Many nonprofits, donors profiting through loopholes

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7385623/

I hope the wonderful non-profit schools get a close look from the IRS. It is about time!

I for one am tired of their "holier than thou" attitude towards the for-profits.

Just my opinion

 

Yep! I too am tired of those evil non-profits and charities! Giving services to the needy?! Who needs that? Providing education for education sake? Bah! What we really need are more U of P/AIU/CTU type schools. Degrees in 10 months with a minimum of work/tests/papers. That is the way to go!

 

Re: Re: Many nonprofits, donors profiting through loopholes

Dave


Ike

 

Re: Re: Many nonprofits, donors profiting through loopholes

Education for education sake? Guess that is why Harvard, Yale, Stanford and the like are so inexpensive to attend!!

Yes, and they do it strictly from the goodness of their hearts!

Surely the above is a lie, right? Dang that Head of the IRS daring to say such untruths!

And how dare those For-profits offer REGIONALLY ACCREDITED degrees in a fashion some members here don't approve of. Heck, some of the members here know more than the accrediting agencies, right?

Sure......

Just my opinion

 

Re: Re: Re: Many nonprofits, donors profiting through loopholes

Actually IF you have the brains to get into Harvard (and probably the others too) and don't have the money it is basically free. That is a great example of what I mean by education for education's sake. How many for-profits will give you a free education if you don't have the cash or financial aid? Zero. As to the original qoute, I don't doubt there is abuse in non-profit corporations and tax structures. I bet as a percentage of the total it is very small. I certainly DO NOT look to UofP\AIU\CTU as ideals in education although I do think they provide pressure on the non-profits that overall is positive.

 

LOL!
My feelings exactly! Very-well said.

Does anyone in here remember how many times (I am sure, more than once) that our US major news media outlets have reported, and continue to report, on the number of huge, for-profit corporations that have not, did not or do not pay even one cent in federal (corporate) taxes? I guess only the bad non-profits may abuse their IRS-granted tax-filing status, right?

Also, somehow anecdotally linking status abuse, alleged tax evasion (or even tax payments), to the DL concept or schools or programs or even accreditation matters ..... as an under-handed way of damning the perceived ills of non-profits over and above the glories and sanctity of for-profits .....

Boy, isn't that quite a stretch!

Great point!

Thanks.

 

Lets not get to clever with analogies, as every ‘big’ corporation I know of pays some form of tuition reimbursement regardless of their tax status...

 

I will consider going to a for-profit under the following conditions:

1) they disclose exactly what percentage of my tuition goes toward cheesy television ads.
2) I can pick the one with the lowest percentage.

Unfortunately I don't think any of them do this. Maybe in the future competition will dictate that they do so, but until they give that kind of disclosure I'd rather go with a non-profit.

 

I don't know enough about these schools to say whether they are privately held or publicly held. If they are publicly held, you could read the annual report to stockholders and probably determine how much they've spent on advertising.
Jack

 

just an fyi, there is no degree we offer that you can get in any less than 18 months, not sure where you received your information.

Not defending for profits, just stating a fact,

 

Hi

I guess I am missing your point. I think Jake was suggesting many large corporations use loopholes to avoid paying any taxes. How does tuition reimbursement come into play?

 

Hi AIC

If you were commenting on my post, I was thinking of AIU/CTU although UofP has a similiar structure. I take it you work for UofP?

 

I want to see them go after Credit Unions. It's incredible how lax credit unions are about who can become members. It used to be "Do you work at so-and-so?" Then "Do you live in so-and-so county?" Now it's pretty much, "Do you breath oxygen?" The tax-paying banks are GETTING SCREWED BIG TIME at the expense of credit unions.

 

I do work for UOP as a counselor, but I also have a degree from a 200 year old non-profit state university (Longwood).

I understand your comment about the structure, and I am not going to get in a debate about course content, etc..because people are allowed to have their opinions, and what you get out of your education largely depends on what you put into it.

I believe UOP is what it is, and it serves its purpose in higher education, nothing more. I just wanted to make clear that no degree program here can be completed in less than 18 months, even w/ course waivers, etc. We have a 30 credit minimum residency for undergrad (24 credits can be satisfied by "course waiver" which is a lengthy process, and I have NEVER seen anyone receive 24 credits of upper division) and only 6 credits can be transferred into the masters program, which I have seen maybe twice.

Didn't mean to sound snippy about it, and I know that AIU has a 13 month bachelors, which seems crazy, but it works for some people.

Non-Profits and For-Profits both serve their purposes in Higher Ed, but there are bad eggs on both sides.

 

Northern Arizona University has a 10 month 31 credit MBA.

AACSB no less!:

http://www.cba.nau.edu/degreeprograms/grad/mba/

I esp like this part:

Are they taking a shot at their fellow non-profits?

All debating fun and games aside I find this program interesting. I intend to take a closer look for myself.

Just my opinion

 

But wait...How about the cheesy billboard on I-85 for the Terry MBA from UGA?

 

No way! I pass one of those every day on my way to work (I-285 exit -- N. Peachtree/Chamblee Dunwoody). I take your point, it's pretty cheesy. I still think the TV ads for Devry are worse... the ones that that start with some guy slumped in a dark pit, covered in slime, cracking rocks with his forehead until he hears about Devry, at which point he jumps up and drives his Lexus past a gaggle of screaming supermodels into work as the Senior VP of Nanotechnology Operations.

 

Interesting idea. I took a quick look through press releases on Yahoo! Finance....

Corinthian Colleges (ticker: COCO) latest quarter
Net revenues 100.0 %
---------------
Educational services 51.6 %
General and administrative 8.4 %
Marketing and advertising 21.5 %


Apollo Group (UoP) (ticker: APOL) Latest Quarter
Tuition and other, net $ 505,693 (th)
----
Instructional costs 221,635 43%
Selling and promotional 121,016 23%
General and administrative 23,499 4.5%


Devry (DV) latest quarter
Revenue 100.0%
-----
Cost of Educational Services 55.6%
Student Services & Admin. Exp. 39.4%


Strayer (STRA)
Revenues $52,268 (th)
----
Instructional and
educational support 17,247 or 32%
Selling and promotion 7,872 or 15%
General and
administration 6,377 or 12%



As I expected they don't break advertising out too much, you might find it if you looked very deeply, but companies don't have a huge reason to disclose exactly how much they spend on everything because this gives their competitors an insight into their operations... they want to disclose enough to keep investors happy, but no more than that. You'll see Devry doesn't break out advertising as much as the others do.

 

Did you note that their 10 month program is only for full-time students who have an undergraduate degre in business? It is 2 years for part-time students. If you don't have an undergrad business degree, you're looking at up to 21 hours of additional work.

I really don't know anything about NAU, but I think their program is closer to the norm for AACSB quality programs then your post might suggest.

Regards - Andy

 

Hi Myles

Thanks for the post. I probably agree with everything in your post although I might disagree with unsaid items. I too think both for-profits and not-for-profits have a place in the education system. I guess I probably get a little testy when people suggest they are equals. I certainly don't see it that way. Again thanks and take care.