Argosy University, DBA in Accounting

I am an American citizen, I hold a Master of Science in Accounting and Finance from UK. I currently work as a faculty member outside USA. I am willing to resign and continue my PhD/DBA in Accounting in the States,. I am planning to relocate in Sarasota and join Argosy's University DBA in Accounting on full time basis..................Is this possible ? can anyone attend the Argosy DBA full time in residence or is it only by distance. ? Does anyone recommend this program. I am planning to work in academia after getting the DBA in USA. I am really in a dilemma and confused, it is a major investment and i have to decide very soon whether to go to Argosy or not...I have read a lot about Argosy and from my research discovered that lots of faculty members in USa universities hold DBAs from Argosy, and i was interested by their whole program and it seems in my opinion strong.

But please i would appreciate if you help me in taking this decision and would be happy for addvice. ?? Please

 

Honest Question on High Priced Doctorates

I've looked at some doctorates from Fielding, Argosy, NSU, Walden, Capella, etc...

My question to you all:

How do you justify the high, and I mean HIGH, cost of these programs?????

How do you justify spending $40K on a non-aacsb doctorate that will get you NO CHANCE at a high paying faculty job at a university?

How does anybody justify a high priced education doctorate that will put you in a mountain of debt with little financial return?

For instance, I am a tenured prof at my community college. A doctorate would pay me $1,800 a year more. I had a few say I should do a doctorate and I just laugh. Sometimes you have to ask "what for?"

When I talk to people about this I always say DO IT FOR THE RIGHT REASONS, not to get a title. Let's face it; I think a huge percentage of people get into doctoral studies for the title. A WRONG reason.

Now, if I were 25 to maybe 35 and had my heart set on a university slot teaching business with a chance at big bucks, I might consider an aacsb doctorate because that is the "union card" to get in. But I am a tenured 51 year old professor at a community college. A doctorate makes no financial sense whatsoever.

I've been on countless faculty hiring committees and am often amazed at how many applicants think getting a doctorate, for instance, would help them in their job search. I tell them a second masters in another field or related field means so much more at a C.C.

So, think through your reasons for a doctorate and make sure they are sound. For gawds sake, don't overpay for a doctorate. Spending $40k or more on an education doctorate, especially... makes no particular sense.

 

Those are good points. I just keep thinking about one thing - most cars cost $25,000 - $35,000 these days.

 

I understand that Argosy's DBA is primary a residential program. However, you have to verify that the accounting concentration is given at the Sarasota campus.

As a separate note, Argosy's is not the cheapest and not the most prestigious residential program. If you are planning full time attendance, I would suggest a program where you will receive financial support for your studies and with an AACSB accreditation.

Argosy is a good option for part time and online study but I don't know if you would like to do it there full time given its costs and lack of AACSB accreditation.

 

Re: Honest Question on High Priced Doctorates

In purely financial terms, no, it doesn't make a lot of sense. In my case, I've always wanted a doctorate, and to do research. Literally. This comes from growing up under the tutelage of one of the shining stars of academia (my father) in his field before his very untimely death at a young age.

As I've gotten older, I've wondered about the ROI on such a journey, particularly considering that the DL route, as you said, does not provide entry into the standard halls of academia, certainly not into the higher-paying and/or tenured positions.

So, why do it? Well, I love my research, and love the thrill of publishing so far. I love the intellectual rigor -- I feel like I've been waiting for such my whole life. Although accepted to several B&M PhD programs (one in biz, AACSB accredited, two in education, one of which being one of the top in the country . . . and yes, I only applied to those three), I really enjoy living the life of the expat, and don't want, at this point, to come back to the U.S. In addition, both my life here and my job put me right in the middle of what my research is all about (expat adjustment). That's invaluable knowledge, IMHO, that those that only stay in academia just don't get.

You know, I got one of those "afraid moments", right after my recent divorce, that I should stop pursuing my Ph.D., and entered into a DL, AASCB-accredited MAcc program. I figured my ROI would be much greater, given that in many states the MAcc would qualify me to sit for the CPA exam, and I've never known an out of work CPA! The result? After one semester, I returned to the Ph.D. Not that there was anything wrong with the program, but it just wasn't right for me . . . my heart belonged in my Ph.D. work. So, I'm back to it.

In terms of the hefty price tag of Capella (and I'll agree, it's durned expensive), the fact that it's allowing me to pursue a life-long goal, while still enjoy the life that I have now, the price actually becomes meaningless for me. What will I eventually end up doing in the future with it? Only time will tell, and I tend to make a pretty good path for myself, so I'm not really worried. But, if I die tomorrow, at least I'll die happy; I rather carpe diem, so to speak, than not.

Cheers,
Adrienne

(Sorry if that's quite a ramble . . . I'm in a very prolific mood tonight for some reason)

 

Re: Honest Question on High Priced Doctorates

Without going in to the details, my "high priced" NSU degree has paid off significantly - both on a financial and a personal satisfaction basis.

Also, I know of peers from NSU (including those in accounting) that have secured good teaching positions.

I agree that the motivation for pursing a DL doctorate should be more than financial. Some folks have found that these programs didn't pay off for them.

But I wouldn't be so bold as to say "NO CHANCE". I've seen to many exceptions.

Regards - Andy

 

Determining a degree's worth is a subjective exercise

I believe that everyone's cost-benefit analysis is based on their personal situation. In the Fall of this year I plan to pursue a doctorate at either Nova, Argosy, UMUC, or Touro. I have been accepted into 2 of those programs, and am waiting to hear from the other 2.

Assuming that the average cost is $40K and it takes me 4 years to finish, that is $10K per year out-of-pocket. I am teaching as an adjunct with my 2 Masters degrees, but in my area there are 4 schools that require a doctorate or to be AMA to teach part-time. Assuming that once I reach ABA status, I start teaching at one of these schools, that could easily account for 1/2 the $10K/year that I am paying. And, where I am currently teaching, they pay more to holders of doctorate degreees.

In addition, I am 47, and age prejudice does exist, so teaching is a good back. It is also want I want to do full-time in about 5 years. While I will probably not teach at Harvard or Stanford, doing a Google search shows there are many grads of this type of doctorate program teaching at "good" schools. I will have a better quality of life, more vacation time, and the doctorate will also help me in doing some consulting.

So, IMHO, the $40K investment is well-worth it. Of course, it may not be for everyone....

 

I meant to say ABA in my previous post

Not AMA

 

Good Thoughtful Responses

Everybody is different, which seems totally obvious. Each person has a different situation. After three grad degrees, I thought I'd take a year off and then get the steam to go back... but it didn't work out that way. I want to do more writing for publication and not write things only grad students will read. I now go to conferences and present. Before, I only had time for school.

I know a few at my community college who have doctorates from Nova and Capella. In my college, I make $1,800 less than my doctorally qualified peers. If they made that $10,000 more, I'd instantly work on a doctorate. Cars may cost $25k but I buy smaller cars and run them ten years. haha

The other thing is the dirty little secret that less than 50% of doctoral students finish. It has nothing to do with not being smart enough, either. That is an interesting study in itself. At one point, I had been admitted to Nebraska's doctoral program but pulled out. You know why? They could NOT answer my questions on % of graduates who start who finish. Duquesne University is the only uni that addresses this upfront by saying the low finish rate of doctoral candidates is a disgrace. For that they have my respect. Here is a link of interest: http://www.sju.edu/cas/education/edd/dissertation.html

 

Re: Good Thoughtful Responses

I'd sure like to know more about drop out rates in doctoral programs. In the DL world it would seem that much of this is self inflicted. At NSU, for example, I heard on occasion of folks that were kicked out of the program. Those that didn't finish in most cases, however, simply decided that they didn't want to continue.

I'm particularly interested in UK and Australian doctoral programs. I've heard they too have low graduation rates - but I'm wondering there if it is by choice or institutional decision.

Regards - Andy

 

Re: Re: Good Thoughtful Responses

Andy,

In the case of Australian doctorates, it is mainly by institutional decision. In my case, the major filter was the dissertation proposal, we were given only two shoots to get it approved and many were asked to leave.

Also residential requirements are hard to meet if you don't live in Australia. Recently USQ included residential requirements so I believe CSU is the only 100% DL doctorate in Australia. T

As for the utility of Australian doctorates, I believe the fill the gap of an accredited doctorate when is needed. You can use it to get access to positions where the doctorate is needed.

 

Completion rates over here are actually quite good . . . unless you're a part-timer (which includes all DL students).

Everything you ever wanted to know about UK completion rates is at http://www.hefce.ac.uk/pubs/hefce/2005/05_02/

Angela

 

Re: Good Thoughtful Responses

In addition to this $1,800 annually, those with DL doctorates enjoy the benefit of not being compelled to explain on the public board why they don't have a doctorate.

Seriously, your edducational accomplishments are just fine. Quit defending what noone attacks.

 

Thanks for the lead - key quote:

"Following this definition we find that by 2000-01, after five years, 57 per cent of PhD students who began their studies on a full-time course, and 19 per cent starting on a part-time course had completed. By 2002-03, after seven years, the completion rates were 71 per cent and 34 per cent for full-time and part-time starters respectively. "

Part-time study appears to have a much higher drop out rate than full-time. I don't know what the completion rates are for US schools.

Regards - Andy

 

Re: Good Thoughtful Responses

At Nova Graduate School of Computer and Information Sciences (GSCIS), the reasons for high dropout rates are as follows:

1. Institutional: Students are kicked out of the doctoral program either because of low GPA (less than 3.0) or inability to come up with a research proposal. As a matter of fact, more than 90 percent of all GSCIS doctoral students usually complete their course works but only about 50 percent eventually advance to candidacy. I believe that more than 90 percent of those who advance to candidacy eventually graduate. GSCIS has time limit of seven years for doctoral studies. Students who couldn’t advance to candidacy after 6 years are usually advised to reconsider their aspiration.

2. Personal decision: Some students simply quit because of lack of funds needed to continue or because they don’t want take more loans. Others throw in the towel because they think that they couldn’t make it to the end, especially in cases where the research proposal of a student has been rejected by more than five professors. The usual thing to do after a proposal has been rejected by at least two professors is to come up with a new proposal or overhaul the one that was rejected based on feedback that was received but some students are too indolent to do that. Some students also abandon their pursuit because of family emergencies or because of demands of their jobs or because of illness.

Umm… as Andy always says, the doctoral program is like an endurance race. With good focus and perseverance, you will surely finish the race. If you relent or stray, you will not reach the endpoint. I also believe that your success in a doctoral program depends largely on your dissertation advisor. Perhaps, if I had chosen a different person as my dissertation chair, I might still be writing my dissertion today.