Need Advice Asap------please Help!!!

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by ncguy, Apr 14, 2005.

Loading...
  1. ncguy

    ncguy New Member

    HELLO ALL,
    I am thinking about attending Ashworth College for my associate in bus. management, i plan on following up on this degree by attending Forsyth Community College in specific CERTIFICATE courses also bus. management related. Does anyone think this would be a good idea, if not why?
    Secondly,i chose Ashworth because of the cost of this specific degree.i'm new to DL, and have read most of the forums about Ashworth. Is there anyother colleges/universities offering an associates in bus. manangement around the SAME PRICE, for i am paying all out-of-pocket.
    Thank you for any and all info you all provide me
     
  2. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    You say you've read everything. Fine... I'm sure you've read a bunch. But just make sure you read every last word of this thread so you're crystal clear about the transferability of the Ashworth credits -- or, really, so as not to single-out Ashworth, the credits from any nationally-accredited institution.
     
  3. Randell1234

    Randell1234 Moderator

    Do you have your heart set on Ashworth College? If so, why?
    What is your main driving forces for a degree - cost or speed or transferability? How much is the Ashworh Degree?

    When looking at at Associates degree or Bachelors, I would always recommend an RA degree unless one is not offered or can not be found easily.

    For a associates degree in business, I would go RA.
     
  4. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    Well, of course, I agree with you. That said, five bucks down; and then $35/month for 24 to 28 months (depending on the Ashworth AS degree); and then a final payment of $4 to $8 -- with not a penny's-worth of interest anywhere in the equation -- is usually pretty difficult for those in ncguy's shoes to resist.

    And, moreover, as the thread to which I referred the reader in my previous post, herein, explains, the credits might be a bit more easily transferable than originally thought. Or not. Just depends on the RA BA/BS program.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 14, 2005
  5. TCord1964

    TCord1964 New Member

    I assume by your screen name that you're in North Carolina? If that is the case, you may want to consider a community college in your state. There are a number of NC community colleges which offer distance learning business degrees. A quick Google search turned up Johnston Community College, which offers a DL Associates of Arts in Business Administration with a concentration in Operations Management. Tuition is only $44.40 per credit for North Carolina residents, which would be cheaper than Ashworth. You can view the full list of DL degrees offered at North Carolina Community Colleges at:

    http://www.ncccs.cc.nc.us/Distance_Learning/degrees_at_a_distance.htm

    The degrees are also regionally accredited, which does make it easier to transfer to a four-year program, especially if you decide to get it in North Carolina.
     
  6. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    How do you figure that? An associates degree is 60 hours. At $44.40/hour, that's $2,664 at Johnston. Ashworth is $35/month x 24 months = $840... give or take... ostensibly because sometimes it's 24 months, sometimes it's 26, sometimes 28, depending on the degree; plus the down payment and the final payment. Still, all in all, you're looking at less than $1,000 for the Ashworth degree. That's less than half the cost of the Johnston degree -- closer to a third, actually.

    Wait a monute: When you said "per credit," did you mean per credit hour (with each course being 3 credit hours); or per 3-hour course. If it's the latter, then Johnston and Ashworth are darned close to being the same. But I'm guessing you meant the former... right?

    Now, on that one, you take the pot.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 14, 2005
  7. TCord1964

    TCord1964 New Member

    Your math is flawed, DesElms. You're right that Ashworth is about $840...PER SEMESTER. There are four semesters to complete to get the associates degree from Ashworth. That's a grand total of $3360. Ask any Ashworth student. I did.

    Now, the Ashworth degree DOES include books, so that would perhaps make things even, or maybe even make Ashworth a slightly better buy. It depends on how much you're spending on books at the community college. However, there is that pesky RA vs. NA issue...
     
  8. ncguy

    ncguy New Member

    I thank all who responded to my post. My driving force on getting a degree from Ashworth was and is price. I have kids and a wife.I helped put my wife through college and she is now a RN. The fact remains that truly my kids come first,so cost is very dear to me.
    I recently ran into Direct Educations' associate degree program in bussiness management, and was wondering wich one would you all recommend.Like i said earlier i am new to DL, but have been reading these forums for awhile,I RESPECT EVERY AND ALL OPINOINS,for you all have gone where i haven't,....again i ask for your for all help on evaluating Ashorth vs Education Direct.
    as for commmunity college,i can only take CERTIFICATE courses because every cost is comming out-of pocket. I figure i could get a degree from a DETC school and have RA certificates to make my porfolio that much better to an employer.-----any thoughts?
     
  9. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck

    How about:

    Nose around at www.sreb.org

    I found the below there and it has a potential. Spend some time looking over www.bain4weeks.com

    Testing for credits can also be cheaper but you would want to enroll in a school that has liberal policies on testing credit and in some instances the credit may not transfer to higher level schools so make a plan for you degree progression. Plenty of folks and information that can assist in this forum.

    Regards,

    http://www.electroniccampus.org/student/scripts/programs/programlist.asp?Page=1&SearchType=Standard&Term=&TermName=&SearchField=1&Keywords=&Subject=All&Institution=All&State=34&ProgLevel=1&Sort=ProgramTitle&PageSize=20&B1=Submit


    http://styx.pittcc.edu/division/business/BusinessAdmin/Curriculums/admhome.htm

    http://www.pitt.cc.nc.us/students/admissions/tuition.html#Virtual
     
  10. jayncali73

    jayncali73 New Member

    ncguy-

    If I had to choose between Ashworth and Education Direct-I would chose Ed Direct. Ed Direct is very affordable, the classwork is very doable (but challenging) and I was able to transfer all of my units to Excelsior College because they are an RA candidate.

    I enjoyed my program at Education direct very much and you can work at your own pace. I was able to finish a semster in about 4 months dedicating about 16-18 hrs weekly to study.
     
  11. TCord1964

    TCord1964 New Member

    Don't forget that if you go the community college route, you may qualify for financial aid. Depending on your income, you may qualify for a number of state and federal grants, which you don't have to pay back. At the very least, you may likely qualify for a loan, which you can pay back over time. You don't start to repay the loan until you are no longer a student, another advantage over Ashworth.

    I would also chose Education Direct over Ashworth because I believe their courses are reviewed by ACE, which means more colleges will accept their courses for transfer credit.
     
  12. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    Well, then it's not my math that's wrong but, rather, it's Ashworth's web site that's misleading. Upon closer examination, I see that an assumption I made based on how Ashworth charges monthly for its masters degrees may not necessarily apply to how it charges monthly for its associates degrees. If one looks on the tuition page for Ashworth's MBA program, it shows/explains it like this:

    • TUITION
      You may choose to pay in full, or you may take advantage of our affordable, interest-free monthly tuition plan with a low down payment. We accept MasterCard, VISA, American Express, and Discover credit cards. We also accept checks and money orders.

      Business Administration - Full tuition: $4889.00

      Easy Payment Plan: Low down payment of $99.00; interest-free monthly payments of $99.00 each month for 48 months; plus a final payment of $38.00.
    But on the associates degree site, for the AS in Business Management, for example, using the exact same format, Ashworth words it slightly differently:

    • TUITION
      You may choose to pay in full for each semester, or you may take advantage of our affordable, interest-free monthly tuition plan with a low down payment. NOTE: tuition and administrative fees for future semesters are subject to change.

      Business Management - Full tuition for first semester: $789.00

      Easy Payment Plan: low down payment of $5.00; interest-free monthly payments of $35.00 each month for 22 months; plus a final payment of $14.00
    I missed those pesky "for the first semester" weasel words! (Of course, since I don't much care about it other than for these discussions, it's understandable that I didn't read carefully. That said, it was a rookie mistake on my part.)

    So, let me make sure I understand Ashworth's "$35 per month" associates degrees. To pay for the entire Ashworth associates degree in manner similar to that by which one may pay for its masters (i.e., $35/month for the associates, as touted on the Ashworth associates degree web site), one would... what... pay $35/month for 22 months x 4 consecutive semester's-worth of that = 88 months (which is just over 7 years) = $3,080 (plus, of course, the down and final payment for each of the four 22 month periods)? If so, the student would still be paying for his/her associates long after s/he's finished his/her masters! That can't be how it works.

    - OR -

    More, likely, would it be, instead, $35/month during the 1st semester; and lasting 22 months. Then $70/month during the second semester; and lasting another 22 months which overlaps the first semester's 22 months. Then $105/month during the third semester; and lasting yet another 22 months which overlaps both the first and the second semester's 22 months. Then $140/month during the fourth semester... which overlaps all previous semesters' 22 month periods for a while and, therefore, stays that way for about a half a year until the first semester's 22 months expires, at which point it drops back down to $105/month. Then, a few months later, when the second semester's 22 months expires, it drops back down to $70/month. Then, another few months later, when the third semester's 22 months expires, it drops back down to $35/month. And then, finally, when the fourth semester's 22 months expires, it's finally all paid off... some 40 months (not quite 3-1/2 years) after the associates degree was begun, and 16 months (not quite 1-1/2 years) after it was completed. Of course, even then that's not so bad because it would be still be paid off before s/he had completed his/her bachelors degree. That [/i]must[/i] be the way Ashworth intended it, no?

    Or is Ashworth saying that it's neither of those options; and that being able to pay $35/month is something one can really only do for that first semester (so, of course, Ashworth can get ya' hooked); and that Ashworth, for the other three semesters, expects one to cough-up the entire semester's 800-something-dollars-worth of tuition at the beginning thereof? Is that it?

    Yeah... I forgot to mention, earlier, Ashworth's inclusion of books. That part, I did get right.

    Exactly. And if one wants the maximum flexibility, RA is the only way to go.

    It seems to me that you're putting way too much stock into an associates degree in the first place. The Ashworth versus Education Direct; and the RA versus NA arguments notwithstanding, if you don't get the bachelors, you've really made a huge tactical error. The associates as a tool to impress an employer -- whether or not augmented by additional certificates -- is an unsound strategy. Get the bachelors as quickly as you can. If money is the problem, and if you were ready to accept Ashworth and its national accreditation, then a bachelors from Andrew Jackson University, just to give one example, would probably be just about perfect for you. To get maximum savings, get the AS at Ashworth, then the BS in Business from AJU. But, one way or the other, don't hang your hat too much on the associates alone. Somehow get the bachelors!

    TCord1964 makes an excellent point, ncguy: ACE approval can make a nationally-accredited credential look ever-so-slightly better -- or maybe even alot better, depending on who's looking -- to a regionally-accredited institution that you may someday be asking to accept your credits in transfer.
     
  13. TCord1964

    TCord1964 New Member

     
  14. jayncali73

    jayncali73 New Member

    Just a note...

    Not all of Education Direct's courses are ACE reviewed (or approved). However, Ed Direct is a candidate for RA accreditation, which could help in the transferability.

    Excelsior took my units even though they have not been ACE reviewed. ( I know I have written this line several times however, I am just too excitied they took my units).
     
  15. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    Yikes! Eight years to pay for a two year associates degree!

    Really? That doesn't make sense, if you think about it. Under that methodology, the second semester's twenty-something months of $35/month payments would not even begin until 18 months after the second semester studies had commenced, and one year after they'd been completed... and so on, and so on, with the other semesters.

    Hmm. Okay... that's it... I'm callin' Ashworth. Be right back.

    [time passes]

    Okay, got the info. You're right. The second semester's twenty-something months is tacked-on to the end of the first semester's twenty-something months, thereby bringing us out to forty-something months (almost four years) just to get the first two semester's-worth of coursework paid for; and the third semester's twenty-something months is tacked-on to the end of the second twenty-something months, thereby bringing us out to seventy something months (around 6 years) just to get the first three semesters paid for; and then, finally, the fourth semester's twenty-something months is tacked on to the end of the third semester's twenty-something months, bringing us out to ninety-something months (almost 8 years) in order to finally get all four semesters paid for! As I pointed out earlier, that's long enough for one to have gone on and completed one's bachelors and masters degrees -- and even be on one's way to one's doctorate, for godsake!

    The continuing flow of the $35/month payments is apparently the key to the kingdom. For example, Ashworth doesn't concern itself with the fact that, as one only begins the second semester, one is still 18 months away from having even paid-off the first. They said that as long as one keeps that $35/month rolling in, religiously, and without missing (or being late for) a single month anywhere along the line, they'll let one enroll in the second, third and fourth semesters without batting an eye.

    But, as you pointed out, even after one has finished the fourth and final semester -- leaving all 60 hours of coursework done and overwith -- Ashworth will not issue the degree, diploma and/or transcript until all coursework is paid for in full. So while one may complete the degree after only two years, if one goes with the $35/month program and takes it out to its full 8 years, one will have an associates degree for four years which one cannot actually use in any way!

    Now, all of this would be quite troubling...

    ...except for the fact that Ashworth charges no interest. That, as I see it, is the operative factor that makes it okay that Ashworth structures the whole thing as it does. Oh, sure, it takes a long time to pay off at $35/month, but at least one is not being gouged for interest along the way.

    Moreover, as I understand it, if one were to fall behind on one's payments, the $5 late fee would pretty much be the worst of it. In other words, Ashworth doesn't, as I understand it, report one's payment history to the credit bureau; so, therefore, a missed payment or two -- or even several, for that matter -- while doing nothing for one's reputation with Ashworth, doesn't negatively affect one's credit rating. Of course, if Ashworth ends-up having to sue to get the money, then the judgement eventually would become part of one's credit history... and rightly so, I might add.

    So, in some ways, this is a gift to the student -- especially those who are really and truly cash-strapped and/or have no credit cards or other ways to get a loan to pay for the associates degree. The fact that there's no interest forgives the long time it takes to pay it off, with the only real downside being that if someone who completed the Ashworth associates after two years wanted to actually use it somehow, s/he'd still had six years left (at $35/month) before it finally got paid off.

    That would be impractical, of course. According to the Ashworth person with whom I spoke, many students, at that point (i.e., at the end of 24 months, when they finally complete the coursework), just "balloon-pay" whatever balance remains at that point in one lump sum -- sometimes with a VISA or MasterCard, but also sometimes just from their savings over those two years -- so that they can get their diploma and transcripts, etc.

    A better way, it seems to me, and as you suggested, TCord1964, would be to sign-up for the $35/month plan, but just overpay each month so that it's finally all paid-off by the time one finishes the last of the coursework at around the end of the second year. In other words...


    For my little example and its assumptions, here, we know that each Ashworth AS degree costs a slightly different amount per semester, but is, generally, in the $800 price range, give or take; and it can be paid-for with $35/month payments for slightly different lengths of time which tends to be around 24 months, give or take; and different final payment amounts, depending on the degree are required in the $3 to maybe $14 range. So, for my little illustration, here, let's just assume a hypothetical Ashworth AS degree that costs:
    • $5 down; and,
    • $35 per month for 24 months; and,
    • A $10 final payment.
    for a grand total of $855 per semester, all things considered; for four (4) semesters... bringing the final, total cost of the degree to $3,420 (including books).


    Further, let's assume:
    • that the student treats each six (6) month calendar period as one (1) semester; and,
    • that during each six-month-long semester, s/he will take fifteen (15) credit hours worth of coursework; and,
    • that the AS degree, consisting, as it does, of sixty (60) credit hours of coursework, will take four (4) fifteen-credit-hour semesters to complete; and, finally,
    • that said four semesters will take place over two (2) consecutive calendar years (24 consecutive months).

    Under the methodology that you're describing to me, TCord1964; and using my assumptions, above, the student would either have to:
    • Pay $35 per month for a whopping eight (8) years until the degree is finally paid-off some six years after s/he completed the coursework... which means that s/he would have to wait said six (6) years before finally being awarded his/her diploma and transcript; or,
    • s/he could pay $35/month during the 24 months that s/he is doing the coursework (which would reduce the $3,420 balance by $840 to $2,580), and then just balloon-pay the remaining $2,580 all at once (using either cash savings, a loan from a buddy, or a credit card) so that s/he could get his/her diploma and transcript.
    • Another way, I suppose, would be for him/her to go out and get a better job and save-up $241 from each of his/her first ten (10) paychecks (all the while, of course, continuing to make the additional five months of $35 payments that that would require); and then, finally, after said first five months of new employment, use that savings to just balloon-pay what would, by then be a further-reduced remaining balance of $2,405... which, since there's no interest involved, would be a fairly harmless way to do it because said lack of interest makes those additional five months of saving $241/month cost-free![/list=1]
      But the smarter way, it seems to me, is to treat the $35/month payment plan the same way that I recommend people treat a mortgage:
      • Sign-up for low payments over a long period so you're covered if you hit hard times; but double or triple the payments every month whenever you can so you pay it off in half the time or less.
      In this case, one would sign-up for Ashworth's easy-on-the-pocketbook $35/month payments so that that's all Ashworth would expect of them; but when it comes time to actually write the check each month, overpay by an amount that will, if done every single month, effectively retire the debt in the very same 24 months that it takes to complete the coursework.

      If one does that, then all they'd have to do is divide the grand total of $3,420 by 24 months and that -- and not $35 -- would become the actual payment:
      • $3,420 ÷ 24 months = $142.50 per month
      That amount ($142.50 per month) would, in effect, become the desired payment, and the $35/month amount would become the minimum payment... which, if that that's all one made, would mean that it would take longer to pay it off, just like a credit card... but with no interest!

      The overpayment of $107.50 each month would cover what, without said overpayment, would otherwise be six long, additional years of $35/month payments! And I already asked: While overpaying reduces the debt, it does not permit one to skip payments. In other words, if one pays $70 in January (thinking that that will cover both January and February), one cannot, in fact, skip February and then resume $35 payments in March. The $35/month has to keep rolling-in every month, like clockwork, no matter how much more than that one decides to pay in any given month. But that's actually cool because it's the very thing that, because there's no interest, makes the whole overpayment thing work out so well.


      Okay. I got it. By explaining it, here, it's now crystal clear in my head.... and, what the heck, maybe it helped someone who reads it along the way, too.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 16, 2005
  16. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    Cool!

    Congratulations!
     
  17. TCord1964

    TCord1964 New Member

    One could, I suppose, sign up for the $35 per month plan, and just pay $75 per paycheck (every two weeks) for two years. You have to admit...that is STILL a pretty good deal if you don't want to do student loans at an RA school.

    I frequently read the Ashworth message board at Yahoo. Most students admit while there are some problems with Ashworth, they are still genuinely pleased with their experience. A few have also been able to transfer their degrees in total to an RA institution like Upper Iowa University and go for their BA, so the degree does have some utility.

    I've considered getting a BA at TESC, an MA in Integrated Markeing Communications at Golden Gate University and then an MBA from Ashworth. The MBA would be more for the study of business than it would the credential.
     
  18. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    One could do worse

    Actually, many employers would be only too happy to just deduct it and then cut a check straight to Ashworth on the employee/student's behalf -- might even match it or provide some other kind of tuition assistance. Just depends on the employer. I know I certainly would if one of my people came to me and asked. But that's just me.

    Don't sell it so short. It's a perfectly fine credential under the right circumstances. I've always said -- in fact, I'm pretty sure I've said it here a time or two -- that if all one wants is to be able to put "MBA" after one's name on business cards, letterhead, etc. and still have it be completely legit in terms of accreditation so they won't get arrested in places like Oregon; and as long as one wasn't planning on competing for jobs with MBA holders from AACSB-accredited schools; and as long as one was pretty sure that one wouldn't ever be trying to use the MBA as requisite to a doctorate (and, what the heck... who knows... maybe even if one was), then, for the price, the Ashworth MBA is tough to beat. So I'll say it again... er... I mean... oh... wait... I guess I just did.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 16, 2005

Share This Page