Anything New in D/L Law Programs 2006

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by traderneil, Feb 16, 2006.

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  1. traderneil

    traderneil New Member

    Hi : I have been busy and been away from the forum for a little while now. I have been getting emails from several Law programs to enroll in their programs, but they don't post their success rate with the bar exam.

    Has anything changed in the last year or so?? Is anybody currently taking any on line classes, have any new schools started programs....All opinoins count......Tks traderneil
     
  2. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Recent developments in D/L law

    Not much. Lessee...this year's top D/L law stories include:

    Oak Brook's July 2005 pass rate has been falling to the point where it is much more in line with the pass rates of the other major D/L California Bar registered schools.

    Certain states have tightened their Bar admission requirments to exclude both California D/L and the London LL.B. grads.

    This isn't D/L but the University of Laverne College of Law just received provisional ABA approval thus depriving the CalBar accredited schools of their champion example of quality.

    This also isn't D/L but two California ABA approved schools have been placed on ABA probation for low Bar pass rates, Whittier and Golden Gate.

    The University of London LL.M. external program has been completely overhauled and is now the particular responsibility of University College London and Queen Mary. The old program is closed to new admits.

    An effort in the Texas Legislature to open the Texas Bar exam to D/L graduates died a'bornin', as they really do say in the Lone Star State.
     
  3. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Wow, that's pretty bleak. It seems the lawyers really do want to meter prospective competitors' access to their profession.

    -=Steve=-
     
  4. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    Yes, they probably do. However, it is unlikely that legalization of the DL option would greatly increase the number of lawyers out there.

    In California, Calbar statistics indicate that a total of 5,882 candidates passed the bar in 2005 and became lawyers. Of those, only 72 (or 1.2 %) were graduates of DL programs. For 2004, it was 68 of 5,437 (or 1.3 %).

    So the actual impact of DL law programs in California, in terms of producing new lawyers, is relatively limited. The California experience suggests that a legal DL option might increase the number of new lawyers by ~ 1%. Perhaps the number would be higher in states with easier bar exams.
     
  5. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    The experiement isn't exactly fair. Many students who would want to go to law school online would also want an ABA accredited law school that wouldn't effectively restrict them from practicing in just their home state, wouldn't require them to take the baby bar, and would have a higher pass rate. If the process were opened up to established law schools one could judge that, but as it is, one really can't.

    -=Steve=-
     
  6. Dave Wagner

    Dave Wagner Active Member

    All I can think to say is that ABA accredited D/L Law programs will come sooner or later; it is inevitable. That is, modality schmodality!
     
  7. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Here we go again

    CalDog keeps trotting out the same tired old reality check. Talk about raining on our D/L parade!

    Maybe he hopes that EVENTUALLY, we will actually LISTEN to him, CONSIDER what his statistics mean, and GIVE UP on the idea of D/L law as a generally viable route to the law.

    He's right, of course. 100% correct and it's only our tinted lenses that keep us even talking about it.

    Inescapable fact #1: Graduates of ABA approved schools have a MUCH better chance, overall, of passing the California Bar exam on their first attempt.

    Inescapable fact #2: Graduates of CalBar accredited, non ABA approved resident schools have a noticeably better chance, overall, of passing the California Bar exam on their first attempt than students matriculating in either D/L programs or unaccredited resident schools. (Don't forget to factor in the FYLEX "weed out".)

    Reasonable conclusion: In terms of potential Bar performance, the very best advice is, GO TO AN ABA SCHOOL.

    Reasonable corrollary: The ABA approval process DOES result in a better product, whether by better student selection or by requiring higher standards for faculty and facility, or most likely, both.

    Preemptive strikes to inevitable counterexamples:

    Laverne DOES have an enviable pass rate for a CalBar school-True. Laverne also just received provisional ABA approval.

    Western State, Whittier, and Golden Gate have dismal pass rates, yet are ABA approved-true. One lost its ABA approval altogether refcently and the other two are now on probation.

    Concord is starting to produce noticeable cadres of Bar applicants and making an increasing number of new lawyers-True, and worth noting. But they STILL have a pass rate that wouldn't get past the ABA, even BEFORE taking the FYLEX "weed out" into account.

    So HERE and NOW, CalDog, I say to the heavens that you are perfectly correct and that the rest of us are living in a fantasy world!

    But what are dreams for?
     
  8. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    oh, yeah

    I meant also to say that Western State IS presently ABA provisionally approved but if their 25% pass rate on the July 2005 exam doesn't get better QUICK, they may lose it again, I fear. The ABA rewrote their standards after the last go around to remove a lot of discretion. That's why two old, well established schools found themselves on probation.

    The other point was, even with all the money in the world and the highest tuition for a D/L law degree in California, Concord can't match the performance of many CalBar schools. (Don't forget the FYLEX effect!) Traditional, resident law study is better (in this respect) than D/L.
     
  9. MacGyver

    MacGyver Guest

    Hi Everyone:

    I'm new to this board but home to become a regular.

    I have been researching law programs for sometime and have found there is a lot of information out there, however it's not in a very usable format.

    I found this board via a cached copy of a thread that is no longer accessible here regarding admissions to law schools without having a bachelor's degree. Some may be surprised to find that there is acually a provison in California that allows you to test for a waiver of the bachelor's degree prior to entering one of the distance learning courses there. Michigan allows entrance to ABA approved traditional schools with 60 hours as I recall.

    Also, once you're licensed to practice law in California you do have a couple of options. You can practice through California for 4-6 years and then apply to many of the other state's bars. While practicing in California you can become admitted to practice in Federal Court in California. Once admitted, you can practice in Federal Court in any jurisdiction in the country.

    All that being said, does anyone else know of locations where the undergraduate requirement is being waived?
     

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