days, when they were still California Western. I told, on another forum, the tale of the time when founder Neal told me that they had been a diploma mill in the early days, but no more. (Neal's son disputed this account, and stopped communicating with me, but I was there.)

 

So the GAO was way off base lumping them into their 2004 report on Degree Mills? See - http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d04771t.pdf

From this article:
"GAO special agent Paul DeSaulniers told The Seattle Times that California Coast University sold degrees for a flat fee.

In January, California Coast obtained federal accreditation from the Distance Education and Training Council, according to Sally Welch, the council’s assistant director. “It was a pretty questionable school for a lot of years,” she said. “They had to make a lot of changes.”"

How much education do you think they provided? How much education elevates a school above Mill status?

 

The DETC-accredited www.detc.org American Sentinel University www.americansentinel.edu , fka the American College for Computer and Information Sciences, fka American Institute for Computer Studies in its pre-accreditation days, is rumored by some of the old-timers around here to have had a checkered past.

 

It's funny you bring this up. I have been reviewing this report for a while now. It is full of holes. If you read the report carefully, the investigation took place between 2002 and 2004. I have CCU catalogs clearly showing required coursework. Further, CCU was approved to legally operate in California by BPPVE way before this investigation took place. Not the description of a diploma mill.

Page 3 of the report state the investigators contacted three schools, CCU was not one of them. I don't know, this whole thing does not add up. Further, a government employee who knowingly submits a UA degree for a job that requires an accredited degree should be the one at fault. According to some of my digging, the flat fee scenario does not add up according to the the GAO testimony time frame.

I have also received some documentation from a top level politician stating CCU was investigated by the FBI from approximately 1983 to 1986 along with 39 schools, and was determined "NOT BE A DIPLOMA MILL". I will not go into further details at this time.

Anyway, this is one of my newer projects. Now the that whole Texas THECB fiasco is cleared up, I am digging into this. I plan on submitting documentation I have accumulated to different politicians in the hopes that the online GAO report can have a simple notation that states "CCU was accredited 1/05". I would be happy with that one little notation on the online version of the report. If I get more, I get more.

If something happens, I will keep you posted. This stuff always takes a long time though, but I am like a bulldog.

Anyway, my intent is not to argue or defend. The fact is CCU is accredited now. Whatever happens after I submit my documentation is fine.

Take care,

Abner

 

I believe they were referring to the fact CCU did indeed have a "flat fee" for degree programs, but it was actually a one-price deal regardless of how long it took. The degrees were not "sold" in the sense that I give them money and I get the diploma, it was I pay them a set fee, and if it takes me longer than normal to earn the degree, I don't pay any more than the flat fee.

 

Hmm, interesting. Thanks for the insight Bruce. I may pick your brain later via pm. I think your contention lines up with the investigators ignorance towards DL matters, and the difference between "Flat fee to buy a degree with no courswork required", and what you are describing. Thus CCU was lumped in with diploma mills that did/do in fact sell degrees.

Thanks,

Abner

 

That is what I like about you Dr. Douglas. You can be critical, but you are also fair.



Abner

 

You, obviously, have that correct. I'm thinking of the CCU days, knowing that the Cal Western stuff was a lot more dodgy. (Including the story about their name.)

 

I don't know. You might try looking for schools that were in unaccredited operation for longer than ten years prior to accreditation, then looking at those schools' earlier histories.

Many of them were upfront about what they were doing, and reasonably credible at doing it, throughout their unaccredited histories. Others weren't. I'm not sure how many of the latter there are.

I don't recall Cal Coast ever selling diplomas or claiming fake accreditation. But I do think that it was seriously substandard in its earlier years. Clearly so when it was awarding potemkin Ph.D.s in every subject under the sun. Less so when it had specialized in a few high-demand subjects like business and psychology.

But reportedly there were still some doubtful practices such as awarding graduate credit for passing multiple choice exams. (Presumably to reduce faculty expenses, making assessment of students work a clerical or machine function.) Cal Coast never generated a conventional academic reputation (or even a niche reputation), despite its awarding doctorates. Graduates did pass the California professional licensing exams though, but not in great numbers. (Other state approved schools had better stats.)

If a school has a long unaccredited history before it's eventually accredited, it might be interesting to investigate what it was doing during all those early years.

 

I don't know that they had a checkered past, but I have read numerous complaints about Grantham University.

 

That sounds kind of like that flat rate thing Aspen University did not to long ago and I think they're doing it again for around $6K. Although I don't know if they waive the additional fees if you bomb a course but the pre-paid tuition option is a pretty steep discount at a one time payout.

 

I looked at Aspen's site, but didn't find a mention of a $6,000 deal.

It's too bad they no longer have the $4,500 MBA. That was a fantastic bargain.

 

No "checkered past." Grantham was one of the first schools accredited by DETC (then NHSC) to award the bachelor's. At one time, they were the only such-accredited school to do so.

 

You got that right. I was able to get my MBA pre paid deal at Aspen for $4,250.00!!!!! I love it!

Abner

 

During the mid 70s, California Western U. (Cal Coast's previous iteration before it was sued by the California Western School of Law) awarded a doctoral degree to a well-known local religious figure based on the fact that he had previously taken some doctoral level courses at an accredited university and had written a book two decades earlier (which was submitted to CWU as a "dissertation"). I always thought that this was a very "millish" thing to do.

It was pretty obvious that the California Coast University that achieved DETC accreditation three decades later had progressed far beyond its checkered California Western beginnings in the 70s.