Canucks studying in the US (dl) and the CRS (Canada Revenue Service (US's IRS))

Well.... I just received a nice letter from CRS (Canada Revenue Service) and they wanted a TL11A completed from FHSU - since I claimed full-time student status (taking 4 courses / semester year round, - this past summer I only took two, but I dare think I qualify). The top of the TL11A states that there are three criteria:

1) Courses must be at least 13 weeks in duration - CHECK
2) Courses taken must lead to a degree - CHECK
3) Courses can not be taken via the internet or distance learning - SCREECH!

WTH?!?! I'm a full-time student pursuing a degree that is recognized US / Canada wide and Mr Taxman tells me that because I work full-time and am pursuing a degree via DL (online in my case) I'm not entitled to a break??? But if I'm 20 and go to a BM school, or take night classes which I physically have to attend I get a break?

Why must courses be 13 weeks in length? The summer semester is eight weeks in duration and 13 weeks worth of material are crammed into these eight short weeks... if the University deems those summer courses good enough to give full credit for, why is the CRS trying to short-change us?

OK - I got FHSU to fill out the TL11A and forwarded it off to CRS - now awaiting their verdict... worst case scenario I will have to pay back a good chunk of money.

I can not believe that the dark ages are still rampant within the taxation system and wonder if there are any CDN tax lawyers here who could help out? I think this would be a fight worth taking on - it should not matter whether courses taken are done via DL or attended at a BM - what should matter is that they are taken from an accredited institution. Period.

 

same

Hi

I had the same problem. I learned to live with the issue though. While I was working towards my DEd from the University of South Africa I never received a break. I was working full time for the Canadian Navy in Canada and overseas and spent all my free time either ashore or on board ship working on the chapters and research but no break. Until the members of Parliament can understand the reasoning for DL and how it works and that it has value for Canada, there will be no movement.

Sorry for you frustration.

Brad

 

This is an issue which parliament needs to address given the growing transition towards life-long learning. Perhaps writing your member of parliament might be a first step to raising awareness about the inequity in current taxation regulations.

 

BlueMason,

You can try to fight it or do as I did (DL - MBA program claim) and site two references that went to court from Canadian students at U of Phoenix (PhD research?) and Touro U, both as distance education and no attendance. I claimed mine successfully because I was studying full-time, 6 week module too, and convinced them that I would take them to court. My good friend is a CRA guy and he agreed that I would win it. The judge in the one case agreed that the government was no longer in tune with the times and allowed his full claim. I don't have access to the info right now but this is becoming common knowledge in DL. If FHSU will fill out your TL11A form stating that your program is offered "full-time" you will definitely win this one.

Good luck,
MP

 

Ok....

Ok, first off CRA is clear they don't take online schools (hey competition to Canadian Schools).

If you want, PM me a firm I work with in Toronto has represented people on these matters but CRA are quite clear what they want and will accept.


Geoff

 

If you believe that, fine, my modules were 6 weeks, not a problem, 100% on-line, not a problem, as long as the school that fills out the TL11A states that their program meets the "full-time" equivalent status and you site the two cases that went thru the Provincial court system and were awarded full-time status ................ worked for me and many others who took the time to challenge the system. Why would they turn you down when two others were approved for DL programs?

As the judge stated in his conclusion, "The government is not keeping up with the times when it comes to education", sounds about right to me. I'm pleased with the decision!

"Ok, first off CRA is clear they don't take online schools (hey competition to Canadian Schools)."

(Not even remotely true.) Just because they make some outdated statements doesn't mean they'll stand the test of the judicial system. In this case, they failed to hold up in court.

 

FHSU filled out the TL11A and yes, they put in full-time, for Summer, Fall and the Spring semester!

I just faxed the TL11A last week, so I'm sure I'll hear something back before too long..

morgan8 - do you by any chance have those cases handy? I'd love to cite case-law!!

 

BlueMason,

I do believe you will win this as long as you weren't working full-time while you studied. I don't recall you saying that you worked less than full-time hours? Which province are you in?

I will look for those case studies when I get back to the location where that information resides. The info that I did give you regarding the two schools anf the fact that they went to Ontario Provincial court, that is completely true. I'll try to find the copy. Good luck!

 

Oh yes... work full-time, school full-time, not to mention a dad! What... is this another case of where hard working screws you over?

 

It does not look like eligibly for the part-time Education Credit was ruled out. It is not much but it is $120 per month vs. $400 per month for fulltime. The rules for the border state universities are similar to that of the Canadian, so that could be an avenue to pursue. The stress and cost of dealing with a CRA audit; I am not sure if deduction of tuition fee is worth it.

Thanks
Okydd