Something different

Does anyone ever discuss anything here related to distance learning other than arguing about the validity of RA vs non-RA DL degrees or about which school/program is better than another or who can outflame who?

How about what can DL institutions do to ensure quality instruction in online courses?
Do you think online instructors/professors should have professional development training specific to effective online instruction before teaching an online course?

Any takers?

 

Very interesting subject Sunnie, thanks for bringing it up. I think now that the technology boom has hit distance learning and more and more DL classes are internet-based (as opposed to the old fashioned paper & ink correspondence courses), DL teachers really need to keep abreast of the technology that's out there. For the most part, I think the market is trying to keep pace. A few years ago, it would have been difficult to find even a seminar about online teaching, now they are plentiful in every copy of the Chronicle. Also a few years ago, the only degree in DL I knew about was the Master's in Open & Distance Education from Open University in the UK. Now offhand I can think of two US RA schools that offer it, Florida State (in conjunction with Open U.) and the University of Maryland, University College. UMUC also offers a certificate program for those who don't need the degree.

I think these efforts are just the tip of the iceberg, and it wouldn't surprise me if more DL schools started offering courses on DL teaching.

Bruce

 

My experience at several schools has highlighted the importance of professional development for faculty. Taking a good on-ground faculty member and dropping in a DL classroom can be a disaster. One has to learn how to teach in an on-line environment. It is different than on-ground.

I will say that UoP, although not my favorite academic institution, does a very good job in training on-line instructors. They don't just drop someone in - they require on-line folks to learn and demonstrate on-line teaching skills.

Thanks - Andy

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Andy Borchers, DBA
NSU (1996)

 

There is also a program at California State University, Chico. I think there's both an MA and a certificate program. Outside of the U.S., there's Athabasca's program.

Here's a thought: Should it be a requirement that if you're earning an MA in Distance Learning that it must be earned via distance learning? Obviously wouldn't happen, but it would be nice to think that people that administer such program's have real-world experience with them.


Tom Nixon

 

Correction.....I just remembered that Athabasca University has offered a Master of Distance Education for quite awhile.

Bruce

 

Great minds must think alike, Bruce. I posted my very short list (with Athabasca)at what must have been the same time as you did yours.

Tom Nixon

 

California State University at Hayward offers both a Certificate and an MS in Education with a specialization in Online Teaching and Learning.

Not only does this program concern on-line teaching and education, it is conducted 100% on-line and can be completed anywhere in the world without setting foot on campus.

It costs (US)$595 per 4.5 quarter unit course. There are ten courses in the 45 unit MS program, so the total cost is a very reasonable $5,950.
http://www.online.csuhayward.edu/Ms/gradontxt.html

 

Yes I just completed the CSU-Hayward MS entirely online. What really riles me (I'm a long time educator) is how many instructors just CANNOT teach effectively online. There are entire programs (certificates and masters) in distance learning, online teaching, etc. -- but there are no courses on exactly HOW to facilitate discussions in online environments. I am currently writing an online course in facilitating/moderating online discussions (social and educational).

I wish that part of the hiring process were to require instructors to demonstrate online teaching expertise and then to have mandatory online mentor/observers for new online instructors. Hmmmmm perhaps I can create a consulting career -- real time mentoring and training through apprenticeship programs for online instructors in higher ed.

 

In general: No.

DI and AED (in its heyday) have never really been about teaching, learning, etc. Those who have gone against the grain have failed miserably, but not for lack of trying.

If you're interested in 'something different' - civil discussions on T&L, pro/cons of different delivery methods, grade inflation from a profs perspective, plagiarism and other forms of cheating in online courses, etc - you may want to subscribe to the "]http://lists.psu.edu/archives/deos-l.html] The Distance Education Online Symposium [/url] http://lists.psu.edu/archives/deos-l.html .

A lot of people who post on DEOS-L have credentials in education; teach distance courses; develop online course content, software, etc. Sometimes the volume can get kind of high, but it's worth the effort to cull through the postings.

Pete
pete-at-ironwell-dot-com

 

Several schools offer certificate and degree programs in distance, online, open education. See http://distancelearn.about.com/cs/dlgraduatedegree/ for an annotated list with links.

Also useful:

Brief interview with Ken W. White, co-author of The Online Teaching Guide, at http://chronicle.com/free/2000/01/2000011101u.htm

Penn State offers its World Campus Faculty Development Program material free at http://www.worldcampus.psu.edu/facdev101/index.html

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Kristin Evenson Hirst
DistanceLearn.About.com

 

Hi, Sunnie

Very good points - all people who teach should have proper teaching qualifications as well as their own subject knowledge.

I hate to list the number of university teachers I've encountered who had no idea of how to teach, let alone any qualification to do so other than having been a student once.

Plus the same and more so for DL .... as some know, I'm interested in DL organisations having an internationally recognised quality measure such as ISO 9001:2000.

The standard states (Clause 6.2.1) "Personnel performing work affecting product (service) quality shall be competent on the basis of appropriate education, training, skills and experience."

and continues .... (Clause 6.2.2):-

The organization shall:-

a) determine the necessary competence for personnel perfoming work affecting product (service) quality

b) provide training or take other actions to satisfy these needs

c) evaluate the effectiveness of the actions taken

....

e) maintain appropriate records of education, training, skills, and experience

These latter are auditable quality records on at least an annual cycle and usually twice a year (one internal qaulity audit, one external annual surveillance quality audit) to satisfy the ISO standard and keep the certification.

Any takers ?

Regards,

Neil Hynd

(UK Cert. Ed. in case anyone's interested)

 

Very interesting, but not too relevant. ISO standards are a set of voluntary standards by which corporations evaluate their business methods. ISO certification--normally done via an inspection by an outside agency--indicates the company has good quality improvement processes. But it has absolutely nothing to do with the acceptability of a college degree, nor even with the utility of that degree.

This board is populated with people who look at the "product" (degree) more than the process (learning method). I'm one of them. That is because there are many charlatans out there who set out to fool people into thinking their diploma mills are real schools. False claims regarding accreditation, puffed-up listings in irrelevant guides, certifications that have nothing to do with the quality of a school nor its acceptance, memberships in organizations that imply quality control (but are actually open to everyone) are just a few of these.

Rich Douglas

 

Yes, yes, anyone can find "certification" courses and programs -- I graduated from one myself -- it takes no time at all to find information on this. But the point is -- there is no requirement for online instructors to acquire the available training. And the more important issue is that some sort of assessment of effective teaching should be required of all online instructors.

It's bad enough that incompetent instructors and professors are allowed to continue "teaching" (if you want to call it that) in traditional higher ed classes. But now it will get even worse as higher ed institutions begin offering more and more DL courses in order to increase enrollment ($$$)and the incompetents will take advantage of posting lessons and assignments, grading work, and never taking the time to learn how to facilitate learning in an online environment.

 

Hi Neil,
Could you explain exactly what that is and how it works? I have been involved only in the teaching side of DL and only recently have become interested in developing some type of quality control for instruction -- not degree quality -- but quality of teaching.
Thanks,
Sunnie

 

Hi Rich,

I think that product quality is important. However quality of the process is equally important to ensure a quality product.

What if there were a standard means by which to assess the teaching/learning process within quality online programs? Would not higher ed institutions be amenable to advertising the fact that they have participated in voluntary instructional assessment if they were able to state that all online instructors/professors had received high assessment ratings and/or training in online instruction?

Seems to me that adding an instructional rating to a subject degree would be a distinct advantage in marketing online courses and programs.

In traditional ed, students talk about profs and learn from one another which profs and classes to avoid at registration, even to the point of waiting for another semester to get into the class with another prof.

DL students do not have that advantage. They are stuck with whatever/whoever they get when the class opens. The only recourse is to drop the course. But then chances are the same incompetent prof will be teaching the same class online the next go-round.

There should be a way for DL students to "check out" online profs before signing up for courses and/or programs.

something to think about

Sunnie

 

Hi Andy - ditto and amen

 

I posted a comment on Karlos' associate degree thread saying that some of the finest teaching that I have ever received was from community college instructors, and some of the worst was from well-known scholars in more prestigious schools. Of course the reverse was sometimes true as well.

My point is that teaching and research scholarship are two different things.

As things stand, universities emphasize the research ideal almost exclusively. It is considered very important for a college faculty member to have a Ph.D. That means that they have spent long years in pursuit of an arcane problem, and wrote a dissertation. But instruction in teaching was picked up informally by employment as a TA, or perhaps not picked up at all.

It's significant that most faculty members are hired to teach a range of courses in their field, few of which directly involve their dissertation topic. It is assumed that a Ph.D. has breadth as well as depth. That might be an unwarranted assumption though, particularly in the case of those 'research-style' degrees that don't include graduate coursework or comprehensive examinations.

For these kind of reasons I have always liked the idea of the doctor of arts, the D.A. This has been conceived as a teaching doctorate, involving more disciplinary breadth and pedagogy, and less original research. It seems ideally suited to producing effective undergraduate faculty. But unfortunately the Ph.D.s never tire of lettings D.A.s know that Ph.D.s are "higher" degrees, so the D.A. is not very popular as far as I can see.

The bottom line of all this is that I think that ALL faculty could use more teaching preparation.

The researcher-model might be great for laboratory scientists who might also advise a few doctoral students on the side. But faculty that do the bulk of their work in front of a classroom (whether physical or virtual) probably need some real training in the job they are being hired to do.

 

But shouldn't this be required of all instructors regardless of whether they're teaching in a classroom or online or through print and mail?

I'm leery of calls for separate standards for distance learning -- it seems to me that the standards should be the same, even if the methods and media used to achieve those standards vary.



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Kristin Evenson Hirst
DistanceLearn.About.com

 

Hi Kristin,

Yes I totally agree assessment of effective teaching should be required of all instructors regardless of the medium in which they teach.

However -- in traditional f2f teaching, observing a class for the purpose of assessing instructional effectiveness is standard practice -- in fact yearly evaluations (by observations) are mandatory in many higher ed schools.

This is just plain and simply not done in online courses. Probably because no one has figured out how to do it yet Actually it would be fairly simple to do and it should be done on an ongoing basis.

This is not a question of different standards for traditional vs online instruction -- it's a queston of effective assessment of said instruction no matter how it is delivered.

Student evaluations at the end of courses are mostly worthless for many reasons. I think that personal observation by a master instructor who has credentials and expertise in online teaching and learning should be standard practice.

It would be very easy for an observer to have observer access to a course in order to monitor communications between instructor and students and among the students. Monitoring discussions and completed online assignments would indicate how well students are learning, i.e. the effectiveness of the instruction. However, it would take someone knowledgeable and talented him/herself in facilitating online learning to be able to assess instruction adequately in this manner.

thoughts?
sunnie

 

I suspect the focus on the "bottom line" (degree) by people not in the DL teaching arena is due to what really happens upon graduation. Frankly, having the degree is way more important than what you learned (typically). This is especially true for mid-career professionals (the crux of the DL clientele). Personally, I've held an MBA for 16 years without anyone ever asking about what I learned. But that MBA has been crucial to getting a number of jobs, both in the public and private sectors. Is a university considering adding you to its faculty going to want to know the topic of your doctoral dissertation? Sure. But is a corporate hiring manager going to want to know what you studied to earn your MBA at the University of Phoenix? Not anywhere near as likely.

John Bear used to include a story in his guides regarding asking clients he consulted what they wanted to get out of the process of earning a DL degree. I paraphrase the options:

1. I want the degree; I don't care about learning more in my field.
2. I want the degree and wouldn't mind learning more about my field along the way.
3. I want to learn more in my field and wouldn't mind earning a degree along the way.
4. I want to learn more in my field; I don't care about the degree.

He said about 40% of respondents chose options 1 and 2, with the other 20% choosing option 3. No one ever chose #4.

You can learn more and earn a degree. But you can certainly do one without the other. And the focus of this and similar boards is about earning degrees via distance learning. People who work at colleges and universities talk about process all the time. I wonder if it is because they have no idea about the value (or lack thereof) of their real product: degrees?

Rich Douglas