CCU

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by pbocij, Jul 1, 2001.

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  1. pbocij

    pbocij member

    A while ago there was some talk about Columbia Commonwealth University gaining accreditation via Malawi. Looking at their web site earlier today, it looks like Malawi accredits all of CCU's programmes. Does this now mean that CCU meets GAAP?

    Paul
     
  2. Dan Snelson

    Dan Snelson New Member

  3. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    Since GAAP is just a set of reference books that admissions officers consult, the answer to your question depends on what the editors of those references decide to do. Those editors are the ultimate arbitors of GAAP.
     
  4. Chip

    Chip Administrator

    I suspect that it is safe to say that Columbia Commonwealth/Columbia Pacific's degrees, whether accredited via Malawi or not, will not find any kind of general acceptance among registrars in US regionally accredited schools.

    As I understand it, based on the research done by John Bear and Rich Douglas, US registrars are already overwhelmingly unlikely to accept degrees from schools accredited by St. Kitts/Nevis, with one or two exceptions. I suspect that Columbia Commonwealth and Malawi will be the same deal.

    Keep in mind here that the entire purpose of CCU's pursuit of accreditation from Malawi was to circumvent any sort of legitimate accreditation requirements in the U.S. This is their second attempt at this; the first was when they announced that they were accredited by an Indian tribe in Nevada. (I'm not joking about this, either.)

    Personally, I would run the other way. The school, once fairly respected, is becoming more of a joke than MIGS in most people's eyes.

     
  5. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I wonder if John Gray will upgrade his CPU Ph.D. for a Malawi accredited CCU Ph.D.?

    Russell
     
  6. Dan Snelson

    Dan Snelson New Member

    I wonder if a prosthetist I know
    with the VA will up grade HIS BS and MS? [​IMG]
    Dan
     
  7. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Or B. DeAngelis.

    I will never forget the Psych Today article comparing the credentials of John Gottman (Research psychologist) and John Gray. The article referred to others calling Gray's stuff "Poop Psychology" (as opposed to pop).
    It went on to run a list of comparisions one of which said license:
    John Gottman - Psychology
    John Gray - Driver's License

    I am sure Gray is not concerned as he has made $$$$$$$$$$$$ with his unaccredited Ph.D.

    North

     
  8. EllisZ

    EllisZ Member

    Yet we have all heard of John Grey and we never have heard of John Gottman. (I'd venture to say that Grey has had a LOT more of an impact on the culture than Gottman has.) Of course this is america. He's free to poo poo about it if he wishes.
    :)
     
  9. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    While I basically agree with all of that, I do think that pre-meltdown Columbia Pacific filled a niche. It was probably one of the stars of the CA-approved world.

    Columbia Pacific actually had prominent graduates. Not only Gray, but a host of the kind of people that hold book signings in New-Age bookstores. CPU was actually having an effect on one peculiar corner of the Bay Area intellectual scene.

    It's easy to laugh at that, but it is no more ridiculous than the post-modernist scholarship that infests so many prestige universities. Gray's books make a lot more sense to me than that paper that Alan Sokal published in 'Social Text'.

    That's why I think that the mismanagement and self-destruction of CPU is kind of a tragedy. If it had moved in the other direction and tightened up its academic act a little, it might have achieved RA and become another Saybrook or CIIS.
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Dan,

    Is CCU also offering those who have CPU bachelor's and master's degrees the opportunity to upgrade to a CCU Ph.D. as well? If so, not bad for $750.00. [​IMG]

    Russell
     
  11. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member


    There was a time when distance learning was very "alternative"; no one knew where it was going. Columbia Pacific University was as reasonable an alternative as Walden or Sarasota, maybe even more so. But it was always about the money; the owners made millions. Not to say there weren't any academics going on, but it wasn't just about that. Hindsight is 20/20, of course, but it now seems clear that there never was any intention on CPU's part to join the rest of the academic world, as many of its legitimate contemporaries did once the regionals loosened up.

    There is no legitimate reason for an unaccredited school to remain so indefinitely, with perhaps a few, narrow exeptions. (Schools that fill a particular niche, especially in California.) This is my main beef about CPU/CCU and California Coast. Heck, do what SCUPS did: open up shop across the state line and come under the jurisdiction of a friendlier regional association. Unless, of course, it is just about the money.

    Rich Douglas
     
  12. DWCox

    DWCox member

    Like it or not (Malawi accreditation)if it gains CCWU a membership in The Association of Commonwealth Universities and thus a listing in the Commonwealth Universities Yearbook and/or UNESCO then CCWU accomplished legitimate foreign accreditation.

    My two cents.

    Regards, Wes
     
  13. Guest

    Guest Guest

    What an interesting thought. If it made not only UNESCO but ACU as well that would put them a step ahead of Berne University. As Malawi does have a public university system, you may be able to get a foreign credential evaluator to buy off. Although, in the short term I am sure that the unfortunate history of CPU may play a part in how well the degree is received for certain things. For others however, if the foreign credential evaluator said it was the equivalent of accredited it would be acceptable (eg. the organization I work for).

    But, at this point we are not at that point. [​IMG]

    Did anyone figure out why they are accredited by the Ministry of Labour and not Education??

    North

     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    This is really quite simple, North! It requires a certain amount of labor to write a check to CCU, walk to the mail box and mail it, then walk back to the mail box to get the diploma. This would naturally fall under the auspices of the Malawi Ministry of Labor. [​IMG]

    Russell
     
  15. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Thurston Howell University is recognized by the Ministry of Education of Gilligan's Island. I wonder if this would qualify THU for GAAP?

    Russell
     
  16. pbocij

    pbocij member

    Hi,

    Maybe I just don't get it, but I'm not sure that my question has been answered. Whether it's genuine or just on a technicality, does CCU now meet GAAP?

    Paul
     
  17. David Yamada

    David Yamada New Member

    Well put. What Bill calls the "pre-meltdown" CPU probably was the strongest candidate since the pre-RA Union Institute of taking an alternative model and -- through some upgrading and more flexibility from accreditors -- gaining regional accreditation.

    And as an aside: yes yes yes to Bill's comments regarding some of the stuff that passes for high-level scholarship at some of the toniest RA schools. By contrast, CPU alums like John Gray and Barbara DeAngelis may not be everyone's cuppa tea, but their books have made a positive difference in some lives.
     
  18. Randy Kearns

    Randy Kearns Member

    Just to further verify your point, Columbia Pacific University, Page 74, College Degrees by Mail 2nd Edition by John Bear Ph.D. favorably listed as one of the "One Hundred Good Schools Offering Degrees." Clearly the Bear Text doesn't offer the same endorsement today, nevertheless, that's how it was listed less than 10 years ago.

    RK
     
  19. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    And 10 years is a very long time. Ten years ago the internet was a file transfer system a few geeky guys had access to at their university. Ten years ago there were only a handful of accredited DL doctoral progams available to people in the U.S. (Union, Walden, Nova, Fielding, perhaps one or two others, depending upon when they were accredited.) Foreign doctoral programs where absolutely unavailable. (UNISA was--and is--technically, but not practically.) No one really knew what the accreditors were going to do regarding DL, and the DETC was just getting started in their efforts to accredited degree-granting schools. There were some very good DL schools that seemed to be excluded from the RA club. If someone would've told me back then that Sarasota would become accredited but Columbia Pacific would not, I wouldn't have believed it.


    Ten years is an eon.

    Rich Douglas
     
  20. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    I thought that I answered it up above.

    'GAAP' is just a listing in at least one of the reference books that university admissions officers often consult. A university 'meets GAAP' when it appears in one or more of those books.

    CCU will 'meet GAAP' when whoever the editors of those references decide to include it. That is the answer to your question.

    Obvously that's pretty lame. So the real interest is in the questions that revolve around that.

    Like what does it take for a university to be listed? I think that varies from editor to editor, and from country to country. The easiest book to crack seems to be UNESCO's IHU. They apparently list all universities that have the normal local approval in their own country, which in all but a few cases (the US) is state approval.

    What does such a listing say about a university? I think that varies, depending on what criteria have to be met to receive local government approval. Some nations are very fastidious, only approving universities of the highest caliber. Others seem to have no quality assurance process at all. If Malawi is really approving CPU/CCU in the same manner it approves domestic schools (it's hard to be sure what they are doing), then Malawi would fall in the latter category. But CCU/CPU would probably be included in the IHU becaue of that approval and hence would 'meet GAAP'.

    But my guess is that Malawi is simply using the word "accredit" in the rather dishonest manner increasingly employed by British universities (like Liverpool with Trinity) to mean "endorse". An endorsement that does not imply any of the legal or academic conditions necessary to acquire the charters or acts of parliament required at home. In that case CPU/CCU probably would not 'meet GAAP'.
     

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