Accreditation

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by Robert, Sep 21, 2001.

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  1. Robert

    Robert New Member

    Will accrediting agencies that are not regional but recognized by the DOE and CHEA eventually be more generally accepted?
     
  2. Chip

    Chip Administrator

    Ah! A million dollar question. If you're talking about the bogus ones, such as the World Association and the Central Consortium, these will probably never be recognized in a million years.

    DETC, on the other hand, has a chance of earning greater respectability *IF* they learn from the mistakes they made by accrediting several less-than-wonderful programs and improve their process, considering the reputation and marketing of a program, and having better oversight in academic quality, in addition to other factors. (Their own policies require this, but as has been shown in the past, they are routinely ignored.)

    When DETC schools are consistently thought of as academically equivalent to RA schools (right now, some are, and many probably are not), then it will be easier to gain acceptance.
     
  3. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member


    Things in traditional higher education sometimes move at a glacial pace. My recent conversations with admissions officials of several prominent nontraditional RA schools made it clear that DETC accreditation wasn't even on their radar scope, and they would seem the most likely to recognize other forms of accreditation.

    DETC accreditation answers a very important--if naive question--"Is it accredited?" It seems to have value in the workplace, especially in the military. But I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for DETC to become the equivalent of the "7th regional."

    Rich Douglas
     
  4. Robert

    Robert New Member

    I was also wandering about Christian accrediting agencies such as TRACS, and AABC, ATS?
     
  5. Guest

    Guest Guest

    ATS (graduate level) and AABC (undergrad level) are the given forms of accreditation when a religious school moves beyond RA. Some AABC schools do not have RA, but I am personally not aware of any ATS schools which do not also enjoy RA (although there may indeed be some).

    TRACS schools, however, which now have both USDoE and CHEA recognition, are probably not accepted as the equivalent to RA, AABC or ATS. If TRACS is able to maintain both USDoE/CHEA recognition, I would think that the acceptance level of a TRACS degree would gradually increase.

    Russell
     
  6. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

    There is at least one very good one in Mississippi: Wesley Biblical Seminary, a residential Free Methodist seminary that might, at some point, begin offering online degree or certificate programs (there were plans to this effect in the works at one point, I think). If I were to go for a residential M.Div. at this point, it would be through Wesley (even though I would easily be the most liberal guy there).

    Peace,

    ------------------
    Tom Head
    www.tomhead.net

    co-author, Bears' Guide to the Best Education Degrees by Distance Learning (Ten Speed Press)

    co-author, Get Your IT Degree and Get Ahead (Osborne/McGraw-Hill)
     
  7. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

  8. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Time will tell on TRACS. I am wondering if they will eventually replace AABC accreditation. Both are DoE & CHEA but TRACS can accredit doctoral programs and so may be of more utility to a school.

    As has been said before only RA is RA. I know a Chaplain who went to K-State for an additional Masters degree. He told me that K-State told him his AABC accredited undergraduate degree was *not* accredited and therefore he would need to take extra classes. This caused the guy some stress due to the military only allowing a limited amount of time to complete the additional Masters.

    As a side note TRACS is as good as RA and ATS as far as the military chaplaincy is concerned as long as it was residential. That does not mean you may not take some barbs from other chaplains. ANother chaplain I know had an ORU M.Div which is RA and very respectable as far as charismatic theology. He told me he got ribbing about it being a "correspondence/homestudy" M.Div (which it was not).

    Personally, I like the idea of TRACS and what it stands for and therefore wish them well. However, one needs to evaluate the degree/accreditation based on where you want to use it. This can even be said of RA degrees. An Episcopal priest (High Church) made unfavorable noises about my idea of taking classes at RA Liberty. He did look positively on Fuller.

    North

     
  9. barryfoster

    barryfoster New Member

    I wouldn't bet my time, money and reputation on TRACS or DETC making any noticable gains in degree portability and acceptance. TRACS and DETC may accredit some OK schools, but the degree will be limited - big time. Why throw the dice with your education and career? Vegas has better odds.

    But you know me: It's RA or the highway! I lose in Vegas too. :)

    Barry Foster
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    RA is the gold standard without question. DETC & TRACS are somewhat limiting. Again. DETC may work for some jobs (eg the State accepts them for employment where I am BUT not for licensure etc). TRACS may work for some denominations or for those who simply want an accredited doctorate. For example, TRACS accredited ACCS (formerly ABCS) has an interesting looking 60 credit hour D.Min in Christian Counseling for those with an MA. It combines theology classes with christian counseling courses. That would work for an established pastor or someone who is a psychotherapist. Would it get you a faculty post at Dallas Theological Seminary. Probably not. So you would need to weigh convenience, cost, subject matter, and future plans.

    North

     
  11. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I agree that a TRACS degree will not enjoy the same level of recognition/acceptance as either RA or ATS. For some, the degree will suffice and meet their particular needs. For others, the TRACS degree will have limited utility.

    Just as DL has slowly been integrated into mainstream academe, with some heartily embracing it and others snubbing their nose at the very concept, I think TRACS degrees (if they maintain USDoE/CHEA recognition) will have a higher percentage of acceptance in the future.

    But, along with Barry, I must say that RA (or its foreign equivalent) is the most acceptable route to take.

    BTW Barry, Playing the odds at Vegas is like listing a degree mill degree on one's CV. 98% of those who do eventually lose!!! [​IMG]

    Russell
     
  12. barryfoster

    barryfoster New Member

    Before I start, let me say that North is one of my heroes!

    "The only constant in life is change." Nobody knows the future. Nobody knows what career choice changes they might make tomorrow. I may think a TRACS or DETC degree will work for me today. I've really no clue about tomorrow.

    I encourage folks to keep their options as open as possible. Don't fall for the easy way or the supposed shortcut. Really, this is my major point.

    Both DETC and TRACS are limited. After you earn your degree, you will *always* run across a good number of institutions and people who understand accreditation and know the difference between these and RA. *YOU* are the one who lives with it. You may be able to call yourself a Master or a Ph.D., but others won't. They'll be talking about matchbook covers instead.

    Barry Foster

     
  13. Robert

    Robert New Member

    I wonder if there are any professors out there that come from TRACS accredited schools?
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I have not seen any, other than an occasional D.Min. from Luther Rice Seminary. However, one of the issues is that all of the TRACS schools which offer doctorates offer D.Min.'s which are not a normal track for professorhood. With Oxford Graduate School likely to achieve candidacy they will be the first with a Doctor of Philosophy degree. They require short on campus sessions in addition to independent study. So it may happen. Their D.Phil is focussed in areas of integrating religion and society.

    North

    I wonder if there are any professors out there that come from TRACS accredited schools?

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  15. Guest

    Guest Guest

    What is the status on this, North? And does TRACS accreditation (USDoE/CHEA approval)cover the Ph.D.? If so, this will indeed be a first.

    Russell
     
  16. Guest

    Guest Guest

    My understanding from what has been posted here previously (and what the school indicated) is that candidacy is expected in November.

    I also understand that TRACS can accredit Doctor of Philosophy programs. This will indeed be a new venture for them. It will be interesting to see if this causes the development of other Ph.D. programs. I think that Tennesse Temple University would be a good candidate for doing something like that. They have a good solid reputation and could probably develop a solid Ph.D. program.

    North

     
  17. Robert

    Robert New Member

    What would it take for a school that offers a DMin degree to add a PHD program? Also Do you know of any TRACS school that are considering adding or have a PHD program?
     
  18. Guest

    Guest Guest

    At this time there are no TRACS accredited schools offering the Ph.D., however, Oxford Graduate School will become the first--if they receive TRACS candidacy in November.

    Russell
     
  19. Robert

    Robert New Member

    Iunderstand that Oxford seems to be able to carry their PHD into the TRACS arena. What i wonder is why are more schools that are TRACS accredited establishing PHD programs. Is it true that ACCS had to drop their offering of a PHD to get TRACS accreditation? (Sorry for rambling)
     
  20. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I do not know the answer but here is a suppostition. Oxford will be the first with a Ph.D. under the TRACS umbrella. Others like ACCS prior to TRACS did have a number of different doctoral titles. When I contacted ACCS (UBSS) a few years ago the person I spoke with said they had been required by TRACS to drop some of these (down to D.Min). What I think is that TRACS was being very cautious themselves as they were just getting off the ground. At one point as Steve shares there were some concerns with TRACS. They quickly readjusted and have apparently done very well since. In fact LRS published something from the review of TRACS by the Dept of Ed. a couple of years ago and they were given glowing comments on their methodology and of course they are now CHEA recognized. So I think it has been a matter of caution. Midwest Theological Seminary used to offer a DCM (Doctor of Christian Music) and they also now offer only a D.Min. Oxford was probably a good test candidate for Ph.D. accreditation. Their porgram looks pretty solid and requires residencies. As I said I would not be surprised if another such as TTU were to offer a Ph.D. eventually.

    I am excited about TRACS and its possibilities. How their accredited Ph.D.'s will be accepted is an unknown at this point. Oxford's may have a leg up because of the name [​IMG]

    North

     

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