Union Institute, DETC accredited degrees on "Quackwatch" list

**laferney** · 02-16-2004 02:33 PM

Several accredited degree programs as well as many unaccredited ones are llisted the website Quackwatch -dedicated to exposing dubious health claims and practices
http://www.quackwatch.org/04Consumer...#nonaccredited
From their site: "I view the following with considerable distrust. If you would like to nominate others for this list, please contact us:
Schools, Accredited
American Academy of Nutrition
American Health Science University
Bastyr University
Life University
National Institute of Nutrition Education (NINE)
The Union Institute (updated 5/19/99)

Many unaccredited listed.

**nosborne48** · 02-16-2004 02:43 PM

Quackwatch has a profound distrust of homeopathy, accupuncture, and naturopathy. Quackwatch also distrusts chiropractic physicians when they venture beyond treating certain specific limited physical conditions.

I suspect that the warning has less to do with the legitimacy of the degree than with the perceived bogusness of the theraputic model.

**Rich Douglas** · 02-16-2004 04:30 PM

This is about quackery in the health fields, not about institutional quality.

Funny thing, though. Many of us from the old days of UIU used to decry "the fringe," learners who made studies of uh, er, "unusual" topics. Like the woman who did her dissertation on psychic surgeons....

**Steve Levicoff** · 02-16-2004 04:36 PM

Originally posted by laferney
Several accredited degree programs as well as many unaccredited ones are llisted the website Quackwatch -dedicated to exposing dubious health claims and practices
http://www.quackwatch.org/04Consumer...#nonaccredited
From their site: "I view the following with considerable distrust. If you would like to nominate others for this list, please contact us:
Schools, Accredited
American Academy of Nutrition
American Health Science University
Bastyr University
Life University
National Institute of Nutrition Education (NINE)
The Union Institute (updated 5/19/99)

Many unaccredited listed.

laferny has provided us with one of the sleaziest examples of citation I have ever seen on degreeinfo. To wit:

The quote about "considerable distrust" falls at the beginning of an extensive list of organizations, certifying organizations, and even government agencies. It should have been followed above with elipsis dots, since much is listed between the quote and the institutions laferny cited.

laferny references the list of unaccredited schools in the URL he or she provides. However, Union clearly appears in Quackwatch's list of accredited schools.

The Quackwatch report is old news and has been cited here many times. nosborne is quite correct in noting that Quackwatch's concerns are not about the schools themselves as much as the topics covered on the site. (When I was in Vermont College, then art of the venerable Norwich University , I met a V.C. graduate who had done her master's degree in "depth psychology ." In other words, she majored in astrology. Perhaps Quackwatch would have added Norwich to the list had they known that. I wouldn't - there are space cadets in every school.)

Finally, the text cited by laferny includes a link to specific text about Union (discussing an author who also graduated from TESC). I read that text, and find that the authors at Quackwatch did very sloppy research in their evaluation.

Rich Douglas and I, both of whom graduated from Union, are among Union's strongest critics these days. But we base our opinions on the current picture at Union, not on presuppositions about one graduate from many years ago.

laferny gets an "F" in research and writing skills.

**laferney** · 02-17-2004 02:41 PM

I forgive you for your somewhat irrational response to my posting. It was surprising to see such a meanspirited posting from a degreeinfo.net member. For the record I posted this as I felt it would be of interest to degreeinfo.net members. As for your statement of "the sleaziest example of citation":
The quote about "considerable distrust" falls at the beginning of an extensive list of organizations, certifying organizations, and even government agencies. It should have been followed above with elipsis dots, since much is listed between the quote and the institutions laferny cited.
My reply: The quote applies to the listing of accredited schools too.I didn't list every organization between the quote and the lsiting of accredited school because of the length and this is a site about degrees. Anyone can go to the site and see that Dr. Barrett intends it for these degrees also.
Secondly, you say:
"laferny references the list of unaccredited schools in the URL he or she provides. However, Union clearly appears in Quackwatch's list of accredited schools."My response:I clearly listed the accredited schools so what is your point? The URL had the word unaccredited in it-I didn't put it there.
The Quackwatch report is old news and has been cited here many times. nosborne is quite correct in noting that Quackwatch's concerns are not about the schools themselves as much as the topics covered on the site.
My reply: it may be old news for some but for many degreeinfo.net readers it is new. the Quackwatch site is current and I think readers of this site should have the right to review these stories. I disagree with your assessment that the concerns were not about the school itself. The author states:
The Union Institute is also accredited, but its degree requirements and standards for health-related doctoral degrees differ greatly from those of traditional universities. Students design their own program, form and chair their own doctoral committee, and are required to attend only an introductory colloquium and a few interdisciplinary seminars. He doesn't say this in a complementary way. He then points out concerns about his doctoral commitee and states that his doctoral thesis" 'contributes nothing" This is not positive for the school.
This all being said I will now say that I feel Union is a leader in Distance Education , has been around a long time and has an excellent reputation with those I have come in contact with (mainly Psychologists } I disagree with it being posted on his site.I would suggest Union Graduates contact Dr. Barrett. This was my point in posting. The other Accredited schools have been criticized for teaching nutritional advice that goes against mainstream teaching and associations with questionable organizations. One man's trash is another man's poison.
Yes there are space cadets in every school -that doesn't mean we can't question it. We criticize Westbrook, Clayton and unaccredited schools for teaching unorthodox practices -Union is not exempt. For example Union has a Ph.D in Lactation Studies . Many nurses might see that as a somewhat questionable"doctoral " major. But for those pursuing it I"m sure they are sincere. I disgree that the Quackwatch people did sloppy research-I'll let the readers of this site decide.
I do appreciate your zeal in defending your school and again I feel Union is an excellent program-a leader in Distance Education . I also feel it is not correct for it to be listed with"considerable distrust" But DR. Barrett is entitled to his opinion.
Finally I apologize for any Typos or poorly written parts of this PAPER. I HOPE YOU CAN NOW AT LEAST BRING MY GRADE UP TO A C!
Sincerly. LaFern-e-y

**Kirkland** · 02-17-2004 03:02 PM

I see Temple and Columbia got trashed too... for maintaining centers that teach health nonsense (alternative medicine)... guess he's a mainstream kinda guy...

**Rich Douglas** · 02-18-2004 04:16 AM

Originally posted by laferney
For example Union has a Ph.D in Lactation Studies . Many nurses might see that as a somewhat questionable"doctoral " major.

No, it does not. Union offers two Ph.D. programs: one in Psychology and one in Interdisciplinary Studies. The second one can have a concentration and and emphasis. Mine is listed below. But the degree offers no "majors," not even in Lactation Studies.

Please get this right.

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**Steve Levicoff** · 02-18-2004 08:55 AM

Originally posted by laferney
I forgive you for your somewhat irrational response to my posting. It was surprising to see such a meanspirited posting from a degreeinfo.net member. For the record I posted this as I felt it would be of interest to degreeinfo.net members. As for your statement of "the sleaziest example of citation". . .

Well, I see we want to get into a cocksmanship contest. I wouldn't recommend that unless you have a strong researcvh background.

Lafer-e-ney, don't try to play like a pro when you're only an amateur. Dr. Douglas and I have been at this game far longer than you, and we have doctorates (let alone Union doctorates) on which to build our opinions. And while you may patronizingly recommend Union, we are currently not recommending Union because of reasons that have been discussed here extensively.

I'm not concerned about a typo or two - hell, I make them myself. But your research skills do suck. Of course, if you never studied research skills and citation rules, you wouldn't know that. Especially since you obviously haven't read the previous - and quite recent - posts about Union.

And by the way, this is degreeinfo.com, not degreeinfo.net. :D

**Rich Douglas** · 02-18-2004 10:32 AM

Originally posted by Steve Levicoff
Dr. Douglas and I have been at this game far longer than you, and we have doctorates (let alone Union doctorates) on which to build our opinions. And while you may patronizingly recommend Union, we are currently not recommending Union because of reasons that have been discussed here extensively.

No, we certainly are not recommending enrollment at this time. From what I've heard, Union itself is dissuading people from enrolling right now, even though declining enrollments is one reason for the cuts.

**laferney** · 02-18-2004 02:26 PM

They did in 2000 See Below go
www.healthychildren.cc/phd02.pdf
Entire text Not edited!!
The Center for Breastfeeding
a major focus of
the HEALTHY CHILDREN 2000 PROJECT INC
a non-profit research and educational institution
pioneering the field of research based breastfeeding education
and evidence based breastfeeding practice
and
Union Institute & University
presents a
Ph.D.
with a focus in
Breastfeeding and Human Lactation
A cooperative partnership
between
The Healthy Children 2000 Project
and
Union Institute & University
Support for development of this program came,
in part, from
Page 2
About The Healthy Children 2000 Project
The Healthy Children 2000 Project as a non-profit
research and educational institution dedicated to
improving child health outcomes in partnership with
public, private and non-profit agencies. Through its
Center for Breastfeeding, Healthy Children is the largest
national provider of lactation management education for
health care providers. More than 1,500 health care
providers, advocates and facilitators are educated
annually through more than 50 offerings across the
United States. These include five-day courses, certificate
courses, workshops, seminars, self-study modules,
national and international conferences. Educational
offerings are held at hospitals, Women, Infant and
Children (WIC) Programs, health department training
facilities, colleges, and other locations suitable for adult
education . Continuing education units are available to
registered dietitians, registered nurses, and
internationally board certified lactation consultants
through long-term provider agreements.
Healthy Children faculty are leaders in the field who are
recognized for their evidence-based scholarship as well
as their clinical experience. Faculty serve in leadership
positions in maternal and child health coalitions on the
regional and national level. Healthy Children is a member
of the National Healthy Mothers/ Healthy Babies
Coalition (HMHB).
In May, 2000, The Healthy Children Project completed
a project funded by the United States Department of
Health & Human Services, Public Health Service, Health
Resources & Services Administration and Maternal &
Child Health Bureau called Developing and Implementing
a Training Strategy for Increasing Interdisciplinary
Breastfeeding and Human Lactation Knowledge and Skills in
the United States. Part of this project involved surveying
workers in breastfeeding and human lactation
management about their education needs. Another part
involved seeking the ideal institutions to work with the
Healthy Children Project about meeting these needs. This
involved finding a university home for interdisciplinary
Bachelor?s, Master?s, and PhD programs. We matched
the needs and the degree programs and found that Union
Institute & University was a wonderful fit for the
Doctoral Degree.
We at Healthy Children are very excited about your
interest in this doctoral program and want to support
you in the admissions? process as well as during your
degree program. Healthy Children Faculty can serve as
adjunct faculty advisors for you as you work toward
your Doctoral Degree with a focus in Breastfeeding and
Human Lactation.
Page 3
Union Institute & University
Personal... Progressive... Powerful
Union Institute & University is a unique University
within American higher education . Union students are
highly motivated, mid-career adults whose needs and
interests determine the pace and breadth of their
learning experience. The University?s Graduate School
has experienced significant growth in enrollment
numbers. Union Institute & University?s tutorial-based
studies lead to the baccalaureate B.A. or B.S. degree, a
masters or the doctoral Ph.D. degree.
Current enrollment is approximately 2,200. Union
Institute & University has nearly 6,000 alumni.
Union Institute & University?s Graduate College,
College of Undergraduate Studies and Center for
Distance Learning have their headquarters in
Cincinnati, with undergraduate offices also located
in Los Angeles, Sacramento, and Miami, FL.
The Graduate School of The Union Institute has been
called the University for people whose life experience
has educated them beyond the limits of traditional
doctoral programs. Its philosophical and pedagogical
roots are found in:
?
The nineteenth century German universities,
with their strong emphasis on individual
research;
?
The English universities of Oxford and
Cambridge, with their tutorial rather than
course-based format;
?

**laferney** · 02-18-2004 02:27 PM

They did in 2000 See Below go
www.healthychildren.cc/phd02.pdf
Entire text Not edited!!
The Center for Breastfeeding
a major focus of
the HEALTHY CHILDREN 2000 PROJECT INC
a non-profit research and educational institution
pioneering the field of research based breastfeeding education
and evidence based breastfeeding practice
and
Union Institute & University
presents a
Ph.D.
with a focus in
Breastfeeding and Human Lactation
A cooperative partnership
between
The Healthy Children 2000 Project
and
Union Institute & University
Support for development of this program came,
in part, from
Page 2
About The Healthy Children 2000 Project
The Healthy Children 2000 Project as a non-profit
research and educational institution dedicated to
improving child health outcomes in partnership with
public, private and non-profit agencies. Through its
Center for Breastfeeding, Healthy Children is the largest
national provider of lactation management education for
health care providers. More than 1,500 health care
providers, advocates and facilitators are educated
annually through more than 50 offerings across the
United States. These include five-day courses, certificate
courses, workshops, seminars, self-study modules,
national and international conferences. Educational
offerings are held at hospitals, Women, Infant and
Children (WIC) Programs, health department training
facilities, colleges, and other locations suitable for adult
education . Continuing education units are available to
registered dietitians, registered nurses, and
internationally board certified lactation consultants
through long-term provider agreements.
Healthy Children faculty are leaders in the field who are
recognized for their evidence-based scholarship as well
as their clinical experience. Faculty serve in leadership
positions in maternal and child health coalitions on the
regional and national level. Healthy Children is a member
of the National Healthy Mothers/ Healthy Babies
Coalition (HMHB).
In May, 2000, The Healthy Children Project completed
a project funded by the United States Department of
Health & Human Services, Public Health Service, Health
Resources & Services Administration and Maternal &
Child Health Bureau called Developing and Implementing
a Training Strategy for Increasing Interdisciplinary
Breastfeeding and Human Lactation Knowledge and Skills in
the United States. Part of this project involved surveying
workers in breastfeeding and human lactation
management about their education needs. Another part
involved seeking the ideal institutions to work with the
Healthy Children Project about meeting these needs. This
involved finding a university home for interdisciplinary
Bachelor?s, Master?s, and PhD programs. We matched
the needs and the degree programs and found that Union
Institute & University was a wonderful fit for the
Doctoral Degree.
We at Healthy Children are very excited about your
interest in this doctoral program and want to support
you in the admissions? process as well as during your
degree program. Healthy Children Faculty can serve as
adjunct faculty advisors for you as you work toward
your Doctoral Degree with a focus in Breastfeeding and
Human Lactation.
Page 3
Union Institute & University
Personal... Progressive... Powerful
Union Institute & University is a unique University
within American higher education . Union students are
highly motivated, mid-career adults whose needs and
interests determine the pace and breadth of their
learning experience. The University?s Graduate School
has experienced significant growth in enrollment
numbers. Union Institute & University?s tutorial-based
studies lead to the baccalaureate B.A. or B.S. degree, a
masters or the doctoral Ph.D. degree.
Current enrollment is approximately 2,200. Union
Institute & University has nearly 6,000 alumni.
Union Institute & University?s Graduate College,
College of Undergraduate Studies and Center for
Distance Learning have their headquarters in
Cincinnati, with undergraduate offices also located
in Los Angeles, Sacramento, and Miami, FL.
The Graduate School of The Union Institute has been
called the University for people whose life experience
has educated them beyond the limits of traditional
doctoral programs.

**Rich Douglas** · 02-18-2004 05:11 PM

"laferney" fails to realize (or chooses to ignore) that the link he provided is not from Union. Just because some third party says something doesn't make it so. As Steve noted, this displays a stunning lack of research capability.

To repeat, Union doesn't award degrees with "majors." I don't know if a concentration or specialization was made available to these folks, nor what it might have actually been in. But Union doesn't allow degrees to be awarded with concentrations that are so narrow as to not comprise what would normally be found in a typical Ph.D. program in a particular area.

My own Ph.D. had a concentration in higher education and a specialization in nontraditional higher education . I wouldn't be at all surprised if the learners pursuing a degree like "laferney" cited actually concentrated in a much more broadly defined area and emphasized in lactation studies (or the sort). That would be perfectly reasonable. (Note that the part quoted referred to a "focus." That sounds like a specialization, not a "major" as "laferney" called it.

Sloppy.

**laferney** · 02-18-2004 06:21 PM

Just because something comes from a link you're not familiar with doesn't mean it isn't valid."This displays a stunning lack of research capability.' you state.

One thing Union did not teach you guys was logic. When you can't dispute something you tend to go to namecalling or belittling.
You can quibble over "major", concentration, focus, specialization or whatever else it is called. They all basically mean the same thing. It would be interseting to hear what other viewers think.
Why would I "choose to ignore'-do you think I have devious intentions? You stated that Union didn't have a major in Lactation Studies. I simply posted the site to show that they did. I f you want me to say that Union had a PH.D In Interdisciplinary studies with a focus in Lactation Studies -ok .
But to deny it's true simply because it doesn't come from the "official Union "Site and to label someone you don't even know seems harsh.
When debating someone it is helpful to stick to the facts. But you pose some interesting questions for other readers to answer.
1. Is there a "real" difference in calling
the concentration, a major, Focus, etc.or do they essentially mean the same thing?
2. Must all info come from "official School sites" to be valid or can other sites be used for info. (Of course we need to verify that our sources are legit)
3. Is Lactation Studies a legitimate Doctoral level Focus?
I look forward to your responses.

**uncle janko** · 02-18-2004 07:35 PM

Quackwatch is irresponsible and ideologically driven. That's said independently of its strictures upon UIU. And as for whose research skills I would trust, don't ask me to choose between Douglas and Levicoff. But go ahead, ask me to choose between Douglas, Levicoff, or any combination of the two and whozits here. No comparison. Not even close. Nohow. No way. Gimme a break.

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**skidadl** · 02-18-2004 08:49 PM

what's the deal with highly educated people and rudeness going together like peanut butter and jelly? do you guys go out get doctoral degrees just so you can look for less educated people to try and make them look dumb? how do you get through a doorway with that big head? really though, it would be like me handing someone a football and then taking their head off because i knew they weren't near the skilled athlete or player that i am. get a grip smart guys. who cares how incredibly smart you are?

**Steve Levicoff** · 02-18-2004 11:01 PM

Originally posted by skidadl
what's the deal with highly educated people and rudeness going together like peanut butter and jelly?

Simple: We've earned the right to be pricks. In fact, it was a doctoral requirement: Rudeness and Pomposity 801.

do you guys go out get doctoral degrees just so you can look for less educated people to try and make them look dumb?

Nah, we just did it to become experts in our respective fields. As for making less educated people look dumb, you're managing that pretty well yourself.

how do you get through a doorway with that big head?

Which head? :D

who cares how incredibly smart you are?

Obviously, you do.

All Dr. Douglas and I have done is point out sloppy research and citation skills. Anyone who can't handle that should tighten their own skills so they can beat us on nothing but the facts. And if anyone wants to argue like a "doctor" (of anything), my suggestion is that they go out and earn one (obviously, a legitimate one). Just like we did.

Now chill out and get yourself a sense of humor.

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Lactation studies-get it right- OK

Lactation studies-get it right- OK

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