RA’s don’t actually discriminate against DETC it turns out;just no one had asked them

There are six regional creditors. We sit around here typing that there is some bias from them against DETC credits and DETC degree’s as teaching credentials. So, I went ahead and contacted the president of the RA for my geography.

Why do you discriminate against DETC I asked?

What are you talking about, she responded.

Oh, I said, this horrible bias against DETC degree’s that you are fostering by not allowing your accredited institutions to use them as teaching credentials.

That isn’t true, she said, why did I think this? Had I bothered to read any of her published accreditation principles or standards?

Well no, I said, but gee everyone knows about it.

Read this, she said. See where it doesn’t say anything about what you are talking about, but just says that each institution is responsible for employing competent qualified faculty?

Yes, I see that, I said.

Huh. anything else, she asked?

Well, this seems to be interpreted by each institution to mean RA degrees..

Interesting, she said.

Yep, I think it is interesting, I said.

Yep, she said.

Yep, I said.

Any other questions? She asked.

No, I said, hope you have a happy new year.

 

Which RA did you contact?

 

SACS..........

 

The notion that the RA's prevent their member schools from accepting NA credits and degrees is a myth, IMHO. I'm not surprised at what David found.

I wouldn't be surprised if there is an increase in such acceptance over time, largely because DETC's footprint has grown and its schools have educated and graduated so many students.

Or not. YMMV.

 

I've often wondered whether that's been more of a de facto thing with the schools rather than a de jure requirement of the accreditors. It might be worthwhile to compare the regulations of each of the accreditors.

 

I'd be willing to bet that if you contacted all six RA accreditors you'd probably get a similar response. You'd also get the same response from the U.S. Department of Education and CHEA, who actually recognize RA and NA accreditation.

I am assuming WASC doesn't have a disriminatory policy against NA graduates wanting to teach higher education. I am on the adjunct faculty for my local community college in Northern California and they most definitely had to verify my educational creditials, which is a bachelor's and master's at an NA institution.

I think some of the bias as to do with being that many RA universities have been around a lot longer than the NA institutions. As time progresses this bias will diminish.

 

As what i can see from here. It's not the RA agencies who's discriminating the DETC or NA degrees. But it's the (RA) Universities who are discriminating the NA accreditation.

 

Very similar to the AACSB and business schools. The AACSB does not require a business doctorate to be AACSB accredited for teaching purposes. Yet many AACSB schools do require it. SACS does not.

 

One thing to keep in mind, universities benchmark themselves against peer institutions. There is a definate bias toward hiring faculty trained at an institution they consider to be at the same or higher tier as faculty at their peer institutions. Most RA schools would not consider DETC institutions to be peers. The passage of time may fix this.

With few exceptions, AACSB institutions do not regard non-AACSB institutions as peers. RA, but non-AACSB doctorates have limited utility relative to a doctorate from an AACSB instititution. Since no DETC institution has AACSB accreditation, there is definately a bias against DETC-educated facutly at AACSB schools.

While the accreditation agencies' standards don't discriminate against DETC degrees, in practice accreditation review teams evaluate faculty using the faclty at the reviewee's peers as a benchmark. This exacerbates the bias against DETC degrees.

 

Moral of the story: when in doubt, just ask. The most they can do is say "no".

There IS a bias of RA schools accepting transfer credits and degrees from NA schools, and employers accepting degrees from NA and certain RA schools (UoP and DeVry). Then again, there are plenty that do NOT discriminate.

 

Therein lies the real story; the regional accreditors aren't really concerned about DETC or other recognized accreditors, it's the RA schools themselves who throw up the roadblocks.

 

It has been posted here numerous times since the birth of this forum: accreditors are not responsible for non acceptance of degree or course transfer and do not prohibit almost anyone "qualified" from teaching at an RA institution. It is and has always been the purview of the institution to do what they determine is appropriate with regards to this practice. Just read the accreditor guidelines, standards, and policies. It is all right there.

Having said that, as a previous administrator for an online university, I can tell you that most administrators are both ignorant and scared to death of the accrediting commissions and what might happen of they even perceive impropriety. The lack of acceptance of nationally degreed faculty candidates is not driven by an accreditation standards, it is driven by ignorance, fear, and strong RA bias by institution administrators.

Most of what people assume are RA requirements are in reality institutional decisions. But is is a club and that has its dynamics.

 

Bruce gets it.

 

It is certainly time for someone to replicate the research that I did in 2000, in which I surveyed registrars and admissions officers of RA schools, asking, among many other things, if they accepted DETC and other national accreditation always, usually, sometimes, rarely, or never.

As I have reported many times, roughly 20% said 'always' and 20% said 'usually.' More than half said 'rarely' or 'never.'

My hypothesis is that acceptance has increased since then . . . but I believe we don't know, and it would be so easy to find out.

(After years of urging others to do that research, I finally did it myself, spending over $3,000. Someone else can do it next time. Perhaps if someone is looking for a nice Master's thesis research project.)

 

Now that I understand this I can see that each school is a case by case negotiation. The NA vs RA debate is a trend not a rule. I didn’t realize this until communicating with the president of SACS. I’ve already contacted my local CC’s presidents to ask him to help me understand their policy. I think if more people do this, understanding that you are dealing with the decision maker at each institution, we can change some perceptions and opportunities.

As said above, the worst they can do is say no.

 

If someone does do this, I would ask that they include an additional question, which is why the policy is one way or another, and if it has changes recently.

 

Dr. Bear;

I'd like to give this a shot. Could you provide your method and maybe something along the results or data? Would this sort of thing be publishable somewhere?

 

The roadblocks are caused simply by two things:
1. Higher education is a very conservative place.
2. Most educators don't have NA degrees

I am finding the same sort of issue in regards to business doctoral programs. AACSB schools hire AACSB graduates. Its just the way it is, and it's not going to change any time soon. Regardless what anyone here would like to think, you won't be part of the "club".

The wheels move slowly in higher education.

 

And even then, it might not be the final answer. Such things are often negotiable, if taken to the right person. An admissions officer might feel compelled to follow the school's written procedures, but others at the school might feel more free to make an independent decision.