Dilemma...Need Advice from the exerienced ones here.

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by soupbone, Mar 26, 2008.

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  1. soupbone

    soupbone Active Member

    To those of you that do not know me I'll give a brief intro and then move on to the guts of this. Professional Law Enforcement Official with nearly 13 years experience in just about every area (patrol, Investigations, etc.). For the past several months I have been exploring my options in the Distance Education world. I am not trying to skim on an education but I am trying to get through a bachelor's program as quickly as possible then move on to a masters program (or Law School) and take it slow and easy. In the meantime I have taken 15 courses through The Backup Training worth 9 hours of LE credit at North Idaho College. I have also completed 32 of the FEMA courses which is listed on another thread if you do a search of my name. I have been waiting on Mountain State University to evaluate all of my training, FEMA courses, etc. in order to see where I stand with their degree program in Organizational Leadership. MSU claims that you can complete their degree in 18 months if you finish all of the prereqs. That would leave you with 48 hours of core courses over 18 months. I am contemplating changing careers so I am trying to make sure I can choose a path that doesn't limit me. I am still considering Law School as well.

    In the meantime Pugbelly has been helping me come up with another game plan as well (thanks again). TESC appears to accept a vast majority of my FEMA courses and would apply it toward their AAS in Environmental, Safety and Security Technologies. The figuring we did today with all of my general ed courses leaves me with approximately this:

    English 200 Level (Probably CLEP it)
    3 hours humanities (art, music, religion, poetry)
    3 hours social science (psych, sociology)
    3 hours General Ed Elective
    3 hours free elective

    to finish my AAS and move on to my Bachelor's which at this point would be Bellevue (similar to what Pug is doing). Now Bellevue could potentially be completed in 15 months with their accelerated program. Also of note is that TESC accepts Penn Foster which means I could complete those remaining courses for their AAS quick.

    Now at Bellevue my interest is with two of their programs:

    Business Information Systems

    Computer Information Systems in Business

    These are a bit different than the potential one at MSU which is Bachelor of Science in
    Organizational Leadership -
    Criminal Justice Administration
    .

    So here is my dilemma guys. Here is my breakdown of credits given to me by MSU by the way so you can review it and comment:

    IS-3 Radiological Emergency Mgm 1.00
    IS-5 Intro Hazardous Material 1.00
    IS-8 Bldg for Earthquakes 1.00
    IS-139 Exercise Design 1.00
    IS-208 State Disaster Mgmt 1.00
    IS-230 Prin Emergnecy Mgmt 1.00
    IS-235 Emergency Planning 1.00
    IS-240 Leadership Influence 1.00
    IS-241 Decision Making & Prob 1.00
    IS-242 Effective Communication 1.00
    IS-244 Dev & Managing Volunteer 1.00
    IS-279 Engineering Prin & Practice 1.00
    IS-301 Radiological Emerg Response 1.00
    IS-386 Intro Res Coastal Const 1.00
    IS-650 Bldg Ptnrships Tribal Comm 1.00
    IS-100 Intro to ICS 0.50
    IS-700 NIMS 0.50
    IS-200 ICS Single Resources 0.50
    IS-800 Intro NRP 0.50 TOTAL = 17 Hours


    As it stands right now it looks like neck and neck they might be around the same time to finish. I'll evaluate cost next.

    MSU is $290 per credit hour. 48 X $290 = $13920 Now this is just for their core program. With their core program at 48 hours and my transfer of 44 credits into the program it still leaves me with 36 hours I need to fulfill while I'm in their program. Now the good thing is that they accept Penn Foster as well.

    The TESC/Bellevue route would be a hard number to figure out since I don't know how much it costs to transfer into TESC and complete their program. However Bellevue costs per credit hour $295. If I could transfer in with an AAS from TESC that would leave me with 60 credits to finish from them. 60 hours X $295 = $17,700. Now I obviously would have to figure out how much it would cost to get the AAS from TESC as well.

    So at face value it looks obvious that the TESC/Bellevue route would cost more. My main concern though is finishing as quickly as possible and moving into a masters program at one of the B&M Universities here. I still do not know what I want to major in but I am taking Bruce's advice and not worrying about it right now. I actually do have a third option as well.

    Red Rocks Community College accepts a huge chunk of the FEMA courses and they apply it toward an AAS in Emergency Management. It looks like I would only need to complete 5 courses (15 hours) through them and I would have that AAS done. Now here is where it gets interesting. They have a transfer agreement with Colorado Universities including Regis, CSU, etc. to accept all of the 60 hours toward a bachelor's degree. Now the confusing part is this. I am interested in Regis. Specifically this program in Computer Information Systems. If I read this correctly you move from your bachelor's directly into your masters program. The masters program in Computer Information Technology appears to be 24 hours in length IF you finish some prereqs through RRCC. Now this program is VERY expensive so I won't even try to debate the cost of this program.

    I want you guys to throw it all at me now. I still have some time to debate all of this but I really need your input. Which path do you think is the best one at this particular point? At this point I feel like getting an associates done would be an exciting first step. It is not my end goal though so I shouldn't place too much importance on it. I just know that I would feel good getting it done. MSU would require me to complete their core courses plus quite a few others in order to finish on time in 18 months. TESC/Bellevue sounds doable IF they accept all of the FEMA credits and it could possibly be done in 15 months plus the time it takes me to finish an English CLEP and 4 other courses through Penn Foster. The last option through RRCC sounds great as well because not only would I finish my AAS really quick but Regis offers a bachelor's/masters wrapped up in a neat (albeit expensive) package.

    So here it is in a nutshell. If you see some unsanswered questions ask me and I'll answer them. I really need your help and as always thank you for taking the time to read and comment. :)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 26, 2008
  2. truckie270

    truckie270 New Member

    Great post. If it were me and I could swing it financially I would go the RRCC/Colorado Universities route. From what I have heard Regis and some of the others have a good reputation if name recognition is a concern.
     
  3. soupbone

    soupbone Active Member

    Well financially I would just have to try and deal with it although I'm not quite sure we could. My wife is currently at the end of her second year of her MSW at a B&M here. No student loans either. We are paying out of pocket. She does work full time like me so it isn't too bad. RRCC wouldn't be that expensive. It starts with Regis at $435 a credit hour (ouch). I'm not sure if they have any payment options (like pay over time). Bellevue and MSU both have those types of payment plans which make them a little easier. The good part about Regis is that there doesn't appear to be a break in the action from bachelor's to masters. :)

    Found this on the Regis site. Not sure if it applies to their online programs though:

    Regis Payment Option (RPO)
    Making one large payment each semester for tuition expenses is becoming increasingly difficult for many students. Therefore, a convenient interest-free Regis Payment Option is offered to students enrolled in the Doctor of Physical Therapy and Regis College Undergraduate Programs who are enrolled in semester-based courses.

    Using the Regis Payment Option spreads all or part of the semester tuition expenses over 4 or 5 monthly payments and actually saves money by reducing monthly finance charges.

    The Regis Payment Option requires a non-refundable enrollment fee of $50 per semester to cover administrative costs. Interest is not charged on the plan balance. However, finance charges begin to accrue 30 days following the payment due date on late payment amounts. A $15 penalty is charged for each late payment.
     
  4. sentinel

    sentinel New Member

    What career are you contemplating post law enforcement? For the moment, let's assume you decide not to attend law school. Is there some field or area that you are passionate about?

    With your law enforcement background have you considered earning a degree which would allow you, educationally at least, to work in digital forensics? You could be employed by a law enforcement agency, the military, a corporation, or even provide consulting services? I am just tossing this out more as a means of getting you to think about what you'd like to study and how you intend to use your education.

    If law school is your ultimate goal, then an undergraduate degree in any subject will suffice.

    To your other point regarding Thomas Edison State College (TESC) you can apply once you have enough credit hours accumulated so that you can complete the remainder of the credit hours within one year. There is no need to take any courses from TESC as 100% of the credit hours can be transferred into the school. You could choose to earn an AAS and an AA from TESC before deciding the area in which to focus your BA or BS. Between the AAS and AA, provided you overlap as little as possible, could see you with a BA in about 2 years (maximum). TESC does not require any 300-level or 400-level courses to earn a BA.
     
  5. soupbone

    soupbone Active Member

    I actually finished the written part of my ENCE and I'm working on the practical right now. I've been doing computer forensics/data recovery for a few years now as well as my main job in Investigations. My passion is actually to work for Disney World in Orlando in either Set Design, Construction Management, Animatronics, and pretty much any part of Theme Park Design. Right now thought the advice I've been getting so far is to slow down and worry about finishing my bachelor's. I have time to think about my masters or the potential for Law School. The problem with me is that I have taken personality tests, career tests, etc. and they have guided me to certain career paths. Not surprisingly they have pointed me to Law Enforcement. I wouldn't have started this if I didn't have any interest in it and a love for it. However I feel like it might be time for a change. Considering my passion for Disney it didn't surprise me that my tests also showed things such as Engineering, Set Design, Construction Management. I also like computers and those relating fields as well. My entire problem is not being able to pick something and stick with it. I keep second guessing my decisions and every time I get close to moving forward I get scared I'm not making the right choice and I end up backing out. With so many different options available to us this decision is very hard to make. The three options I posted above seem to be the closest I've come to getting at least an associates and bachelors done. I think this is why Bruce suggested I slow down and get the associates/bachelors done then worry about the masters after. The reason being is that if I keep second guessing myself I'll be sitting here years from now debating these same issues with nothing to show for it. Although I haven't been ile at all. I've managed to finish 32 FEMA courses and several of The Backup Training courses for Law Enforcement which are worth credit at North Idaho College. So overall this is where I am right now trying to get over this huge hump. Once I do that it will be smooth sailing for me. I just need to commit and do it soon. Thanks for your comments... :)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 26, 2008
  6. pugbelly

    pugbelly New Member

    Let me start by saying that none of the options you listed appear to be bad. That said, let me clarify some of the costs associated with TESC and Bellevue. TESC will run you about $2500 to enroll and graduate assuming you transfer in 100% of the courses and graduate within 1 year of enrollment. Bellevue is actually $320 per credit, but you don't have to do 60 credits with them. You'll need to take 36 hours for the major and a required 9-hour "Kirkpatrick Series" for a total of 45 hours. 45 x $320 = $14,400. Bellevue requires a total of 127 hours to graduate. They accept your associates degree as meeting all core requirements, so after completing 45 hours with them you would have a total of 105 hours (60 in your associates degree plus 45 from Bellevue). The remaining 22 hours needed to graduate would be free electives since all the core and all the major requirements will have been met. You can use additional FEMA and NFA courses to satisfy most, if not all of the additional elective requirement, or take classes from anywhere that are affordable and interesting.

    As far as advice goes, there is no question in my mind that TESC offers you the fastest route to the AAS with the credits you already have in place, if in fact you want or need the associates degree rtaher than going straight to the BA/BS. Any of the universities you are considering will be fine for what you need, so I would suggest choosing the one that you think offers the best balance between cost, time, professional need, and personal interest. The big advantage to Bellevue is that they will not only accept all 60 credits in your AA (or AAS), they accept it as meeting all of their own core requirements. What this means to you is that you will not have to take additional general education courses as you would if you transferred the TESC AAS into other university programs. Instead you will have the freedom to take classes that interest you, have meaning to you, or are simply the least expensive classes you can find in any area of study.

    Just to clarify, the AAS degree from TESC that will allow you the most FEMA credit is the Occupational Studies with the Emergency Management option.

    Pug
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 26, 2008
  7. soupbone

    soupbone Active Member


    Thanks for the input Pug. My belief is that finishing an associates would be a major boost to my confidence right now. I just know that my main goal is to get done and start a masters. Sometimes I find myself being impatient about finishing a degree and I think that getting an associates done will serve to slow me down a bit. I wanted to add this one to my list as well. I'm interested in this degree path: Security Management
    It looks like a very interesting program. Either way I hope I make the right decision. Hopefully in the next few days I can commit to one and follow through. :)
     
  8. pugbelly

    pugbelly New Member


    I am also impatient which is why I went after the AAS first. I spent so much time researching all of the different possibilities that I lost valuable time that I could have been spending taking classes. The best decision I ever made was actually making a decision.

    The Security Management degree at BU looks very good. I actually considered it myself.

    Pug
     
  9. soupbone

    soupbone Active Member

    This is EXACTLY my problem. I've spent way too many months finding other programs and each one seems to have positives and negatives. In doing all of this however I've only been taking the FEMA courses and the Backup Training courses. All in all it hasn't been a total waste but I surely haven't committed to a degree plan. :)
     
  10. sentinel

    sentinel New Member


    American Public University System (AMU/APU) offers a Bachelor of Arts in Security Management. APUS offers a generous transfer-in credit policy including acceptance of NA and RA credit hours. FEMA courses can be transferred into the degree.
     
  11. soupbone

    soupbone Active Member

    I might consider them. I wonder though how their transfer policy is in reference to associates degrees. I've pretty much decided to get my associates quickly done since I appear to be around 12 hours shy of one. Now I need to decide if I'm going to go through TESC, Red Rocks CC, or Guam CC for my associates. Hmm.... ;)
     
  12. sentinel

    sentinel New Member

    APUS accepts 45 credit hours towards an associate degree and 90 credit hours towards a bachelor degree and 15 credit hours towards a masters degree. In your situation, you could enroll in an AA and be done in 10 months @ 1 8-week course at a time for 5 courses (15 credit hours). Taking multiple courses concurrently is very time-consuming. Earning an AA as quickly as possible through testing out the remaining 12-15 credit hours might be more advantageous. In any event, check the general education requirements for an AA at APUS; perhaps they'd waive some of the general education requirements if you transferred in with a completed AA/AS.

    For undergraduate courses the course tuition includes the textbooks which are shipped free of charge as well.
     
  13. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator

    Whoever is cheapest and quickest. :)
     
  14. soupbone

    soupbone Active Member


    Pugbelly says around $2500 for TESC.
    GCC would be a whole lot cheaper. I don't know why but they charge really low rates per credit hour ($90 a credit hour 15 X $90 = $1350) and also only charge a $30 flat rate to take the FEMA credits. The only problem with GCC is that I don't know what universities would take the full degree transfer (they are RA). RRCC would require 15 hours to be taken through at $357.25 an hour. 15 X $357.25 = $5358.75. This is quite a bit more expensive than TESC and GCC. The only difference to me is that RRCC has an articulation agreement with most of the Colorado Universities to accept all 60 credits from RRCC. Now Bellevue accepts all 60 from TESC as well but I wonder if any other universities accept all of the credits from TESC. That would be a huge deal maker for me because of the price and I could explore other universities although I do like 3 of the Bellevue programs. :)
     
  15. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator

    All of the likely suspects (TESC, etc.) will probably accept any RA credits in transfer, provided they fit into your degree program. Some schools place a limit on transfer credits at 90 but TESC will accept the entire 120 in transfer provided at least a portion (30 I believe) are upper-level credits from a 4-year school.
     
  16. pugbelly

    pugbelly New Member


    I really like APUS and I've talked to them at length. APUS is like most colleges in that it will not accept an associates degree in transfer. APUS will request transcripts and will match the courses on your transcripts to its own core and elective requirements. So even if you have an associates degree, if APUS has a communications requirement and your degree doesn't have a communications course, you still have to take communications. If APUS has 9 hours of social sciences as a requirement and your associates degree only has 6 hours, you will still need 3 more hours of social science, etc. To the best of my knowledge, Bellevue is the only RA school that accepts your associates degree as meeting all core requirements.

    APUS only accepts FEMA credit if transcripted through FCC.

    Pug
     
  17. pugbelly

    pugbelly New Member

    Doesn't GCC have a requirement that you do 30 hours of course work with them? Most colleges do...that is what sets schools liek TESC, Excelsior, and COSC apart. If you have to take 30 gours with GCC even though you may only need 12, how inexpensive are they?

    Pug
     
  18. japhy4529

    japhy4529 House Bassist

    I would check with RRCC regarding their transfer agreement. On the transfer agreement site, it states that they have transfer agreements for their AA or AS degrees. There is no mention of the AAS degree as meeting the transfer agreement. Check it out, before you commit to the program.

    Good luck!
    - Tom
     
  19. soupbone

    soupbone Active Member


    The person I spoke with on the phone a week ago said that it was 15 hours. I would obviously double check and make sure before I committed. I'm leaning towards TESC for my Associates but like I said I want to make sure I actually get a bachelors I enjoy. ;)
     
  20. pugbelly

    pugbelly New Member

    It could be 15 hours, and that would put them in the running for sure. Most colleges require 30, even at the associates level. I know Liberty requires 15...that's good to know about GCC. You'd have to look at your existing credit to see how it would transfer into Guam's cirriculum. If it all transferred in like it would at TESC, GCC could be your least expensive option. Does GCC offer accelerated classes? I know speed is a concern for you as well as cost.

    Pug
     

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