Value of MBA after being unused for 6 years

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by furball, Oct 21, 2006.

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  1. furball

    furball New Member

    Value of MBA after being unused for 6 years

    All,

    I'm looking for opinions on the value of an MBA that will not be used for "business operations" until 2015.

    Background: I am an active duty military officer at the end of my commitment (I could leave for civilian life now at age 33), but my wife and I are leaning on "staying in" the military, probably until I am able to retire ~8.5 years from now in 2015. I am currently applying to the University of Nebraska Distance MBA program. If accepted, I will get my MBA 2009-2010. However, I will not be able to retire (at age 41) from the military until 2015. I am very interested in learning about business and investments. I hope to start a second career with an IT / Technology company after my military time is up (I'm also a huge tech tech lover / geek. I considered a MS in Tech Management but am going with an MBA to gain broad business foundation.)

    While I am sure that I will use some leadership and management ideas learned in an MBA program in the military, there won't be much Return on Investment calculations and other such things going on while I'm doing my daily job or deployed.

    SO here are the questions:

    1) How will an employer look at my situation in terms of my MBA value: Age 41, good military career, MBA earned 5-6 years ago. Will it be low / med / high importance. I have a feeling the MBA earned 5 years ago will take on lower importance than if I had recently received my degree (within the last year or so) and was applying for the same job.

    2) Given the above situation, how important are Top 20 MBA school/AACSB accreditation issues versus having having an MBA from a RA school. I’m fairly familiar with the AACSB and Top 20 B-Schools networking arguments. Also, the MBA degree must be complete in 2 years, by the end of 2008 (for military promotion purposes).

    3) Your choice: what would you do in my case (the 3 options I’m debating)

    A. U. Nebraska Distance MBA (completely online, AACSB, some “brand recognition” nationally being a large state school) = ~$7-8k out of pocket (after mil tuition assistance)

    B. Touro University Int’l (RA, online, no “name recognition” nationally)= NO COST TO ME, paid for 100% by mil tuition assistance, and only 18 months req. vs. 2 years

    C. Part-time MBA at local school wherever I end up stationed next to gain networking contacts for after I retire = unknown costs and more time restraints.

    Huge post I know, let me know what you would do. I value all opinions, thank you for reading this.

    Furball
     
  2. Han

    Han New Member

    1) I think it will be looked upon well. You have had time to digest the concepts, and hopefully apply some of these concepts. I think it will be helpful if you could illistrate how ou have used it - such as special projects, specific examples of using the knowledge you have obtained would be very beneficial.

    Being fresh out of school could actually hurt you, not help.

    2) Given the above situation, how important are Top 20 MBA school/AACSB accreditation issues versus having having an MBA from a RA school. I’m fairly familiar with the AACSB and Top 20 B-Schools networking arguments. Also, the MBA degree must be complete in 2 years, by the end of 2008 (for military promotion purposes).

    I am a minority here about the need for professional accreditation, but I would say go AACSB. Some employers (like mine in Aerospace), did not recognize RA only at the graduate level, and it needed to have AACSB for reimbursement and recognition.

    3) A.

    Being mid career and having all the assets it seems you will have, it could be a huge asset. We had a mid-career (40ish) person, who came to our aerospace company (where we are most working with g'ment), he came in consulted for about 6 months, then became a director right off.

    I do not know how other industries look at military, but I know public sector companies that work with government, you will have an advantage.

    Good luck!
     
  3. furball

    furball New Member

    Thanks

    Han,

    Thanks for the quick reply. It's nice to see this forum is quite active.

    1) I agree, I'll definitely have to translate military-speak and mil-specific projects into "normal" terms. I'm realizing how important that is right now.

    2) I'm curious why you say that you are in a minority about AACSB accred. I haven't read ALL thread in this forum, but it seemed to be split 50/50 on the pro's and con's of RA vs. AACSB (in fact, in my readings, it seemed to tilt towards AACSB with the argument being that it "couldn't hurt"). DO you know many people besides yourself that have jobs outside academia that required AACSB accred. from their MBAs?

    3) Copy all. That's what I was afraid of! :) I'm steeling myself for the GMAT and 2 hard years of online work after I get back from flying each day.

    Thanks again for your time. Looks like my future MBA home just blew their lead against Texas in the last 2 minutes of the game. I'll try not to take that as a bad sign.
     
  4. fortiterinre

    fortiterinre New Member

    These are great questions. Most military officers earn their graduate degrees to qualify for a promotion, so it is expected that the MBA will not be "new" when you actually retire. Your final years in service are your best chance of showing how the MBA helped you.

    1) Definitely translate "military-speak" and "mil-specific projects" into "normal" terms--be specific and always note dollar amounts, number of staff supervised, and percentage increases/decreases when you can. One of the great things about the military is that you might be responsible for millions of dollars and dozens of staff more than you would be in a small civilian firm.

    2) If it's a minority re: AACSB accreditation, then I am even more in that group. Go AACSB and aim for the biggest, most prestigious school you can get into. Big public school MBA programs are ideal. There are lots of small school MBAs that simply won't do all that much for you, especially if you expect to be mobile post-military. There are 25 year-olds with these McMBAs who basically do clerical work.

    3) Do your best on the GMAT and retake it if you have to. Nebraska is a great school and the name will be good anywhere. An MBA from there will never be questioned as to its worth.

    Good luck!
     
  5. Han

    Han New Member

    Re: Thanks

    There are a few of us here that are strong believers in professional accreditation, but there are a few more that think RA is OK. I can see the argument if you are not going into academia, but I fell into the category of an employer who demanded AACSB. Especially for the MBA, where there are so many options, why not go that way, is what I say.

    From what I have been told - here and other places - in general most HR departments don't understand accreditation standards, but I fell into one that did. Now, I am glad I went that way, since I rolled into a doctorate program, and eventually teaching. My options are open, which is nice.

    Good luck - I would suggest checking with the schools you are applying how they calaulate getting in - if it is a straight calculation (GPA X GMAT score), you can know up front what you need to do - and take a practice test and see if it is feasible.

    Good luck!!
     
  6. furball

    furball New Member

    Great comments

    Hans / fortiterinre,

    Good points to ponder. I'm eager to start the U. of Nebraska program. Hopefully 2 courses per term will be workable with my full-time career. Thanks for your quick responses this weekend.

    Furball
     
  7. Mr. Opinion

    Mr. Opinion New Member

    MBA Program Pointers

    Furball,

    I'm active duty military, and am working on my MBA through Penn State online. I think you are absolutely making the right decision by going through Nebraska and the AACSB route.

    If I can share a couple of pointers from my experience:

    1) GMAT - the ed office reimburses the cost of your GMAT exam one time, so make sure you chat with those folks so the cost of the exam (about $150) comes back to you

    2) Agency assistance - you may not be able to take advantage of this now, but if you find yourself working for any of a large (especially joint) organization, ask about their discretionary funding options. You may find out that they have money set aside for employee professional development that can help reduce your total out of pocket.

    3) Classes - let your bosses know that you are taking MBA courses well ahead of time, especially if you have residencies. You may be pleasantly surprised; I had a boss who was also in a night-school graduate education degree program, and he was one of the biggest proponents of me getting some assistance through the discretionary funding referenced above.

    4) Make sure you have a broadband internet connection and are familiar with skype, yahoo messenger and any other virtual conferencing software - familiarity ahead of time will save you time when you are slogging through the classwork and making presentations with your group.

    5) Be prepared to have a great time! I have some residencies in my program, so I actually go to meet the great people I worked with. After 8 months of working with someone online, you know their habits, quirks and history pretty well. I know I will have some great connections after I leave this program and do not regret it for a second!

    Best of luck - it's a hell of a ride,

    Mr. Opinion
     
  8. Daniel Luechtefeld

    Daniel Luechtefeld New Member

    If you're considering Nebraska for those particular reasons, you may wish to consider Mississippi State as well:

    http://www.distance.msstate.edu/mba/

    There is a testimonial for the program posted by an Air Force officer:

    http://www.distance.msstate.edu/mba/testimonials.html
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 22, 2006
  9. furball

    furball New Member

    Thanks + another question...

    Daniel Luechtefeld / Mr. Opinion

    Good information, thanks for your opinions.

    I have one more question for you. Do you think that 2 classes per term is “doable” with a standard work day that will last from 10-12 hrs/day? Will all my free time be taken up? I guess I’m wondering what “A Week in the Life” of a MBA online student w/ 2 classes per term will look like.

    Daniel: I did look at the MSU program. Unfortunately, I won’t be able to complete it in 2 years which is a requirement for me (for Air Force promotion purposes, I need it completed by the start of 2009). Thanks for the help though, they sound like a good “bang for the buck” option for many

    Mr. Opinion: Good to see some other guys from Active Duty here

    1) Copy all. I’m going to get re-imbursed through the Ed. Office (it’s actually $250 now)
    2) Agency Assistance: Never knew about this one, sound like a hidden program that would be great to use. Unfortunately I don’t think I qualify (I’m not on a Joint Staff or anything, just Major working the Line AF). Good to know though.
    3) Good point: I’ll be PCS’ing (don’t know where to yet) around Aug, so I’ll need to let them know ASAP when I find my new assignment
    4) Already covered, I’m a gadget/tech fiend, love that stuff
    5) That’s the only thing I wish U. Nebraska had (residencies). But on the other hand, I have no idea where I’ll be living one year from now, and when I’ll deploy to the sandbox or elsewhere next, so it would have to be a really flexible arrangement.

    Great work with Penn State. I’m not an employer or HR, but that has good name recognition in my book anyway.
     
  10. Mr. Opinion

    Mr. Opinion New Member

    Day in the life

    Furball,

    Typical (week) day in the life -

    0600-1600 Work/PT/etc. (I work at a schoolhouse so it's not that bad - I was operational before that time and that was rough)
    1600-1800 Downtime/Dinner
    1900 - Virtual Conference w/ team on paper topic
    2000-2230 Work on individual homework assignments / message board topics / simulations
    2230 Watch the game or Leno - go to bed

    I'd add about an hour or two (make the day longer) if you have children to put them to bed, etc.

    Typical weeks require between 12-20 hours of work - it's kind of like having a part-time job. A lot of it is group work, though, so once you get to know everyone a little better, you can start to work out timing. Say one of you has a big project a work due, the other will cover, etc. Group dynamics matter a lot!

    Biggest thing is "try" to get enough sleep...That can really be a drag on performance. On the plus side, it is engaging to work with others who are in the same boat w/ different career paths. Plus - imagine what all of this would cost you in-residence, including lodging, food, etc. Some weeks are better than others - look at it one week at a time!

    As far as classwork goes - try to work ahead as much as possible and don't procrastinate! Ask your boss if he or she will give you a little flex time during duty hours, if at all possible. It'll give you some precious downtime during the weekend.

    Best of luck to you!

    MO
     
  11. Jigamafloo

    Jigamafloo New Member

    Great advice from Mr Opinion. I'm active duty (AF) as well - it seems postings like this make us crawl out of the woodwork:).

    Typical workweek for me is 45 - 50 hours a week (very similar schedule to MO's, so I won't recap) with an average of 15 hours or so per week devoted to the MS program. One thing I wanted to add is not to be so quick to dismiss at least asking about discretionary training funds or agency assistance....you might be amazed what they can cover if willing.

    My own shop has an initiative to try and have two or three of us obtain PMP (Project Management Professional) certification through PMI, and they're willing to pay for it. All of this is over and above normal tuition assistance.

    Best of luck, and do focus on getting enough sleep - it really is like having a part time job.

    Dave
     
  12. furball

    furball New Member

    Questions for Jigamafloo

    Jigamafloo , Mr. Opinion

    Mr. Opinion: Thanks a lot for that detailed explanation and timeline, that definitely put things into perspective. Having a “part-time job” clicked for me. I wasn’t thinking in terms like that. Good reality check before the work hits, much appreciated.

    Jigamafloo: Great info. Few more questions for you when you get time… **We may be getting of post subject here. I’ll PM you if you think it’s going to get way off base, just let me know.**
    1) Who exactly did you talk to regarding the funding? Thread readers, forgive me as I convert to AF speak… I’m in AETC right now in a flying squadron, working as a line pilot. I’m assuming I have to talk to a guy at the Group or Wing level versus someone in my SQ. Who handles that stuff, what office? I can tell you, dudes in my SQ know none of this stuff!
    2) Man, I’m curious about your decision to get the MSITM, b/c I heavily debated going for that vs. a generic MBA, and also seeing how you like Touro. They are the other school I’m looking at if Nebraska doesn’t work for some reason.
    a. How would you compare an MBA vs MSITM for someone who eventually wants to get into the enormous/diverse IT field as a second career (post-military)
    b. How are Touro’s courses and overall experience. I’ve read other posts on this forum, just curious about yours.

    Man, tons of info over this weekend. So glad I found this site. Thanks again for the quick responses and varied opinions.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 23, 2006
  13. friendorfoe

    friendorfoe Active Member

    Hello all,

    not that I am a resident expert on all things MBA, but in my experience the majority of folks here would seem to argue that NA accreditation such as the AACSB or equivalent is the way to go.

    As for a low cost NA and RA alternative try Chadron State U. which while not Nebraska, you will have money left over for other things http://www.csc.edu/onlinemba/ of course they are ACBSP not AACSB which is a whole different can of worms, which honestly, I don't see a great deal of difference between the two other than some of the big name schools involved.

    As for the RA MBA having utility in the private sector, I believe that you will find that your 20+ years experience in a leadership position will dwarf your education. The MBA will meet a check box requirement in most cases and the fact that it is AACSB will likely go unnoticed, as said before, most HR types are unfamiliar with accreditation.

    As for name recognition, nobody will question a Nebraska degree, but those who are so tight about business accreditation are often, in my experience, also tight about the fact that your degree was earned online and you may hear phrases like "we were looking for someone with a hands on approach" or "someone who excels at teamwork" etc. which your experience, not a degree earned online will fulfill.

    So I am firmly in the "it can't hurt" camp, but I also think that AACSB is not necessary to a successful MBA program.

    You seem to be up on all the issues involved so go with your gut. My brother is looking at Penn State or Duke for his MBA, whilst I will earn mine from the small but controversial St. Josephs College in Maine......so there is not a one size fits all degree program, I think each program from each school has strengths and weaknesses as the individuals who choose them.

    In my case my MBA will be RA but not AACSB or ACBSP, from a small school however I certainly not call it an "McMBA" due to the very unique curriculum.

    As for your military experience, this can hurt you certainly. But it can also help you. The thing I am discovering is that you are who you are and thus you will not be a good fit for every job in every situation. Where your experience will help you great, where it will hurt, too bad for them. I work in law enforcement and have seen preference given to military by some but I have seen it looked down upon by others, especially those who performed similar style jobs in the military.

    So enroll in the program that speaks to you. To me, you sound like a government consultant dream come true. However to the fortune 500 hiring manager, you may be a inexperienced graduate who is confused about what he wants to do for a living, military? or business?


    PS……..if you want a really powerhouse MBA http://www.fuqua.duke.edu/mba/executive/
     
  14. KF@UNA

    KF@UNA New Member

    Furball,

    Couple of things:

    First, thanks for serving our country. I appreciate it.

    Second, I am in my next to last semester of my MBA with the University of North Alabama, therefore, I am biased. Although not AACSB, I live in the region, and it made sense for me.

    Third, I work in the defense industry. Your military experience combined with an MBA would certainly be looked on favorably.

    Fourth, I have had several classes with an Army pilot currently in the sand pit. It can be done. Interestingly enough, I wrote the flight manuals and pilot's operating handbooks (back in the mid and late 80's) for the aircraft he is flying. Kinda cool that our paths would cross.

    Best wishes....

    KF
     
  15. Shawn Ambrose

    Shawn Ambrose New Member

    Sir, [Sorry, but I'm an E7] :)

    1. I believe that MBA + military experience, especially with the responsibilties of an O5/O6 (your rank when you plan to retire), will be a great asset to you. As others have posted, having that will place you IMHO at a considerable advantage over newly minted MBAs.

    2. Given your choice, if you can complete an AACSB program online, esp. one with name recognition (U of Neb.), and only have to pay $8K out of pocket, the utility of that degree will carry more weight than other options, esp. if you don't plan to go into academia.

    Other posters have also put in the time constraints, and as a distance learner myself, I agree that your evenings are going to be busy. Best of luck to you, whatever you decide.

    Shawn
     
  16. furball

    furball New Member

    Interesting call from the U. Nebraska office

    Interesting call from the U. Nebraska office

    First off, thanks to:
    - friendorfoe: thank you for the opinion. From all the reading and research I did, I kind of agree with you that “it can’t hurt” for AACSB, but I bet it won’t be the deciding factor. At least I hope not, hard for me to believe an accredidation would override experience and interviews, etc.
    - KF@UNA: No sweat, I feel lucky I got to do the job I wanted in the AF. It’s nice to be appreciated. Believe me, that keeps you going when you’re deployed in some far corner of the world. Nice work with the flight manuals, I’ve been reading those for the last 10 years.
    - Capella Rocks: don’t call me Sir on the internet ! Just kidding, thanks for the post. I’m getting my mind ready for the time requirements now. Which leads me to…….

    Next Topic: Today I talked with a member of the U. Nebraska MBA program staff. I had called earlier with questions regarding possible problems military deployments etc. might bring and what their experience has been with mil. students. He said that the military career and distance MBA would not be a problem per say, but that my time limit of 2 years (having to take 2 classes per term to finish in two years) was a definite concern. He said that most people who have a full-time job take 1 class per term, and that 2 classes per term was “doable”, but very busy. He said most people taking 2 courses/term work 30 hr/week jobs and maybe do some homework at their job. He quoted about 4 hours online and about 12 hours off-line per class.

    So here it is: Is the idea of two classes per term for two years somewhat on the high side of the spectrum / unrealistic from an AACSB online MBA course given a 45-50 hour work week? Are the quoted time constraints per class what you have experienced?

    I guess it got me worried b/c I was all set to go with my plan, especially given the detailed posts above. However, he seemed to be concerned with my 2 year time requirement. I know 2 classes per term at somewhere like Touro U. will not be a problem (friends are doing it now). Just curious about others experiences. Thanks in advance.

    furball
     
  17. Shawn Ambrose

    Shawn Ambrose New Member

    Re: Interesting call from the U. Nebraska office

    I completed my MBA at the University of Akron (an AACSB school) taking two classes per term while working 45 - 50 hours a week. I didn't have much of a life, but it did get done. My MBA was done at night, the traditional B & M way.

    Since you won't be spending class time per se in a distance learning format, I believe that you would have more time to accomplish work in the DL format, then chasing down a B & M MBA.

    Shawn
     
  18. Han

    Han New Member

    What about the University of Tulsa - AACSB, no on site requirements (they just changed this, they used to have residency requirements)?

    They have a lock step program, you go through the set of classes, 2 per term (including one summer), so you MUST be through in 2 years. The only issue is, that if you do have to dro for a semester for some reason, you have to wait a year to get back in the lock step.

    They are private, but a very good school - if you can make it to their campus, it is impressive.

    PM me if you have specific questions on this school, but may be a great fit for you.
     
  19. Han

    Han New Member

    Oh - also, I found that the 2 classes OK with my 40+ hour working schedule - the only semester that was difficult was the last, where their is a capstone course.
     
  20. Fortunato

    Fortunato Member

    It really depends on what kind of career you're looking to enter post-military. If your career target is radically different from your current military job, then your MBA may carry a lot more weight than if you're basically looking to do contracting for DoD, in which case your security clearance is much more important than your MBA. At age 41 there are some fields, such as investment banking, that are probably effectively closed to you as a career changer, regardless of when you completed your MBA. Consulting firms, on the other hand, may be fighting amongst each other for the chance to talk to you, especially firms that specialize in government work. Either way, I doubt the date on your MBA will make much of a difference.

    Developing a network is incredibly important for someone who's looking to make a career transition. No matter what program you do, you need to establish good relationships with your classmates and continue to nuture those relationships after graduation. Given the length of time you see elapsing between finishing the program and going out looking for a job, I would recommend choosing a school with a large, active alumni population. Once you've graduated, join the local chapter of your school's alumni club, and be active! The more people you meet, the more relationships you build, the more opportunities you'll stumble into.

    The Nebraska program looks solid, but since you're on a timelime for promotion reasons, I'd look into a cohort-based program to ensure that you'll definitely be able to schedule all your classes within the period of time you want to earn the degree in. One program that is cohort-based and enjoys a large alumni base is the University of Florida's Internet MBA. The program has a one-week orientation residency, and one weekend residency per term, so you'll definitely get time to interact with other students, but you won't be jetting down to Gainesville everytime you turn around. If you have a business undergrad, you could be done with their one-year option in April 2008! It's more expensive than UNL ($34-$39K vs $17K or so), but the program is nationally ranked (Top 50 in US News), and the UF alumni network is enormous, and extraordinarily active, with Gator Clubs in almost every major city in the US. Their intake is Spring semester, so you would have to move fast to graduate in 2008 (one-year) or 2009 (two-year), but the admissions staff will go to great lengths to help you through the process

    (Full disclosure: I was admitted to their on-campus program in 2005, but passed it up to do the executive program I'm in now).

    Here's a link to the University of Florida MBA Programs homepage. Best of luck!
     

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