Trinity Seminary & pursuit of accreditation

As most regulars know Trinity Seminary is a much talked about school ("accredited" by the University of Liverpool). Their web site claims that they are pursuing accreditation by an agency recognized by the US Department of Education.
http://www.trinitysem.edu/spotlight.html

One wonders which agency this is? My guess is that because Trinity offers doctorates
(no doubt wishes to continue doing so) it will be TRACS. This is of course interesting because they once tried to pursue TRACS accreditation and ended up withdrawing. So, this will be their second attempt. On top of it I wonder if the Masters Divinity School will cause some concerns within which ever accreditation body they choose. I know I would be concerned with quickie doctorates (see Russell Morris recent thread). the Masters Divinity School smacks of "Less Than Wonderful" (to borrow a phrase from the Bear meister).

It would be nice to see Trinity obtain recognized accreditation.

North

 

Or it could be a feint. This has a temporary effect of encouraging students to enroll, implying that the school is "accreditable." I do not know if they are or are not. I assume that while they saw fit to put out this forward-looking statement, they declined to also include a "backward-looking" one about their failed attempt with TRACS.

Rich Douglas

 

True. Certainly as far as marketing it may well get some to enroll based on UofL "accrediation" and the pursuit of US DOE recognized accreditation. Of course we know that the U of L "accreditation" does not appear to mean much in terms of external recognition of Trinity nor is "pursuing accrediation" the same as "achieving accreditation".

On the same link I provided there is a notice about the graduation held at the Univ of Liverpool. In reading it I find it interesting that the graduation appears not to have been part of U of L's ceremonies and held in a separate room with greetings brought by an offical of U of L. One wonders
why if U of L is proud and confident of Trinity it does not include them in the U of L ceremonies??

North

 

North,

In conversation (via phone) with Dr. Ed Martin, Trinity's Academic Dean, I was told that Trinity was indeed in collaboration with an accrediting agency which is recognized by the USDOE. This was over two years ago, so I assume the dialogue continues.

Personally, if they could achieve this type of accreditation I would be pleased, as I have nothing against Trinity's attempt at providing an educational experience for those in ministry. I hope they do achieve such accreditation, then their programs of study would provide a degree which would enjoy broad recognition. My concerns have been: 1) With their use of the word accreditation as it relates to their relationship with Liverpool-which seems to imply that a Trinity degree would be recognized on par with a RA degree. It will not! 2) Even though Master's Divinity School is a separate entity, from reading catalogs from both institutions one can easily see that the two are closely interconnected: methodology, instructors, administration, etc. If Trinity achieved RA, I would hope they dropped all association with MDS, or either MDS would change the nomenclature of their programs by deleting terms such as bachelor, master, doctor and degree.

Russell

 

It was "suggested" to me awhile ago that they were pursuing RA (they would not openly confirm this).

It would not surprise me if they did achieve RA.

 

I am thinking that it is more likely TRACS. I could be wrong. Attempting TRACS did not work out for them in the past. I do not know all the issues. I know part of what TRACS requires is a library which Trinity likely would have to develop as well as an endowment fund (fund is probably the least of their worries). They have facilities and could insititute a campus program at Albuquerque or Indiana.

I agree with you about MDS. I find that to be less than wonderful and a rather bad odor for an allegedly academic institution to be even connected at the edges with a school like MDS which makes a mockery of academics. They should ditch it if they want legitimacy.

North

 

Interesting perspective Ken. Why would it not surprise you? What are your thoughts on them and RA?

North

 

I don't know why they would even pursue this -- they told me that their U of L "accreditation" was even better than RA! This school is an absolute joke! If they can receive legitimate accreditation, so can Triune Biblical University.

Barry

 

If they (and I assume you mean Trinity) told you this, Barry, they were wrong. Several questions arise from this bold assertion:

1. How is it better?
2. Who recognizes it as better, besides Trinity?
3. If it is better, then why persue RA at all?
4. If it is better, then why will RA schools not accept Trinity credits at face value?
5. If it is better, then why have the NAPNSC accreditation, which is not USDOE recognized?

If its even better than RA, I think I want a degree from there!

Russell

 

Re: Trinity Seminary & pursuit of accreditation

 

Re: Re: Trinity Seminary & pursuit of accreditation

Bill,

I never suggested that this individual was a close acquaintance. The person in question teaches at an RA/ATS seminary, has an earned RA Ph.D., but is also among the faculty at Trinity. My "acquaintance" with this individual amounts to several e-mails--that's all.

This person did tell me that he was instrumental in the process of Trinity gaining Liverpool accreditation, and that it was never intended to suggest or imply that this was equivalent to RA. Rather, he stated that it was basically for the benefit of non-US students. He also told me that he was on the Trinity committee which was seeking NCA accreditation.

 

This reminds me of the joke about Piet and Sannie walking through the veld. They come upon a ghost town and look around. All at once, Piet disappears down a disused well.
"Aaaaaaaaaaagg!" he hollers.
Sannie peers in. "Did you hit bottom yet?"
"Neeeeeeeeeee maaaaaaaaaan."
Time passes.
"Did you hit bottom yet?"
"Neeeeeeeeeee maaaaaaaaaan" (growing fainter).
Time passes.
"Did you hi--" (barely audible thud). "Did you break anything?"
(weakly) "Nee man, I just got here."





Giving some schools accreditation will break stuff right away.

 

Russell

Of course I didn't say he was a *close* acquaintance(you said an acquaintance) or that you concurred with his statement. I believe in this thread in 8/14/ 01 you also say that more than two years before that (earlier than 8/99) Dean Martin (not the crooner) by phone told you that TTS was in "collaberation" with the accrediting association. Of course it is Martin that said that, not you.

But my question is does this seem normal that "collaberations" go on for more than three years between a school and an accreditor without even candidacy resulting. I suppose that some more knowledgeable than I who have seen how these negotiations transpire could opine on whether it is curious that such proceedings are mentioned for years without any visible thing of substance happening, or whether--for whatever purpose--Trinity staff are somewhat overly presumptuous in their announcements. One wonders how many prospective students are encouraged to enroll and how many renew their enrollment due to such optimism by TTS staff. Whether that is its purpose or not, the effect likely would be more income. Just wondering. You know: apple pie and baseball.

I mean, it did not take Trinity over three years to achieve the efficient and worldwide Liverpool accreditation, did it? So, what's the delay with NCA?

 

This "collaboration" between TTS and whomever could go on for decades--I guess

 

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Then I propose a new set of criteria by which to evaluate quality:


#1 schools which have accreditation

#2 schools which claim they are not seeking accreditation

#3 schools which have candidacy for accreditation

#4* schools which go through years and years of "collaberation" with an accreditor.

#5 schools which claim that endorsement by Liverpool is better than accreditation.



Now, assuming that any two of these is better than any one of these, it looks to me that Trinity has bested DTS!

 

Bill,

If you wouldn't spend so much time critiquing Trinity you could finish the UZ thesis by June of 2003.

 

Speaking of Trinity..... I just got their package in the mail. I had sent for it before I knew the situation. Guess what I found at the top of the box they sent me? It was a catalog boasting that Trinity is accredited and endorsed by Canterbury Christ Church University College England They claim, " it provides a level of academic status which is not available at any other bible college or theological seminary in America."

 

==

Right, back to work now

 

Thanks for the up-to-date info.

"A level of academic status which is not available at any other bible college/seminary in America?"

TTS RULES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!