Columbia Pacific reports they are now accredited by Malawi

Here is a message just received from Les Carr, head of Columbia Pacific University. I pass it along without comment, while I try to learn more about the process involved.

John Bear
[email protected]
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"Columbia Pacific University has just received legitimate foreign accreditation... If you wish I will send you a copy of the official letter of accreditation-from the democratic Republic of Malawi. There is a definite reason for CPU seeking accreditation from a stable democratic country in Africa. The distinctiveness of a university rests, in part, in the distinctiveness of its mission. As you are aware, CPU in 1978 was a pioneer in distance education in the U.S. (non-residential, wholistic oriented, independent study). It is my conviction that CPU can once again attain that status, in reality, by being a pioneer in distance education on the continent of Africa. CPU will be developing an academic center in Malawi in relationship to an educational institution in that country."

 

If they start offering courses on Malawi lake cichlids, I'm gonna enroll!

 

Interesting, is this accreditation being referred to similar to the way that MIGS claims accreditation? They get an agreement from a foreign school to use their degree granting authority.

If this is an arrangement sililar to MIGS then I think it makes Bill Dayson's point even more important. That is institutions in one country claiming degree granting authority from a GAAP source in another country. The problem is that the quality assurance (QA) responsibility becomes poorly defined. I know that in the software industry it's a well known fact that it's dangerous to try and put responsibility for quality assurance in the same organization reponsible for producing the product. It seems to me that this would apply even more so within education.

So how will QA be done for CPU?

 

Seems a whole new trend is well underway. It will be intersting to see how this develops. Greenwich apparently has not worked out and Berne apparently has the lack of recognition by the University of the West Indies issue. If Malawi has it's own public University system, and Malawi accredited CPU, it may be able to clear the hurdle among some Foreign Credential Evaluators that Berne did not. That is not to say that CPU may not have issues in terms of people remembering the Native American accreditation, etc.

North

 

When all is said and done, wouldn't it have been easier for CPU to just bite the bullet and go for recognized US accreditation? All this tap-dancing with Indian tribe accreditation, and now some obscure country in Africa that probably 95% of people have never heard of.....it just makes them appear amateurish and desperate.

Bruce

 

I suppose part of the problem would be the same one plaguing La Salle (the infamous one not the famous one). DETC, which may be perceived by some as less prestigious than RA accreditation (hey, I'm being diplomatic), apparently had some issues with La Salle because of its past. I would imagine that RA accreditors would have similar issues based on the loss of California State approval and issues that allegedly came out surrounding the reasons for the loss of approval, and then the subsequent Tribal accreditation. That does not mean that they could not overcome them.

It sounds from what John posted as if they are trying to do a SATS/Zululand arrangement. Who knows it may work and an individual studying through the arrangement may end up with a GAAP degree. As I said earlier, if Malawi has it's own public university system they may even be able to get foreign credential evaluators to give it the nod (especially if tied to another GAAP school). That does not mean that no one will raise their eyebrows when you say you graduated from a Malawian University or CPU. I wonder if it would not be a bad idea for CPU to change it's name??? On the other hand some RA schools have had issues early on in their past which gave them bad press(Sarasota & Union come to mind). They are now well respected alternative RA schools.

Oh well! What interesting times we live in.

North

 

MIGS doesn't award degrees. The CEU does, and is already approved to do so. MIGS is specifically included in the CEU's approval, but again, CEU awards the degrees.

Rich Douglas

 

Originally posted by Rich Douglas:
MIGS doesn't award degrees. The CEU does, and is already approved to do so. MIGS is specifically included in the CEU's approval, but again, CEU awards the degrees.

This is one of those statements that raises more questions than it answers.

1) You have stated multitudes of times in multiple fora that you were pursuing a degree through MIGS, Rich. (I apologize if I missed your explanation, but) why have you changed your mind about which school is granting your degree? Do you think you'll ever go back to saying that you are getting a degree from MIGS?

2) You speak with authority on this particular issue. Why do you dodge BillDayson's and Gus's other questions about MIGS but respond so quickly and authoritatively to this?

 

The professors work for CEU? Student checks are made out to whom? Perhaps MIGS is owned by CEU? What kind of QA has been performed that assures the student body and the rest of the world that any degrees are up to CEU standards? Is CEU even concerned about quality at MIGS or are they only concerned about the revenue stream? How concerned would the Mexican administration even be about Americans getting ripped off by other Americans? MIGS claims to be accredited. When and what kind of quality assurance has ever been done at MIGS? (Besides Steve Levicoff's investigation, of course.)

 

I think that a pattern is developing with these foreign "accreditations".

On one hand, 'accreditation' means external quality assurance. That's how the word is used here in the United States.

But on the other hand, in some nations 'accreditation' (or whatever the local equivalent that is recognized by GAAP) more closely resembles American state approval. It is legal permission to operate with little in the way of quality oversight.

I'm willing to bet that nobody flew out from Africa to examine Mr. Carr's operation in wherever-it-is-now. If the Malawians examined Columbia Pacific at all, they just looked at a description on paper.

Now I guess the question is, have the Malawians approved CPU to grant Malawian 'accredited' degrees from here in the United States? That might be awfully hard to sell. But if the Malawi ministry of education vouches for CPU, perhaps the Internatinal Handbook of Universities will list them. Who knows?

Or has Malawi approved Columbia Pacific to teach courses leading to the award of University of Malawi degrees? That would almost certainly give CPU GAAP status, but somehow I don't see the University of Malawi rolling over that easily. (But then again, if Liverpool can 'accredit' Trinity...)

But the bottom line is that questionable schools are going to be looking for foreign jurisdictions where government approvals are relatively easy to get and where little academic oversight is implied. Then they are going to parade those approvals in front of the world as bestowing GAAP status and therefore proving their school the academic equal of any university anywhere. It's the wave of the future.

 

Last week I had breakfast with Dr. Les Carr (Vanderbilt U.), president of CPU. He was in Vancouver on business. Les explained the foreign accreditation attempt (which hadn't come thru yet at the time). I was somewhat verbally skeptical - (who isn't after the buzz surrounding the 1998 Indian accreditation)?

I told Les what folks most on this website would probably say (I'm batting almost 1000 so far), but I'm really not sure to what degree such views would matter. I then told him that foreign accreditation could be perceived as another end run, such as with Greenwich, and that most associated with this venue remember the Indian accreditation thing of 1998 in the same vein.

Les then told me that the African country has 10 million residents (Norfolk Island has 1500); and in addition to expanding internationally to opening a mission in that African country (CPU had two highly educated African deans - and still has one), this was a step toward stabilizing CPU so that it could be in a better foundational position to start a formal relationship with the regional accreditor NWASC.

Les then told me that if CPU achieved the foreign accreditation it would start a mission in the African country and start a formal process with NWASC within a month (a month is what he said).

Les also stated that there was no attempt at an end run with the Indian accreditation thing of 1998. To give him the benefit of the doubt I went to the CPU site and read the document announcing the Indian accreditation. It was contained in a small paragraph which also announced some new programs dealing with Native American Traditions. Les said he needed the approval of the Indians to give some credibility to the program and this was also tied in to the 1996 Indian Education Act signed in by Clinton (I already knew about that Act from my own research). From what I read on the website (see CPU website/ alumni letter - 1998) this did not appear to be a big thing designed to take the place of either approval or accreditation. Although, I must admit, I was very skeptical for 3 years since I read the announcement.

Les also mentioned that after the CPU troubles got much worse, CPU's president, Dr. Richard Crews (magna cum laude Williams College - Liberal Arts, and Harvard M.D./psychiatry), became quite withdrawn, and got deeper into the quacky futuristic stuff. Les also stated that he personally has nothing to do with IUAS, and that it was Crews' concept. He said that Crews asked for the use of his name as a board member, etc., and that he loaned his support as a friend. Les stated that IUAS is inactive. I told him about the existing website, and he said he'd mention to Crews that it still exists and would suggest that Crews to take it down.

I asked Les how the hell he got such an idea as Indian Traditions for a program. Les stated that as a longtime endurance horserider (no, that's not some kind of kinky sex or industrial dance craze) he rode with many native americans on the trails across the USA and had had many conversations on such matters with the Indian people he became acquainted with. Les also has a thing about the potential role of elders (of all races) as contributors to social stability and change and said he felt there was lots to learn from Native American Traditions (particularly on the topic of eldership).

Having said all of the above I found Les to be a charismatic character, but definitely a humorous eccentric. Les even told me that he started CPU in the 1970's as a school for eccentrics and other offbeat alternative folk (take a look on the web at some of the CPU grad websites and you'll see what I mean), and that the new CPU catalogue will reflect that using those same words. Just think, this is the same man that served as former president of three regionally accredited institutions. A paradoxical figure to say the least.

P.S. - If anyone is ever in Vancouver, contact me prior to getting here and we can do breakfast, lunch, whatever.

Earon Kavanagh (who's currently waiting for his entrance interview with Simon Fraser University faculty re MA Liberal Studies), completed an M.S. in Applied Behavioral Science with CPU over a six year period and wrote a thesis comprising 386 pages and 370 reference sources; has plans to do another M.S. at U of London, and a D.Ed. at UNISA focusing on the whole changing topic of nontraditonal ed (with a particular focus on the CPU/CPPVE story and collaterals). Some of you guys might even get an honorable mention.

 

Right. Through MIGS, from CEU.

I suggested BillD and Gus ask elsewhere because I don't know the answers to their questions. Unlike some lot of people, I've tried to stick to what I know about. And even then, I could be wrong. You never know.

Rich Douglas

 

I don't know the answers to those questions, but MIGS doesn't claim to be accredited. All over the website are references to the recognition and approval of the CEU, including MIGS. I don't find anything saying MIGS alone is accredited, just that it is included in the CEU's scope of operations. For example, the Vice Rector of the CEU says:

I have been asked to write this message to students and faculty to clearly explain our authority to grant degrees.

The Secretary of Education of the State of Nuevo Leon, the state of our incorporation and of our main campuses, has approved our entire educational curriculum through the doctorate level (traditional and virtual)
including our distance learning programs under MIGS. Further, the CEU enjoys an Autonomous Presidential Decree, obtained in
1970, that allows us to independently operate and add schools, divisions and degree programs within the University.

Our degrees are issued by the Secretary of Education of the State of Neuvo Leon and are corroborated by the Secretary of Public Education in Mexico.

After completion of a prospective students assessment package and learning contract we in turn submit the package to the Secretary of Education of the State of Nuevo Leon for individual approval for each student. Upon completion of the degree requirements within the time allocated by the Secretary of Eduation by way of approval of the time line
in the learning contract, the Secretary of Education of the State of Nuevo Leon will issue their approved degree.

Jose Cardenas Cavazos
Vice-Rector
Centro de Estudios Universitarios

(http://www.degree.com/vice_rector.htm)

 

Here's something that was posted on this forum on 2-12-01:

"I continue to think MIGS is (a) academically sound, (b) properly accredited, and (c) has the worst marketing and public presentation of any school I've seen in the last twenty years."

Hundreds of thousands of degree-seekers and people looking for information about distance education have taken this person's advice. I think John Bear nailed it on the head regarding MIGS. Personally, I've relied on (a) and (b), and have been disappointed in (c). (Not disappointed that he said it, but that it is true.) If (c) dissuades some people from otherwise enrolling, so be it. But it doesn't change (a) or (b).

Rich Douglas

 

Is it true MIGS/CEU has no enrolled students at this time? Many thanks.

Dave

 

Which neatly dodges the whole issue. Has anyone from outside CEU with expertise in higher education QA ever looked at MIGS and at how it actually delivers its doctoral programs? Or was the interest of Nuevo Leon's Secretary of Education in this thing confined to approving the CEU's proposed curricula on paper?

If MIGS and/or the CEU are operating without effective QA oversight in delivering these doctoral programs, then what you have resembles American state approval more than it does American accreditation. The fact that the approvals are from a foreign nation is just an added bit of mystification.

But as we see in this new CPU/Malawi case, it's a kind of mystification that is going to grow more common as distance education becomes more international and operators of questional schools seek less demanding offshore jurisdictions to give them the semblance of accreditation.

 

That's revisionist history, isn't it? Perhaps the tribe meant their accreditation to only be approval of a single degree program in Indian Traditions, but it seemed to be presented by CPU at the time as if it were an alternative to recognized institutional accreditation.

Could a similar thing be happening right now? Is this Malawi "accreditation" institutional approval of the entire university or only of one program within it, in African Traditions or something? I guess that's something to ask Carr next time you see him.

I sincerely hope that this is all just a misunderstanding, and that Dr. Carr isn't seeking an offshore accreditation haven in order to get GAAP legitimacy or trying to spin accreditation of a single specialized degree program as if it were institutional accreditation.

 

Dr. Bear has my greatest respect but, what does his really mean? It means as of 2-12-01 that was the case. A new institution is a very delicate entity. It can go down the tubes much more quickly than it can improve its reputation. It's a slippery slope. My concern is that the owners/administration that were responsible for c) appear to me to be slime bags. Based on a), it appears that they've put some people in charge of the academic execution that are doing a proper job.

Don't forget who is really in charge, the slim bags responsible for c) are the ones really in charge. Their slime trail is likely to cross the path of MIGS again and the slippery slope could easily claim MIGS as victim.

Case in point, look at their decision to try and scare Steve Levicoff into keeping his opinions to himself. In my opinion this has done great damage to the MIGS reputation. If Rich (or another MIGS student) started voicing their opinion about some MIGS policy saying it was unfair or unwise, what would happen to this person? Can we really respect a place of higher education that is so revengeful and reactive in silencing those that the administration might disagree with?

Here's what I believe are my reasonable opinions. The MIGS administration/ownership have shown themselves to be slime bags with a degree mill mentality. MIGS is a degree mill.

 

Originally posted by Rich Douglas:
I don't know the answers to those questions, but MIGS doesn't claim to be accredited.

I disagree: http://www.degree.com/migshome.htm

Who can read the words, "The Monterrey Institute for Graduate Studies - Earn An Accredited Graduate Degree From Your Home at Your Own Pace" and not think MIGS is claiming accreditation? Sure, CEU's name is there, too, but c'mon!

 

Originally posted by DaveHayden:
Is it true MIGS/CEU has no enrolled students at this time? Many thanks.

I believe the last count we got was around two dozen, but...?