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  1. #33
    Bill Huffman is offline Registered User
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    Originally posted by tcnixon:
    This one has come a *long* way from being a discussion of the relative merits of Kennedy-Western University.
    Actually we've only been discussing the lack of merits. Since I've given up hoping for a information on the KWU dissertation catalog, here's my thoughts on the merits of KWU. ... It is not the most expensive degree mill out there.

  2. #34
    Justin Wells is offline Registered User
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    A Bears' Guide reader shared with us her recent experience with Kennedy-Western University. I thought it would be interesting to contribute to this discussion:

    "My husband and I looked into Kennedy-Western University before we realized it was not accredited. The tuition was low, the computer science program seemed right and they had a decent journalism concentration for me. So we each sent in an application, together with our refundable $50 application fee.

    Yes, we had your book, but we got to their site via hypertext on another site and assumed the schools listed were all accredited. We were both disappointed when we knew we had to rule them out but we were curious about how they would judge our "life experience " credits and ancient credits from the schools of our youths. We waited 3 weeks to receive our evaluations from Ms. Sharon Palmer.

    First let me say that Ms. Palmer gently discouraged me once I told her that I might be more interested in teaching than in journalism . She felt I would have a problem getting into a graduate program with the KW degree. She spoke to my husband and told him that in the tech community, where many people have skills but no degrees, KW would be just fine for him. Since we already paid the fee and sent in our info, we decided to let it ride and see what they offered.

    My husband heard first. Sharon had good news. His 37 credits from Temple University and the 4 or 5 intensive IT programs his employer sent to put him at 45% completion toward a Bachelor's degree in computer science . In fact, he only needed to complete 7 more classes ("ANY 7 CLASSES," Sharon said) ($4,500 worth) and could be finished with the whole degree program in 5 months. It was tempting. We decided to wait to see what kind of offer they would make me.

    It took Sharon another 2 weeks to get back to me. Sharon had good news. My 13 credits from College of Staten Island and the writing workshops I had taken at various night programs put me at 45% completion toward a Bachelor's degree in journalism . In fact, I only needed to complete 7 more classes ("ANY 7 CLASSES," Sharon said) ($4,500 worth) and could be finished with the whole degree program in 5 months.

    I called her first to tell her that I was applying to accredited schools and she forwarded a form (by snail mail) to request the refund. It's been 3 weeks and I haven't received the check yet so I can't tell you how reliable their refund policy is. I plan to follow up in a few days.This has got to be a scam. The 7 classes make it less conspicuously a diploma mill, but it can't possibly be a real school either.

    Thought you'd like to know."

    (The reader gave me permission to post this, but asked that her name not be disclosed.)

    Justin Wells
    Bears' Guide editor

  3. #35
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    Originally posted by Justin Wells:
    My 13 credits from College of Staten Island and the writing workshops I had taken at various night programs put me at 45% completion toward a Bachelor's degree in journalism. In fact, I only needed to complete 7 more classes ("ANY 7 CLASSES," Sharon said) ($4,500 worth) and could be finished with the whole degree program in 5 months.
    WOW! Sounds like an incredible opportunity to obtain a beautifully framed diploma, and feel good about the time, energy and money invested!

    Russell

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  5. #36
    rnfjr6950 is offline Registered User
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    Wink

    Lets not forget that KW's permit to operate is up for renewal this June!

    I almost went the KW route. But as I investigated it, too many oddities started showing up. The cautious email reply from the Board of Education really sent up a red flag, then I came accross this forum and decided to attend TESC.

  6. #37
    BillDayson is offline Registered User
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    Originally posted by Russell A.
    Morris:
    WOW! Sounds like an incredible
    opportunity to obtain a beautifully
    framed diploma, and feel good about the
    time, energy and money invested!


    Russell
    Hey, Russell...

    If you want a beautiful diploma, wait till you check out these babies:
    http://www.ptshamrock.com/auto/degrees.html


  7. #38
    John Bear is offline Senior Member
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    mfjr wrote, Lets not forget that KW's permit to operate is up for renewal this June!

    I'd be most interested in knowing how you learned this. Did KWU say anything? Is it public information on some state website? Thanks.

    John Bear
    Author/co-author:15 editions of Bears Guide to Earning Degrees by Distance Learning,
    Degree Mills: the billion-dollar industry that has sold more than a million fake diplomas
    Not Your Mother's Cookbook: unusual recipes for adventurous books, 30+ more.
    www.johnbear.info

  8. #39
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    Originally posted by BillDayson:
    Hey, Russell...

    If you want a beautiful diploma, wait till you check out these babies:
    http://www.ptshamrock.com/auto/degrees.html
    Beautiful indeed, Bill! I especially like the one printed on parchment paper, as it would add to the decorum of most any office. Imagine having one's peers, clients, friends, etc., drop by the office and notice with awe the immaculately framed diploma. It would certainly boost one's self-esteem.

    I would like to have more than one signature on my diploma, however, as with most one-man-operations I guess one signature is all that is available.

    And the website states that "under current legislation" the degrees are legal . One could theoretically have a legal degree for one month, three months, or forever. It all depends on when the legislation changes.

    Russell

  9. #40
    Kristin Evenson Hirst is offline Registered User
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    If you click on the "recognition" link on the KW website, you get a picture of KW's Wyoming private school license:
    http://www.kw.edu/recognition.asp

    This shows an expiration date of June 30, 2001.

    I'd like to know whether the KW enrollment form complies with this section of the Wyoming private school licensing law:
    (v) A copy of the enrollment agreement, contract or other document which acknowledges the enrollment of each student which is executed by each student at the time of enrollment or paying tuition fees other than applications fees. The agreement, contract or other document shall be made available at the time of the on-site inspection required under W.S. 21-2-401(d) and shall contain the following statement:

    "I understand that (name of institution) is licensed by the Wyoming department of education in accordance with W.S. 21-2-401 through 21-2-407 and that neither the department of education nor the Wyoming state board of education has accredited or endorsed any course of study being offered by (name of institution)."
    from http://legisweb.state.wy.us/titles/2...tle21/c2a4.htm
    ------------------
    Kristin Evenson Hirst
    DistanceLearn.About.com
    Kristin Evenson Hirst

  10. #41
    Bill Huffman is offline Registered User
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    Cool

    Originally posted by BillDayson:
    If you want a beautiful diploma, wait till you check out these babies:
    http://www.ptshamrock.com/auto/degrees.html

    Those really are good looking diplomas. I didn't even pick up my diploma from UC Berkeley. But if they had looked as nice as those I might have coughed up the few bucks they wanted to send it me.

    The problem is that the more worthless the diploma the nicer they seem to make them look.

  11. #42
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    Originally posted by Bill Huffman:
    Those really are good looking diplomas...The problem is that the more worthless the diploma the nicer they seem to make them look.
    This does seem to be the case: my RA BA diploma looks decent; my RA master's diploma is white stock paper with flat black print, nothing fancy; my RA D.Min. diploma has some gold artwork in the border, but again, nothing elaborate.

    Could it be that the legitimate schools designate most of the tuition fees for substantive course work and a credible degree, and only a few pennies for the diploma? While the other schools designate most of the tuition fees for the administrator's wallet, $0 for a credible degree, and about $50 for the diploma? The diploma, then, becomes the objective, not a credible degree!

    Russell

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  13. #43
    Gerstl is offline Registered User
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    The problem is that the more worthless the diploma the nicer they seem to make them look.
    True for non-professional degrees. I am, to be honest, somewhat miffed that my PhD and my wife's PhD are 8X10s while her law degree diploma will be HUGE. Of course the huge diplomas are only awarded by the law school, med school and dental school.

    Glorified Bachelor's degrees
    Oh well.



  14. #44
    drwetsch is offline Registered User
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    Originally posted by BillDayson:
    Hey, Russell...

    If you want a beautiful diploma, wait till you check out these babies:
    http://www.ptshamrock.com/auto/degrees.html


    I actually liked their accreditation statement, "This particular university has an Accrediting Association of its own through which the awards are stimulated, strengthened and substantiated. This Accreditation Association will confirm your awards to any inquirer."

    I wonder if the stimulation of the award is the beautiful "stimulating" diploma. Later on the page they also state that they do not provide an accreditation address.


    John


    John R. Wetsch, Ph.D.

    B.S. '01 University of North Dakota
    B.S. '84 Excelsior College (USNY/Regents)
    M.A. '89 Antioch University, The McGregor School
    Master of Astronomy, '02, University of Western Sydney
    Ph.D. '94 Nova Southeastern University

  15. #45
    bing is offline Registered User
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    Originally posted by Gerstl:
    True for non-professional degrees. I am, to be honest, somewhat miffed that my PhD and my wife's PhD are 8X10s while her law degree diploma will be HUGE. Of course the huge diplomas are only awarded by the law school, med school and dental school.
    Yep. I guess patients/customers need to be able to see it when they go in for checkups and teeth cleanings.

    -Continual Learner-
    1 Jn 4:7

  16. #46
    Bill Huffman is offline Registered User
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    Originally posted by Gerstl:
    I am, to be honest, somewhat miffed that my PhD and my wife's PhD are 8X10s while her law degree diploma will be HUGE.
    The last few years around Christmas time, they've been selling these really nice diploma frames in the mall. The frame is a mirror with a scene from the appropriate university engraved in the mirror. They had pictures for hundreds of schools. It would make your plain 8X10 diploma look really nice hanging in your office.


  17. #47
    bgossett is offline Registered User
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    Originally posted by Bill Huffman:
    The last few years around Christmas time, they've been selling these really nice diploma frames in the mall. The frame is a mirror with a scene from the appropriate university engraved in the mirror. They had pictures for hundreds of schools. It would make your plain 8X10 diploma look really nice hanging in your office.
    This could be a real boon for those who "graduated" from schools with unusual campuses:

    For Earlscroft alumni, an etching of February Automation's facility on Turney Road in London.

    For Trinity C&U alumni, an etching of the Mailboxes, Etc. office in Sioux Falls.

    For Capitol U. alumni, an etching of Kristiaan's den in Antwerp.

    The happiest graduates, I would imagine, would be from RKU. The rented castle campus would make an impressive etching.



    ------------------
    Bill Gossett
    Bill Gossett

  18. #48
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    Originally posted by bgossett:
    This could be a real boon for those who "graduated" from schools with unusual campuses:
    Or Northwestern International University, Ltd., whose campus would be an etching of two telephones, one labeled Cyprus and the other Denmark.

    Russell

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