Concern about getting less than quality

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by Xarick, Feb 4, 2006.

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  1. Xarick

    Xarick New Member

    Going back to brick and mortar is just out of the question for me. I have too much going on with full time work, family, church etc. People say make the sacrafice, but I don't think it is fair to make my kids sacrafice my time for a degree. So distance learning is where I am gonna go.

    My worry is that the quality is just not there. Case in point very few CS degrees meet the quality of onsite CS programs. Those that do cost a small fortune. Of course there is business style degrees, but there are millions of those out there.

    Changing careers almost seems like a bad idea when utilizing distance learning because the quality doesn't seem the same.

    Thoughts?
     
  2. CoachTurner

    CoachTurner Member

    My experience does not support your conclusion that the quality fo a DL degree is less than that of a B&M -- in fact, my experience seems to support the opposite is true.

    I can give you specific examples in my areas of study -- mileage of others may vary.

    The BS(LS) degree requirements at Exelsior College require more upper level study than my BA (music) at state run Coastal Carolina.

    I study music at Coastal Carolina University in Myrtle Beach SC. My applied music teacher is truly awesome - no compaints from me there. What I can't do here is study composition or theory with a master composer. I can do that with online programs such as the one at Berklee.

    As a writer, I can undertake study with a wider variety of writer educators through DL than I can even think to begin to take here at home.

    Just a few examples...

    In actual practice, the DL student at the likes of the Big Three has access to a much larger selection of courses with a wider range of faculty quality than resident students at any university worldwide.

    For the time being, the general opinion of the public seems to be that DL=lower quality. As more and more people take advantage of DL, that opinion will change. I suspect that change will occur rapidly as more and more colleges and universities offer their coursework online.

    To say that very few CS degrees meet the quality of onsite CS degrees may or may not be true. There are some things that aren't suited to DL and I suspect some areas of a CS program might be in that boat. There are some things that are better suited to DL though.

    Now, if you think that DL will require less sacrifice than taking courses at your local state u -- you may be surprised.

    My experience: The typical in the seat student goes to class and listens to the lecture. He/she may or may not spend any significant time outside of class preparing for class. He/she then takes the exams based on the lectures. Time= 3-5 hours per week.

    The typical DL student spends the same time on lectures, CD coursework, and online discussion but then spends about an equal amount of time preparing for the next lesson. It is my experience that courses taken by DL have greater numbers of assignments and those assignments are more time intense. (my wife is taking a history online that requires more time watching video per week than she would have spent in a classroom lecture). It seems to me that DL students are more prepared for each lesson/lecture than traditional students.

    just a few thoughts...

    I generally suggest, if the prestige level of the degree is of significant importance to you then you will not be happy with anything less than Harvard, Princeton, MIT, Yale, Berkeley, etc... Reality though is that most people don't have a degree from the likes of those and do just fine.
     
  3. Ted Heiks

    Ted Heiks Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member

    Really, Coach? What class is this and where?
     
  4. JoAnnP38

    JoAnnP38 Member

    I received my BS from Florida State University in Computer Science by distance learning. The great thing about this program is that the distance learning students were just a section of the overall class which included on-campus students as well. I am now working on an MS in Computer Science at the University of Florida (also by distance learning.) Out the first two classes I've taken which included about two-thirds on-campus and one third off, I performed better than a large majority of the on-campus students (I had the second highest grade in both classes.) I dare say that much of my success was made possible by the incredible preparation I had in my BS program at FSU. Are there better undergrad programs out there? Yes, I think so. But as a Florida resident, I was paying about $150 or so an hour for a first class education. Given this incredible price I can't imagine a program that has more bang for the buck.

    As for the University of Florida, it is rated in the top 50 by USN&WR for Computer Science Graduate schools. I consider any graduate program whose tuition is less than $600/semester hour to be reasonably priced. At that price there are a lot of great schools offering distance learning MS degrees in Computer Science such as:

    University of Colorado - Boulder
    Virginia Tech
    Auburn University
    Regis University
    SUNY Binghamton University
    Texas Tech University
    University of Idaho
    University of Michigan - Dearborn

    These universities offer great value for anyone and the list grows when you consider that instate students are often given sizeable discounts. As for quality, I can pretty much gaurantee that these schools work hard to make sure that their quality of education is pretty much the same whether you are an off or on campus student. Personally, I believe that I'm getting the better value because I can apply what I've learned to my job which augments the educational value of the program.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 4, 2006
  5. hrudey

    hrudey New Member

    I can second that. I wish that UF had a fully-online Masters, since I can't make the 1 1/2 hour drive each way to make it to campus. I've selected Regis and done research and found that it is a very rigorous program and best of all, has a focus in Software Engineering, which is what I want.

    This in contrast to the BS that I'm finishing today through University of Phoenix online, which is pretty much the epitome of the "bad online program" the original poster was referencing. Still, there's plenty of good as well as bad out there, and I just wish I'd known about this site earlier so I may have made different choices to finish up my undergrad.
     
  6. Xarick

    Xarick New Member

    Joanne thanks for the help, but all those schools you posted are masters programs. When you get to the BS level places like REGIS are charging $340 a credit hour which comes out to about $40000 for a BS in computer science as opposed to an onsite state school costing about $15000. Thats a lot of debt you won't likely make back.

    However even regis' BS lacks things like physics, advanced calculus and such making it less theoretical then most on site schools.

    I had not however considered this:
    I generally suggest, if the prestige level of the degree is of significant importance to you then you will not be happy with anything less than Harvard, Princeton, MIT, Yale, Berkeley, etc... Reality though is that most people don't have a degree from the likes of those and do just fine.


    He is right here.. I mean even a state school is not gonna hold up against these. So I suppose I am being worried about something I shouldn't be worried about.

    As far as the time factor goes, Online school may very well require far more work. But you can schedule that work at your break at work, at night when your kids are in bed, on weekends etc. Brick and mortarschool means you are gone from your home another 12-16 hours a week on top of your 40 hour a week job. Plus if you have a job like mine your employer is not gonna be flexible meaning you wont catch a break to go to class there.
     
  7. mbaonline

    mbaonline New Member

    Xarick, are you refering to grad or undergrad programs?

    If it's BS level, I think you've got it right that you don't need the Harvard level but you want a rigorous undergrad similar to what you'd get at a local state B&M school, with the lower tuition.

    Have you considered something like this? www.distance.wsu.edu/degrees/ I don't know where you are but your local State University might have more name recognition (and hence have more value to you), so you could see if they have a similar program. Others here might be able to point you to a program if you let us know what state you live in...

    You would get the benefit of lower (perhaps in-state) tuition, plus the name recognition and the online program. I agree with you that online is much more time efficient.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 6, 2006
  8. CoachTurner

    CoachTurner Member

    This is History 202 (American History, post Civil War) at Coastal Carolina University [she's working on a BA (Communication) in residence and is using this history as an elective.]

    I took this same profs' "in-the-seat" class and can attest that she is indeed doing more work for his DL than I did for his classroom. Of course, it's possible that his in-the-seat class has gotten more demanding over time...

    :D
     
  9. CoachTurner

    CoachTurner Member

    I had this discussion with someone just today... :D

    $15000 over 4 years (120 semester hours) amounts to $125 per semester hour (assuming no other costs) -- a pretty low figure indeed.

    $40000 in the same period is $333 per smester hour and probably a realistic figure for B&M or DL bachelor's degrees.

    Of course, you could pay more and you could pay less...

    Now, if we don't figure in the costs of attending outside of tuition (such as lost wages, which can be significant) and we only consider the $40K -- and, we assume that you borrow the whole $40K; then we have to consider, at what point will that investment be returned compared to if we had no degree.

    Let's assume too that we're working with someone who earns about $26K with just an HSD (as a generalization, that's a fairly good pay level in many parts of the country for a HS grad). Let's say too that earning a BA increases his/her earning power to just $36,000 per year (as a generalization, pretty low for a college grad.)

    That $40,000 has been returned in only 4 years. BUT - this is only addressing the direct salary benefits. As a generality, college grads enjoy not only greater earning power but also a better quality of life, better health, more mobility, etc... So, we might even consider that the $40,000 is returned in less than 4 years.

    Of course, there are stories of college grads working in McDonalds for minimum wage and I know of this one guy that dropped out of college and now he's a billionaire -- generally speaking though, college grads make more than HS grads.

    That $40K is a pretty good investment in my mind, even if you have to take out loans to pay it.

    Now, if you're one of those folks who is already well into your working life and earning a pretty decent salary based on your many years of experience, then getting that degree may or may not return the investment for you. On the other hand, what's the liklihood of becoming CIO, CEO, COO etc. without that degree and one more?

    IMHO -- it's perfectly fine if someone feels that the investment isn't warranted in their own situation. Perpetuating the myth that the investment is not sound for anyone because of debt load is simply not supported by the facts.
     

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