DETC Phd's Or Ed's in Education

Hi,


This might already be posted in the archives, but I couldn't find it. Do any schools offer a DETC-accrediated PHd or Ed (Education Doctorate) in education yet? If so, which ones? What is the status of DETC PHd's right now?

Thanks,
Ramona
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BA (Math) '01 Queen's University, Kingston, ON
BSc (Honours Math/Computer Science), '03 Queen's
BEd (Education K-12 Endorsement), '03 Queen's
MEd (Math Education), (In Progress), Queen's ;-)

 

American DETC schools do not offer a PhD, or EdD. None offer a DBA right now. A pilot program is going to start soon for the DBA degree, though. I think 5 schools are going to participate. One DETC school does offer a doctorate. I think it is in physical therapy or something like that. A few might offer the JD degree. Concord is one I know of offhand.

There are some DETC accredited foreign schools offering the doctorate. UNISA is one and there might be others in England and Australia.

 

I believe the number of potential DETC doctorates in the works has dropped from five to three.

The other DETC JD is William Howard Taft.

 

The proposed DBA in the DETC pilot program is from Columbia Southern and I think I might have been told that it will be starting in Fall 2006. DETC doctorates, if approved, will be applied doctorates rather than PhDs. Taft used to have an EdD, but that was before they went DETC. I believe the old Taft EdD is now Boyer Grad School of Education. Perhaps others can clarify.

 

Ph.D., no. Ed.D., maybe. DBA, yes.

DETC will not, as currently arranged, accredit Ph.D. programs. They're in the early stages of a pilot program to accredit some doctoral programs. The Ed.D. would fit under this standard, as would just about any non-Ph.D. academic doctorate. (Doctor of Arts, I wonder?)

This is distinct from first professional doctorates, like those offered by St. Augustine, Taft, and Concord.

Earlier this year, Mike Lambert of DETC told me there were three schools projected to participate in the pilot. That was down from the 5 original, and that the number could fluctuate further. DETC planned to put the pilot programs through quite a process before allowing schools to participate.

The only school I know of is Columbia Southern, who plans to offer the DBA. I suspect, however, that the tuition charged for such degree programs will be higher than the respective schools' master's rate. CSU, for example, hasn't published their doctoral tuition. But they charge $240 per credit for master's programs; I suspect the doctoral programs will be over $300 per credit.

Maybe a lot more; it's an expensive and different undertaking to create a doctoral program--a DL master's can be delivered the same way with the same staff as is a bachelor's program. It's just more courses. But the doctorate will require all (or nearly all) doctorate-holders on faculty, policies and procedures unique to doctoral study, advisors, committee members, and a whole host of other things.

Then there is the nature of a doctoral-level faculty. CSU is a for-profit school run like a business; that is, top-down. But doctoral faculties can be--and might expect themselves to be--quite powerful. But we've seen the model used elsewhere (like UoP and Capella), so who knows. But it is expensive.

There's no reason to think CSU can deliver a real doctoral program and experience for any less than, say, Touro University International (at $500 per credit). If CSU, or other DETC-accredited schools--are less, it is because they are willing to take lower margins, or they recognized that market forces (competition with RA schools) will require them to operate at discounted rates to make their inferior product (degrees from DETC-accredited schools) a better bargain.

(A third possibility exists, that CSU and others will deliver inferior degree programs--not to be confused with inferior degrees, which is a fact by definition. But I'd like to think that DETC will require these doctoral programs to be of comparable quality and vigor as compared to RA schools.)

I guess we'll see when CSU or some other school announces its tuition rates.

 

I find the expectation of the tuition rate very interesting. I would think you would be correct in saying that DETC schools inevitably will have to charge less than an RA school, the question then remains is it going to truely be cost effective if CSU(or any other DETC school) charges $430-495 is it really going to be enough of a cost incentive to attract students? Esspecially if Tuoro and Northcentral are only charging slightly more? I think this will be a very interesting experiment on the part of the DETC and thier accrediated schools.

 

Detc Ed.D.

Hi,

Thanks for all your responses. I was hoping the DETC Education Doctorate would be cheaper than RA, and more practical. I want to remain a teacher, so I'm looking for a very practical ED program to do when my Master's is complete. I've only taught a couple of years, so I was looking for cheaper options!

Thanks,
Ramona
--------------------------------------------------------------------
BA (Math) '01 Queen's University, Kingston, ON
BSc (Honours Math/Computer Science), '03 Queen's
BEd (Education K-12 Endorsement), '03 Queen's
MEd (Math Education), (In Progress), Queen's ;-)

 

I guess I'm wondering why DETC schools would offer a doctorate in the first place. RA schools aren't going to consider them as viable for academic positions, and industry seems to not know what to do with a doctorate on a resume.

 

Agree with the first part, but utterly disagree with the second.

If one has a doctorate, works in the private sector, and feels the degree isn't appreciated, one needs to aim a little higher. I'm reminded of this twice per month.

 

Dr. Douglas points out exactly the things that make me wonder of a credible DETC doctorate is even possible.

A research degree program requires an ongoing research establishment. I could be wrong, but I have never understood that ANY American DETC school has EVER demonstrated a commitment to academic research. I'm not even sure what such a commitment would look like. Are we to expect the professors at DETC institutions to run research establishments out of offices at the school's headquarters? Or maybe the schools will "borrow" professors from established research schools as Kennedy Western claims, or at least claimed, to do?

Or maybe the schools will contract with doctorate holders working in business or industry to supervise the candidates?

I keep getting the impression that the DETC folks don't really understand that a dissertation doctorate program is QUALITATIVELY different than a master's program...

 

Nosborne,

Or the schools can hire former SCUPS Presidents (like CSU did with Dr. Richard Gray, Dean of the Doctoral Studies at CSU).

 

Well, and regionally accredited NCU manages to run doctoral programs even though it is an entirely D/L school, or so I understand.

So I guess it is possible...

 

Before we get too caught up in this "research establishment" thing, remember that this is not necessarily the standard. I doubt that the University of Phoenix or Touro University International would meet that standard, and I wonder about Capella. Even Union, which is utterly academic by design, has been criticized because its faculty has not been as active in research as traditional faculties have been. (Union's facutly are a mix of people active in academics and in their respective fields--something I value highly, and think that the OBR is all wet regarding it.)

There is no reason to believe that a DETC-accredited school cannot emulate UoP or TUI, for whatever that's worth.

 

After six years, is there any change of perception about doctoral program offered at DETC institutions? Are these programs at DETC institutions still viewed as inferior?

 

I don't know know that it is so much perception as utility and prestige. I would not necessarily make a DETC doctorate inferior to say a U of Phoenix doctorate (esp in the case of comparing it to the school whose name is now escaping me but is the classics doctoral program accredited by DETC).

However, you should not be getting a DETC doctorate as the entry credential into a Regionally Accredited school. It will not have the utility (but then likely neither will the U of P doctorate at a state school). Let's face it, DETC schools are not bastions of major research and ground breaking scholarship. It also does not have the prestige in general. I would think you do a doctorate at a DETC school because you want doctoral level learning and research, a doctorate degree and don't want to mortgage you life away for it.

 

Just trying to help your recall. Might that be one of the doctoral programs (D.Arts probably) at the excellent, DETC-accredited Harrison Middleton U. - formerly known as the College of Humanities and Sciences ?

Johann

 

Also, there are DETC doctoral programs outside of the USA. Deakin University in Australia is the first that comes to mind. I would put a degree from that school on the same general level as an RA degree but I'd have that opinion regardless of its DETC accreditation.

 

California Coast University offers three Ed.D.'s and they are DETC accredited.

 

Deakin is the only Australian university that has DETC accreditation; however as you’ve already mentioned, Deakin is an Australian Qualifications Framework (AQF) qualifications university, so the DETC accreditation, I my view also, would add little (if anything) to any Deakin degree validity. A Deakin degree, as an AQF university, should /would be considered equivalent to a RA US degree.

Note: The Deakin PhD (education) is not a coursework doctoral program; it’s … a research doctorate. Deakin does however; offer a coursework /thesis (dissertation) DBA.
Deakin Graduate School of Business

Additional AQF qualification university doctorates via coursework:

University of Southern Queensland:

Doctor of Professional Studies (DPST) via coursework /research
Programs and Courses - Doctor of Professional Studies (DPST)

DBA: Programs and Courses - Doctor of Business Administration (DBAR)

University of New England (AUS) – School of Education: UNE - School of Education - School of Education postgraduate higher degree research programs

EdD: “The program favours the production of a portfolio (rather than a thesis).”
UNE - School of Education - Doctor of Education

ProfD (Professional Doctorate for Industry /Professions): via coursework /research
Professional Doctorate for Industry/Professions - UNE - Course and Unit Catalogue 2012

Southern Cross University: EdD (coursework /dissertation)
Doctor of Education - SCU Course Options - 2012
DBA: Doctor of Business Administration - SCU Course Options - 2012

Central Queensland University: EdD
Doctor of Education

Some Australian research doctorates (EdD):
James Cook University: EdD (research)
Doctor of Education course - JCU

Australian Catholic University: EdD (research)
Doctor of Education - Courses

Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology (RMIT University): Research PhD’s in education and training
RMIT - Education and training