Any thoughts on a competency-based doctoral program?

Some months back I was perusing some of the newly offered degree programs with WGU, and was wondering if there were any future plans for a doctoral program. Growing more curious about this notion, I inquired with someone (informally during a phone conversation) involved with the school about whether there are any future plans in the works for developing a doctoral program. What I was told is basically that; “the idea had been brought up several times”, but that there were no immediate future plans (that they were aware of) to introduce such a program. My impression from the rest of the conversation was that emphasis is being placed on ensuring the quality of current (and developing) programs, and that such takes precedence over the consideration and development of new programs.

I was impressed with the response given, yet personally I am quite intrigued by the idea of a competency based doctoral program. I would be quite interested in the opinions of the other members of this board as to how such a program could be designed, implemented, and administered, while still ensuring a very high standard of rigor & merit in a field-of-study? Obviously at the doctoral level a program must entail genuine scholarship to ensure academic integrity, but I wonder what measures could be used to integrate a valid competency approach to doctoral study?

My own thoughts:

Any such program (IMO) must include a substantial, verifiable and valid research element equal to that of doctoral programs in other well established and respected institutions. I don’t personally believe in the “fast-track” style of doctorate. My personal view is that unless someone can devote a significant portion of their day “full-time” to such a program, that a doctorate, the highest level of academic achievement, should only be awarded for significant and valid scholarship that adds to the greater body of knowledge in a given field and area of study. I don’t really see how such a task can be achieved in only three years, part-time, by the AVERAGE person who holds down a full-time job, possibly cares for children, and deals with the everyday responsibilities of life. I suspect that many of those who have accomplished it are well above average in many ways, obsessively driven to succeed, or perhaps (in some cases) produced borderline scholarly work that could, and would have been much more extensive, and had much greater depth if they had been pursuing a full time program or been involved in a part time program that required a longer minimum time.



Before I received a ton of flame-mail from this thread, let me add the following:

I would gladly call anyone who has done considerable work for, successfully defended, and earned an accredited (or GAAP) doctorate, the title of “Doctor”. I do not doubt that they have EARNED the right to place “Dr.” before their name, or the degree nomenclature acronym after their name. I often wonder how many here have accomplished the feat of an accredited doctoral program (via DL) while still meeting the demands of daily family and work-a-day life. I know my own studies and drive to faster degree completion have led me to sleep deprivation (at various times), the total lack of a social life and a constant struggle to self-motivate and maintain that motivation; how must DL study & work be at the doctoral level? I have a great deal of respect for people who have earned a doctorate through distance education and am amazed that many have done it in only three years. So too, do I have much respect and admiration for those who have earned professional doctorates, such as a bar qualifying JD, via DL. What I don’t subscribe to, is the belief that there should be fast track or part time DL doctorates that can be completed in only three years. If nothing else it diminishes the reputation of distance education when perceptually compared to full time programs at B&M institutions. Even individuals that produce research and work of the utmost quality and relevance in their field are often viewed as somehow lesser by others in academia. I don’t believe that is fair to those involved in DL doctoral programs, and think that part of the perception is the product of the time-factor involved.

(I realize I should have said this in another thread, and that this part of my post is a departure from the topic of “competency based doctoral programs”.)



Additional thoughts regarding competency based doctorates:


Perhaps a program can be set up in cooperation with a university located near the student, provided that the school in question grants doctoral degree in/or related to the field of study in question. This approach would be similar to the way the WGU Teacher’s College handles student teaching or internships with local school districts. Yet, instead of the practical focus, a competency based doctoral program could be centered on a joint-research focus. What I don’t see is how such a program would integrate the competency approach. While at least one school (EBS) had developed a DBA, which is more of a professional doctorate program that is likely quite rigorous and of excellent quality, how would a school develop a competency research doctoral program? It seems to me that such a program would have to be very similar to a B&M doctoral program.

What are everyone’s thoughts on this?


On a last note; it should be known that I do not represent WGU in any way! I am just a poster and a DL student like many on this forum. I do however really like the importance and value that the staff of Western Governors places on competence, quality, validity, etc…as well as the attention and guidance they extend to their students. I have always thought that every school should place academic values above revenue, and I am deeply interested in the possibility of WGU or another school one day offering a competency-based doctoral program for that very reason.

 

perhaps with the example from British/SA Unis?

Hi Intro2life,

Perhaps the kind of thing you're thinking about is that which is already available through a number of British and South African Universities: A research-only doctorate which can be completed entirely or mostly at a distance (communicating with dissertation supervisors via email and/or phone). I know that some of those on this board have done these (Bill Grover and his recently completed Th.D from UniZul comes to mind first). Have you looked at these?

Matt

 

Not being involved in a PhD program I can not say that I have intimate knowledge of the process. I am familiar with process as it relates to the dissertation-only research doctorates described by Matt in his post (above). In these programs people demonstrate their competency by performing a thesis (ZA terminology) in a specific area. My experience indicates that the standards applied by supervisors are rather high. Such a research component (some may call it a "project," some a "dissertatrion") is already a part of all doctoral programs. With that as a given, it's not clear what you're proposing. What other components would you add or modify in order to create a "competency-based" doctoral program?

As for the time element, most people require 4-6 years of part-time work to complete such programs. There certainly are people who can and have completed such programs in substantially less time. My take on this is essentially the same as when I learn that someone rad a book in one night while it took me a week. Some people, perhaps many people, are just faster, smarter, more driven than me. If they can finish a PhD program in two or three years, it doesn't necessarily mean the program is substandard or their research project was substandard.
Jack

 

I did my Ph.D. while working full-time and supporting my family. I suspect most of us here did--one way or another.

As for competency-based doctoral programs, three come to mind immediately: Fielding Graduate Institute, Union Institute and University, and Walden University.

Fielding (Competency Areas) and Walden (with KAMs) have very structured programs, but both allow flexibility in how the course components are satisified (demonstrating competency). Union goes one step further, allowing students to define both the degree components and the methods for demonstrating competency.

These kinds of programs are very close to the spirit of "Person-Centered Graduate Education" espoused by Roy Fairfield in a book by the same name.

 

Distance learning is a very normal, excellent and legitimate way of education

No doubt, Union is a great institution of higher education. They are one of the first in distance learning; that is a respectable item. Union and the others, like UoP, open the doors to the others distance learning universities.

I consider that Union should be the first option (distance learning PhD) to the normal working natural person. Subsequently, Northcentral University (First-rate price PhD for the working natural person).

These days, but in a gigantic way in the near future (15-20years), with the Net society growing up (Our Children’s) On-line or distance learning education would be the first option; and the most common.

For the dinosaur era (like me and some others), distance learning is not well accepted; the reason; only pure ignorance.

Our children’s would see distance learning and online education(BA-MA-PhD-JD) as a very normal, excellent and legitimate way of education.

 

DLJ, you make a couple of fairly reasonable points here, I must concede. As to your quote:

I beg to make one important correction/addition:

"Some/many/a good proportion of our children would see distance learning and high-quality, accredited online education(BA-MA-PhD-JD) as a very normal, excellent and legitimate way of education."

Thanks.

 

I did my Ed.D. working full time as well. I commuted two nights a week 90 miles (one way). The doc was essentially a second full time job. I did not have a distance option avaialble.

 

Re: Distance learning is a very normal, excellent and legitimate way of education

I do not. While I firmly believe in the value of the Union learning experience, as well as the value of the credential, we do not yet know the extent of the programmatic changes the doctoral program will experience later this year. They could very well change dramatically the unique nature of the degree program. These changes--whatever they will be--will be applied to all learners currently enrolled, not just new learners. This is the academic equivalent to buying a pig in a poke. I'd wait.

I used to wonder about the viability of the doctoral programs overall; I don't anymore. I'm convinced they'll continue. But in what form?

 

In my view, a competency-based doctoral program would assess only research ability -- not courses completed, time spent in classrooms, etc.

Ideally, it would also require a more rigorous evaluative process than most universities currently use.

In practice, that means (a) evaluation by experts who had no role in the instructional process, and (b) the application of educational standards consistent with those of the discipline itself.

One way of meeting these standards (though not the only way) is to require publication of the dissertation in good peer-reviewed journals before the degree is awarded. That way, each student's academic research will have met the same standards expected of his or her subsequent work.

For competencies that cannot be assessed through research products (publications, etc.), I might require exams similar to those used in Herriot-Watt's MBA program.

I doubt that anyone would be able to meet these standards without several (many?) years of work. On the other hand, I wouldn't set a minimum time requirement because that would introduce a standard other than research competence.

The degree should be awarded to all who meet the standards, regardless of how, why, or when they acquired the necessary abilities.

 

Re: Distance learning is a very normal, excellent and legitimate way of education

I suspect Dr. Juris that you may be overstating the case a bit. For undergraduates in the 18-22 year old range and for people in certain fields (such as engineering, sciences, law, medicine and architecture), traditional residential education offer a lot. I don't think that college campuses will be going away anytime soon.

DL has a place in this world - but I suspect it isn't perfect for all students in all cases.

Regards - Andy

 

You seem to be describing the UK/Australian PhD model.

External examiners (as in from outside the university and with no connection to the student) are common in Australia and the UK (it might be close to universal but I do not know enough to be certain).

Perhaps Prof. Kennedy would be able to provide you with more information.

 

reply 1st half

I seem to have offended other members of the forum which was not my intent. I was aware that my views regarding some of the shorter DL doctoral programs might garner strong disagreement and that perhaps my post as a whole could have been worded more clearly. Let me try to correct my lack of clarity and then address each poster in turn.

When I posted regarding a possible “competency-based” doctoral program, I was asking about how, using something like the WGU competency assessment system or a similar system as a model, such might be adapted to a doctoral program. While this presupposes (perhaps incorrectly) that the reader is familiar with the system, there are many on this forum that are extremely knowledgeable about various DL programs. I was asking for their input as well as the input of others regarding ideas. It appears that many misunderstood the way I worded my post to imply that I meant many of the current doctoral programs are not an adequate measure of one’s competency sufficient to justify that awarding of a doctorate; this was NOT what I was trying to express. More consideration should have been given to the way I worded my post beforehand. The misunderstanding or confusion that others may have was likely my own fault. I am aware of the process undertaken in doctoral programs via distance education through many institutions in both the US, and abroad. However, I am not by any means knowledgeable about any particular program or process because I haven’t been in any such program myself. Hence, I felt the feedback from other more experienced forum members who have first-hand knowledge would answer my own questions far better than I’d be able to answer them myself.

In regard to my comments about what I consider “fast track” doctoral programs. Often things become, for various reasons, something entirely different than they were intended to be. I don’t think a doctorate should be awarded to everyone, or possibly even most people who want to earn one and are able to gain admittance into post graduate study. It is the highest degree-awarded for scholarly achievement, and I believe from inception it was meant to only be awarded to those who make part of their life about making a contribution (to the world) in the form of valuable scholarly work. I did NOT say that graduates of such programs have not contributed to the greater body of knowledge, nor do I feel that is true in many cases. What I do believe; is that such programs appear outwardly (in my eyes at least) to allow students to attempt to meet such a goal in less time, thus likely placing more focus on the goal of earning their degree rather than in producing valuable research in their field. While this may not be the case with all or even most students, it certainly is more likely to be more often the case than it would in a more time consuming, more directly overseen research project or group in many B&M settings. Even if I am wholly and entirely wrong, it is certainly the perception of many. In order for this perception to be rectified, and DL doctoral study programs to be given the equal footing and respect, this perception must be altered.

There have been many posting here about how various people would like to earn a doctorate in the fastest (and likely easiest) manner possible, in order to pursue jobs in academia. Surely such motivation and the belief that DL will somehow be a fast-track to a doctorate, does a disservice to the credibility of DL in the larger academic community. What ever happened to the concept of research in an area for the benefit of the greater good, or to find new answers, solutions and knowledge? I doubt many of the great minds in history pursued their studies because they simply wanted a higher income, job promotion, prestige from a title or to teach part-time in higher academia when they retire. While this may be a valid motivation for pursuing a doctorate, I tend to be a bit of an idealist regarding education and hope there are DL alternative for those who want to make such pursuits a major component of their life. I certainly don’t think the rest of those pursuing DL study in a sincere effort to improve themselves in their chosen professions want their labors associated with mediocrity, short-cuts or the like.

To clarify my question about a competency based doctoral program; I was looking for ideals on ways to solve the perception issues by establishing a structure of program that would be more in-tune with rectifying the current and possibly erroneous perception held by some. Like many, when I embark on doctoral study and commence work on a dissertation, I intend to be quite serious about my work and study. I will want the letters after my name to mean something both to myself and others. To do any less would be short changing myself, devaluing the limited time I have on this earth, and wasting many years in a half-hearted pursuit rather than striving for excellence. Time may even prove that I am not equal to the challenge, but I want it to be a challenge. I guess I’m asking is for thoughts on ways to integrate more measures both inwardly and outwardly into a DL doctoral programs (either UK or US system) to combat any perceptual short comings, and equalize both practice and perception to an equal standard and standing as B&M.

It is quite possible that more than a few people who have completed programs that I would consider fast-track have done relevant, useful, rigorous work, easily equal to their B&M counterparts. Shouldn’t there be systems implemented to assure (what has been called) those “in the ivory towers” that such degrees and research are every bit as credible and valid as many, if not most, recognized institutions require? It is constantly regurgitated here that the “Gold Standard” of accreditation is RA, and that such accreditation is what ensures to others that a student has met a minimum high-standard. This may indeed be very true, but obviously proving the minimum high-standard, even if equal to that of counterpart B&M institutions, is not enough to break through the common perception that many DL programs are somehow lesser. Many posters choose B&M institutions with DL programs for this very reason. Should it not then follow that those involved in DL must set the bar even higher than necessary AND demonstrate so in the public eye in order to rectify this perceptual difference.

I remember reading somewhere (I wish I had the link) that someone involved in the DL ventures of a B&M institution said that the programs off-campus were made more rigorous with higher requirement than the very same institution’s on-campus program, and I believe it was stated that this was implemented to counteract perceptual discrepancies. In another example: At least one member of this very forum has been plagued by personal attacks and criticism of his work by others, who in all likelihood have never seen his work, nor might they have any first-hand inkling of the process he went through. This very person I speak of (Dr. Richard Douglas) earned his doctorate from a recognized and established RA institution that has been heralded as an innovator in quality DL education. Even people who are considered by many to be shills have brought into question his work which even the esteemed DL expert Dr. Bear has attested in this forum as being good (Again, I don’t have a link to the thread). Should he or any person who has obtained an accredited (or GAAP) terminal degree via DL, have to be subjected to continually defending their institution, validation and oversight process and credential? I doubt most of those who’ve earned their terminal degrees from fully B&M programs 1st, 2nd, 3rd or even 4th tier have?

There is no real specific proposal in my post. More to the point, if there is a proposal, it is to suggest extra measures to establish DL programs, or at least a particular (if at this point only conceptual) program. I was thinking longer minimum full-time (3-5yrs) & part-time (4-7yrs) lengths might be helpful. Partnership, or joint programs with a residency, research or lab component in conjunction with local (to the student) recognized schools and institutions might be good. As many have suggested, publication through field specific recognized channels might be excellent and could (possibly) be an integral part of such a program. Maybe this already exists and I’m just not aware of it and have wasted a perfectly good thread with an already existent idea, questions I could answer myself, and a rant based on false beliefs about certain programs. If so then forgive my ignorance. I thought I had happened upon an idea that has potential as a valuable alternative. Maybe I haven’t.

 

reply 2nd half

post continued...


To mattchand:

I have looked into the dissertation (thesis) only off-shore schools. Many of the programs seem interesting, but I was hoping to find a program here in the US. I doubt financial aid would extend to off-shore programs and I am not the wealthiest person, and have many obligations of my own that would make full-time B&M unfeasible. I have thought about the UNISA programs at a later date due to their low cost, but have read that some have experienced communication being slow if not difficult for many in the US. I think good communication would be beneficial if not crucial at the doctoral level. Also, I feel that a US program might have benefits; such as not having to explain how I earned a degree from a country I having never visited. Perhaps this will prove to be a non-issue.

Thank you for such a polite and friendly post.



To Jack Tracy:

Your view-point on part-time, shorter than average doctoral programs might be right-on-the-money. I have considered this myself. But it still does not address the issue about perception. I like your “read a book in one night…” analogy. I did say (in other words) in my original post that I suspected that a percentage of people who complete such programs are likely “well above average” or “obsessively driven” to succeed. Even as many of you have experienced, I too have discovered that DL requires a strong amount of dedication and self motivation. This alone is a factor that should distinguish favorably DL students from their B&M counterparts.

Your thoughts are being considered.


To Dr. Latin Juris:

Your beliefs about the near future of education might prove very insightful. I think part of gaining that “distance education has finally arrived” form of acceptance, respect and credibility is to continually adapt, reassess, redesign and re-structure DL programs, till it is unquestionably verified, concluded and publicly evident that there is not only “no significant difference” in outcomes, but that there is “no significant bias”. I foresee a possible future where there are not only elite, and top-tier schools, but that there will be elite and top-tier DL schools and more value will be placed on industry and academic achievement of such graduates as well as learning outcomes.

Your insight is both agreed-with and appreciated.


To Jake_A:

I think most of us probably agree with Dr. Latin Juris’s insight. Since you seem to be a graduate of some B&M institutions well-recognized for academic excellence, I find it admirable that you are a proponent of DL who sees that quality education can be obtained, demonstrated and verified outside a traditional setting. DL is indeed becoming the norm in many respects, especially to those who are already in the workforce and bring the additional element of experience with them to the classroom.



Obecve:

I have not been in your shoes, but I can certainly empathize with the feeling of a degree program being a “second full time job”. People with such dedication as yourself are my role-model, and I only hope I can maintain the same level of dedication when the time comes.



Rich Douglas:

I apologize for improperly citing you and others in this thread. Although this is a public forum (and maybe I should be more cautious) I find it welcoming virtual-setting much like a personal conversation, and was trying to share my ideas, thoughts and opinions much as others do. It was also very important to me that I respond to each and everyone’s post rather than allow my thoughts to be misunderstood and unintentionally give someone the impression that I am belittling their achievement. From reading your posts, it appears evident that you are an intelligent and well educated person. I don’t always agree with every statement of your’s that I’ve read, but I can plainly see that you (and many here) spend a considerable amount of time and effort in order help others and guide them in their educational pursuits. This was not meant as a personal attack, or an attack on Union (or any other DL institution or program). I have always enjoyed this forum and find its members a valuable resource. There is so much misinformation and agenda motivated information out there that it is nice to find a forum where things related to DL can be openly discussed by informed participants.

I thank you Dr. Douglas and others for your feedback. I will continue to follow this thread because I still, and always will, have much to learn.

Intro-

 

Dr. Walters,

I supect that we are thinking along the same lines in this issue. The only reason I keep pressing the time element, is because I think much of the perception might be centered around the misconception that rigor, validity and the like are a direct result of the amount of time spent in research, study, analysis and work. I agree that the minimum time requirement has very little to do with the actual validity and value of work, or competency, but think that such higher requirements might do a great deal to change public perception. Whether we like it or not, how others view our achievements and labors does have a direct effect on our lives as well as how our labors are recieved.

Thank you for your reply.

 

Re: reply 2nd half

Disagreeing with me is so common it is not noticed. I'm wrong a lot.

 

I thought that the "competency based doctorate" was the sort of degree offered in Australia and the U.K.; they award the LL.D. or D. Litt. based upon the applicant's history of academic achievement?

Not an honorary degree; it's earned by doing and publishing academic research. It's higher than the Ph.D. and has no equivalent in U.S. education, IIUC.