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  1. #1
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    Canadian teachers in the US

    I have been told that Canadian trained teachers do get work in the US, if they pass certification exams. I am curious though if the B.Ed. degree is recognized as basically equivalent to many master's degrees in the US or do they see them as having "just a bachelor's.

    If anything the Canadian B.Ed. is probably more rigorous, especially with the new 2 year curriculum in Ontario. If you think I'm kidding compare the requirements for the BPS (for Ontario students) and MSEd. at Niagara University:

    Ontario Teacher Certification Curriculum | Niagara University

    http://www.niagara.edu/assets/Upload...s-Website2.pdf

  2. #2
    RFValve is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Docere View Post
    I have been told that Canadian trained teachers do get work in the US, if they pass certification exams. I am curious though if the B.Ed. degree is recognized as basically equivalent to many master's degrees in the US or do they see them as having "just a bachelor's.

    If anything the Canadian B.Ed. is probably more rigorous, especially with the new 2 year curriculum in Ontario. If you think I'm kidding compare the requirements for the BPS (for Ontario students) and MSEd. at Niagara University:

    Ontario Teacher Certification Curriculum | Niagara University

    http://www.niagara.edu/assets/Upload...s-Website2.pdf
    Canadian teaching credentials are normally recognized in the US. The main issue is that strong unions in Ontario have made salaries and conditions for teachers very high compared with American ones. Why would you want to go the US? Some teachers in Ontario are making 100K plus teaching kinder garden or second grade with so many benefits such as banked sick days, job protection, etc. In the US, it is quite normal to make 30K as a elementary or kinder garden teacher with less benefits and lower job security.
    In few words, you will not see many Ontario teachers leaving to the US. The other issue is immigration, you can work in the US under a work TN Visa but there is no security that this visa will be renewed after it expires (normally every 3 years). A Trump administration might change the rules and send back all the Canadians that are stealing jobs from Americans after these visas expire. In few words, the risk of getting your visa denied or not renewed is high under a protectionist government so not the best time to move in my opinion.

  3. #3
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    Good question.

    I am completing my Ph.D. in Toronto. I am Canadian, my wife is US citizen/Canadian permanent resident. I may look for work in the US as well as Canada. We'd prefer to stay in Canada (esp. with Trump in the WH) but we want to have options in the US.

    It's very hard to find permanent work for teachers in Ontario but yes they have it much better than US teachers for the most part (even with mere "Bachelor of Education " degrees).

  4. #4
    RFValve is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Docere View Post
    Good question.

    I am completing my Ph.D. in Toronto. I am Canadian, my wife is US citizen/Canadian permanent resident. I may look for work in the US as well as Canada. We'd prefer to stay in Canada (esp. with Trump in the WH) but we want to have options in the US.

    It's very hard to find permanent work for teachers in Ontario but yes they have it much better than US teachers for the most part (even with mere "Bachelor of Education" degrees).
    Even with an American spouse, there is risk that work permits become very hard to get in my opinion. Trump will start going after TN work permits at some point as this is an easy way to make more jobs available to Americans so the wages go higher.
    If you have a PhD, you might qualify for a green card under EB1A or EB2-NIW categories that do not require a sponsor. I would apply for this visa before going there, if you get a green card it is unlikely that Trump can revoke them but he can revoke TN Visas in a day if he wants.

  5. #5
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    Still curious to know whether the Canadian B.Ed.'s are treated as "just a bachelor's" in those districts/states with the master's salary bump.

  6. #6
    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Docere View Post
    Still curious to know whether the Canadian B.Ed.'s are treated as "just a bachelor's" in those districts/states with the master's salary bump.
    And why would the B.Ed. be treated as anything other than a bachelor's?
    Theo the Educated Derelict
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  7. #7
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    The name is deceiving, like the LL.B. (Canadian lawyers got the LL.B. until recently even though it was pretty much identical to the American J.D.)

    It is a second-entry degree in Canada, for the most part (or a "combined degree" that requires 5-6 years of university).

    Canadian teacher graduates at Niagara University wear the same garb as masters students at the graduation ceremony, even though they are given a BPS degree.

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  9. #8
    novadar is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by RFValve View Post
    Some teachers in Ontario are making 100K plus teaching kinder garden or second grade with so many benefits such as banked sick days, job protection, etc..
    Wow. I am surprised but at the same time not overly surprised.
    -------

  10. #9
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by novadar View Post
    Wow. I am surprised but at the same time not overly surprised.
    Yeah, things are generally better for teachers north of the border, "inferior" degrees aside.

  11. #10
    RFValve is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Docere View Post
    The name is deceiving, like the LL.B. (Canadian lawyers got the LL.B. until recently even though it was pretty much identical to the American J.D.)

    It is a second-entry degree in Canada, for the most part (or a "combined degree" that requires 5-6 years of university).

    Canadian teacher graduates at Niagara University wear the same garb as masters students at the graduation ceremony, even though they are given a BPS degree.
    I used to have a girl friend in the US working for a school board in Ohio. She told me that salaries were based on the level of education , the maximum was a MA + 30 credits. She completed a MA and then EDS in order to reach the maximum. Two bachelors degrees do not equal an MA.
    More info below:
    https://www.ohea.org/salary-columns

    If you are planning to apply to any US education related job with your canadian education , you will most likely need a WES report. Most of the time, degrees are equivalent based on their level (e.g. a Canadian BS is equal to an American BS).

    In some places in Canada, the teaching credential requires a BS degree as admission and an extra year of work that normally leads to a BEd. However, it is highly unlikely that this BEd would be considered an MEd in the US just because is after a degree. The level is still at the bachelors level. However, if WES says that your BEd is equal to a MEd in the US, an employer will go with the WES report but this is not very likely.

    This reminds to some Mexican and European graduates that write MS in their resume because their degrees are 5 year degrees and automatically think that they deserve to be called MS for the extra year but in fact these degrees are normally evaluated as the equivalent to a BS degree in Canada because they are first degrees and not post graduate degrees even if they take longer to complete.
    Last edited by RFValve; 01-27-2017 at 09:41 PM.

  12. #11
    RFValve is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by novadar View Post
    Wow. I am surprised but at the same time not overly surprised.
    Increasing number of Hamilton teachers making more than $100K - Latest Hamilton news - CBC Hamilton

    I had a girl friend in the Hamilton area that is a kinder garden teacher , she was making about 80K back in 2003 with only 5 years experience. Most reach 100K range when they get close to retirement. Pensions are very generous too, most retire with about 70% of their last salary.

    My GF in Ohio was only making 40K with a Masters degree in Ohio, I then realized that salary conditions were very different. Also, my GF in Hamilton told me that they could bank sick days not taken and some could retire even few years earlier if they don't get sick. They also have pedagogical days and some other benefits.

    There are many complaints from Ontario citizens that these people are overpaid, the cost of education is very high and the quality is still not that great. Teachers normally say that they need the extra money because the stress of having to deal with parents and children with issues.

  13. #12
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    I guess it works both ways. Ontario doesn't consider an MSED from Buffalo universities to be a real masters degree.

  14. #13
    Johann is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by RFValve View Post
    Some teachers in Ontario are making 100K plus teaching kinder garden or second grade with so many benefits such as banked sick days, job protection, etc. ...In few words, you will not see many Ontario teachers leaving to the US.
    Agreed - you won't. And before a bunch of American teachers decide to try the Canadian gravy train, let me remind you $100,000 Canadian is currently around $75,000 American. And I think that in quite a few places in the US, $75K will buy more / better food & material goods (including real estate) than $100K Cdn. will, here in Canada. (And yes, a couple of years back the $C briefly flirted with par but -- not now and not in the foreseeable.)

    Not saying that $75,000 US or $100K Cdn. is chump change -- just sayin'.

    J.
    Last edited by Johann; 01-30-2017 at 04:46 PM.

  15. #14
    Johann is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by RFValve
    Also, my GF in Hamilton told me that they could bank sick days not taken and some could retire even few years earlier if they don't get sick. They also have pedagogical days and some other benefits.
    These sick days have most often led to a big payday at retirement - $50K or more, from what I hear. I read the Provincial Government has been working overtime to legislate the bulk of these banked sick days (including those already earned) off the table, so nobody should count on them.

    J.

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  17. #15
    Johann is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johann View Post
    I read the Provincial Government has been working overtime to legislate the bulk of these banked sick days (including those already earned) off the table, so nobody should count on them.
    I'm behind the times. The Ontario Government took banking of sick days away years ago. Net effect: As teachers can no longer bank sick days, they USE them - and it costs $1 billion a year.

    Ontario teachers’ sick days shot up in 2015, costing school boards nearly $1B: report | National Post

    J.

  18. #16
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    The Masters may become the entry-level degree in Ontario anyway...

    https://www.thestar.com/yourtoronto/..._teachers.html

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