SA Theological Seminary

Greetings,

I have been accepted into SATS MTh program and was curious if anyone on the forum has completed this particular program throuth SATS.

The only complaint that I have so far is they are not very forth coming with explicit material. They have emailed me a document outlining writing style and an application to submit my thesis proposal or structured thesis proposal.

Any ideas as to which might be better a single thesis or a structured thesis?

I was also under the impression that my supervisor would be suggesting a literature review for the topics I am interested in researching. However, from recent email, I get the impression that I am to come up with the literature review.

If that is the case, does anyone know where I can obtain bibliographies on theological studies. I am considering researching pneumatology covering such things as the person, the work, and the role in the believer.

Anyway, I look forward to your comments and I also want to thank Bill Grover for his suggestions.

Thanks.

Shawn

 

Shawn,
I have not finished, but rather have just begun my M.Th. with S.A.T.S; however, I believe I may be a little farther down the path than you.

I went to them with what I wanted to accomplish in my studies even before I was formally through the acceptance process. Dr. van Rensburg put me in touch with the supervisor that would best fit my interests, and then Dr. Domeris and I discussed back and forth the best approach to take. When we had basically agreed on the approach, Dr. Domeris came up with a proposed program. I am doing a structured M.Th. in biblical archaeology. This consists of course work and a thesis of 30,000 words.
My suggestion to you is to be proactive. Talk to your supervisor, tell him what you want to accomplish, tell him your interests, ask some questions. If your supervisor is anything like mine, he will be happy to help you. Dr. Domeris has been excellent, and has been prompt and truly helpful in guiding me. Other contact staff have been the same.
If you want more information about my program, send me a private message and I will give you some details.

 

===



Shawn

You are very welcome. Chip, and any others who maintain this site , along with some other helpful members here, are responsible for my UZ connection too. This board really provides a good service.

One good book on the HS is "A Theology of The Holy Spirit" by Frederick Dale Brunner, Eerdmans, 1970. In the back of this is a 30 page, small print, bibliolography on your subject of interest. Of course some very significant work has been done since as Grudem's doctoral dissertation on prophesy.

It really would be easy to visualize a master's curriculum of say 8 courses plus thesis on just pneumatology alone as:

1. The HS in the Old Testament
2. The HS in the Development of Church Dogma
3. The HS and the Earthly Jesus
4. The HS in Ontological and Economic Trinal Relationships
5. The HS in Salvation
6. The HS in Church Formation in Acts
7. The HS in Christian Growth and Calling
8. Cessationism, Glossolalia, and Prophesy

These studies, of course, would interface with other major doctrines as Theology Proper, Soteriology, and Ecclesiology.


Thesis (or ,as they say, dissertation) on one narrow point as: is Bullinger correct that pneuma with the article refers to Person but when anarthrous the noun signifies the Power?

 

And your electrifying footnote in chapter 4 amid Yves Congar, Gary Badcock, and so many others is:

Grover, William. Tripwires of the Trinity. Unpublished D.Th. thesis, University of Zululand 2004

Later on in your career, people will come to Professor Shawn Pirate and ask, "How is it that you were the first to wrestle with Groverian Christology, given the storms of controversy it has engendered throughout the evangelical world? Since the 'Hermit Crab of Theologians' refuses to give interviews a la J.D. Salinger, your personal familiarity with Grover's thought is all the more remarkable. How do you account for this?"

Play your cards right, buddy, and you could get tenure.

 

In centuries to come this term will be aligned with other historical heresies:

Arianism
Monarchianism
Sabellianism
Calvinism
Antinomianism
Unitarianism
Groverianism

And since theologians will study Groverianism in detail, perhaps DegreeInfo will warrant notation in the great systematic theologies of the future.

 

How about that...degreeinfo - a primary source on Groverianism!

 

Just to think that I'll be able to tell my grandkids about the quality time I spent with the late great William Grover and debate doctrine. Please remember me when the Biography is written.

 

Thanks Gentlemen,

I appreciate the suggestions Bill. I'll look into that. What I've been thinking is a structured program encompassing New Testament Theology and a Thesis on pneumatology as it relates to the New Testament.

I'll contact Reuben after I've perused this handbook course for the program and discuss the options.

Groverian Christology. I'm not familiar with this view perhaps it may be a good resource before I'm finished with my work.

Rueben has been very patient with my questions and has offered to help. I'll think this over. Any thoughts about a structure that I have mentioned a Systematic Theology of the NT with emphasis on the Holy Spirit.

This is going to be interesting while working on a traditional MSSW-MFT and the MTh part-time.

Shawn

 

Which of the prophets did your fathers not persecute?

 

Alan,

I would like to email you privately about SATS and your program structure.

I contacted SATS and stated that I would like to proceed through a structured program of a combination of coursework and a mini-thesis.

He responded that there is no coursework. Consequently, I have no idea how to devise a plan as Bill has suggested. Reuben has suggested that I focus on a single subject rather than Systematic Theology as a whole with an emphasis on the Holy Spirit.

I like Bill's suggestions for the 8 courses, however, since there are no courses. I have no idea what to do. It seems SATS is less inclined to work with me prior to paying my fees and assigning me a supervisor or contact that could help me in this process.

The point here is, I cannot access your email address to contact you. Therefore, I have put my email address in this post. Please contact me so I can discuss how you've structured your program to accomplish your goals.

Thanks.

Shawn

[email protected]

 

===



Shawn

I know I am prone to spouting off advise. It is because I love the study of Biblical Theology and am senile. And I know too that Alan is the one in the know re SATS as I've never done anything there. Nevertheless, I'll make one more stab at this despite the above bufoonery of my good friends.


IMO if you wish to focus on pnuematology, then my suggestion above covers about all there is to that area. Those 8 "classes" need not be classes at all. Perhaps SATS would approve of you writing a paper of , say, 50-75 pages on each for three units credit. Or perhaps they could rather be chapters in a thesis. Or perhaps, these could be research assignments in pneumatology which are foundational to doing a master's dissertation on a narrow topic. Doing them would be a fine preparation which should bring an excellence to a master's thesis. Nor would more general doctrinal study be ignored by this focus .



This is because a basic premise of systematic theology is the the connection of doctrines. How can one discuss the HS in the OT or economic trinal relationships without researching creation, eg? How can one treat the HS in the life of Jesus without attending to the issue of the virginal birth and formulating an understanding of the kenosis wherein the HS is Jesus' empowerment? How can one address the work of the HS in soterial matters except by digging around in doctrines as effectual calling and regeneration? How can one without a grasp of ecclesiology understand the HS in Acts? How can one develop concepts of the HS in the ontological Trinity without addressing the doctrine of God? How can dispensationalism be considered apart from the charismata? All major doctrines are interrelated. Therefore, a focus on pneumatology yet occasions a study of other areas too.

I know I go blathering on,

sorry,

 

ff, not f
in bu
ffoonery

 

Shawn,

Bill's words,

are not unlike what my structured M.Th. in Biblical Archaeology is like. I am doing research assignments that give me the broad range of archaeological studies as they relate to the OT and NT, and then a narrower thesis.

 

==

right. from the French "buffone" , the court jester

 

secret proponent

I am signing on @ a secret proponent of Groverian Christology.


SSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! don't tell anybody.

 

Re: secret proponent

===

Hello Bro

See... I'm still being handled ungently here

 

Hey Bill,

What do you expect? lack of gentility probably translates as genuine, Trinitarian self-giving love in cyberspace.

blessings to you, and a Happy Thanksgiving,

Chris

 

Payment for the Groverian Ph.D ...

I'd like to be the first to pay whatever fee is required to obtain the coveted Ph.D in Groverianism. (How do you spell accreditation? Oh, never mind. Degreeinfo is more than qualified to issue the degree!)

How much?

Starkman

 

Re: Payment for the Groverian Ph.D ...

===


Hi Starkman

Bummer on ETS and John Sanders, eh? Probably I will be booted out of ETS too when my version of the hypostatic union is out of the oven. Na, not really......I hope. But were I RC I'd need to buy anathema "repelent."


ie,

ll, not l
in repe
llent

 

Bill, Alan, et al,

Thank you for your comments.

I think that by following a totally separate track in this MTh program at SATS I will be setting myself up for a great deal of stress and immense difficulty while following a separate track of study at U of L in my marriage and family therapy program.

Reading through the SATS manual I discoverd that there was a sub-heading under practical theology in Christian Counseling. Since my goal is to be a practicing MFT and connect those skills and education to ministry, I believe I would be better served to follow the same subject matter in both programs. Connecting Christian counseling principles with the systems theory model of marriage and family therapy.

When I've graduated both programs I can then pursue the PhD in Christian counseling building upon the thesis work of tying the two disciplines of Christian counseling and Marriage and Family therapy into a working model of therapy that is more systemic than linear since most Christian counseling follows a linear model of thinking. I plan on working on the PhD at Zululand if possible.

There are very few PhD programs in marriage and family therapy in the U.S. and the cost is prohibitive, especially once I exhaust my federal loans in the MSSW-MFT program

I've contacted a mentor who has a PhD from a traditional university in Marriage and Family therapy to assist me in developing an educational plan for SATS. I am hoping he is willing to do this so I can accomplish both degrees in a field that I believe needs a stronger basis of credibilty in the church universal and hopefully gain professional acceptance from insurance companies to offset the cost for churches to offer professional counseling services.

Thanks again for all of your help. If you have any ideas or suggestions please feel free to chime in. I would have been interested in pursuing the PhD at Southern Christian's DL PhD program, but the cost is prohibitive. The benefit though is having a friend and mentor who is an instructor for the SCU MFT Master's and Doctoral program to help me design my Mth.

Shawn