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  1. #1
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    Should there be a uniform "first professional degree" for teachers?

    ...the contrast between the education of teachers and the education of most other professionals is stark. In order to prepare to become a lawyer in the United States, an individual generally enrolls in a law school, takes a prescribed three-year graduate course of study, and at its completion earns a J.D. degree, the first professional degree in the field. To become a physician, a student enrolls in a medical school, attends a prescribed four-year graduate program, and on satisfactory completion is awarded an M.D. degree, the first professional degree in that field. In both professions, there is basic agreement on what an entry-level practitioner should know and be able to do. Accordingly, each can construct a curriculum that specifies what is studied, when it is studied, how long it is studied, and which credential is awarded for completing the studies.

    But teaching is different. There is no common first professional degree. Students can earn a whole host of degrees and certificates. There is nothing approaching a uni-
    form length of study to become a teacher . A preparation program may be one year or two, four years or even five, unless it is a campus-based alternative certification program, in which case any length is possible. The length of a program may
    have little to do with educational considerations. It can be determined by the marketplace. For instance, at one Northeastern research university, the chair of the teacher education program favored a five-year program that would offer a bachelor’s degree in the liberal arts and a master’s degree in teacher education , rather than a four-year teacher education baccalaureate. She said: “Kids need to commit at the outset of their freshman year that education is what they want to pursue. They must select courses carefully and pass every course along the way. That’s difficult and even inappropriate for someone 18 or 19. They ought to do some exploring—something a fifth year would allow.” Nonetheless the school has not moved to a five-year program,
    largely out of concern that it would be placed at a competitive disadvantage with schools that offered a shorter program.
    http://www.edschools.org/pdf/Educati...ers_Report.pdf

  2. #2
    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    Nah ......
    Last edited by Ted Heiks; 08-26-2013 at 09:16 PM.
    Theo the Educated Derelict
    BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
    MBA, Entrepreneurship, City University of Seattle, 1992
    MBA, Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993

    Politics is made from two words: "poly" meaning "many" and "ticks" meaning "blood-sucking insects."

  3. #3
    Rich Douglas is offline Registered User
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    The education profession is controlled by the individual states. We wouldn't want to centralize control of it, would we?

  4. #4
    airtorn is offline Moderator
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    Let's add degree creep to another career field.

  5. #5
    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    And what degree title do you have in mind for this first professional degree in education ? The title of Doctor of Education is already taken.
    Last edited by Ted Heiks; 08-26-2013 at 09:16 PM.
    Theo the Educated Derelict
    BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
    MBA, Entrepreneurship, City University of Seattle, 1992
    MBA, Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993

    Politics is made from two words: "poly" meaning "many" and "ticks" meaning "blood-sucking insects."

  6. #6
    SteveFoerster is offline Resident Gadfly
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    Master of Arts in Teaching , I suppose. But I don't think this solves anything that's ailing K-12 education .
    BS, Info Sys concentration, Charter Oak State College
    MA in Educational Tech, George Washington University
    PhD in Leadership, U. of the Cumberlands (in progress)
    More at http://stevefoerster.com

  7. #7
    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveFoerster View Post
    Master of Arts in Teaching, I suppose. But I don't think this solves anything that's ailing K-12 education.
    Master of Arts in Teaching a degree title for a proposed first professional degree in education ? Most first-professional degrees carry the doctoral title and require three years of study for a full-time program. The only first-professional degree that carries a master's title, so far as I know, is the Master of Divinity . Furthermore, the Master of Arts in Teaching , as it now exists, requires a mere one year of studies.
    Last edited by Ted Heiks; 08-26-2013 at 09:15 PM.
    Theo the Educated Derelict
    BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
    MBA, Entrepreneurship, City University of Seattle, 1992
    MBA, Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993

    Politics is made from two words: "poly" meaning "many" and "ticks" meaning "blood-sucking insects."

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  9. #8
    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rich Douglas View Post
    The education profession is controlled by the individual states. We wouldn't want to centralize control of it, would we?
    And why not?
    Last edited by Ted Heiks; 08-26-2013 at 09:15 PM.
    Theo the Educated Derelict
    BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
    MBA, Entrepreneurship, City University of Seattle, 1992
    MBA, Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993

    Politics is made from two words: "poly" meaning "many" and "ticks" meaning "blood-sucking insects."

  10. #9
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    Good point! So-called first professional degrees are at least 3 years beyond the baccalaureate. Not sure what happens if the proposals to shorten law schools to 2 years are adopted.

  11. #10
    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    A 2-year JD?
    Reduce the degree title to MJ?
    Bring back the old LLB?
    Last edited by Ted Heiks; 08-26-2013 at 09:15 PM.
    Theo the Educated Derelict
    BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
    MBA, Entrepreneurship, City University of Seattle, 1992
    MBA, Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993

    Politics is made from two words: "poly" meaning "many" and "ticks" meaning "blood-sucking insects."

  12. #11
    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by airtorn View Post
    Let's add degree creep to another career field.
    Good idea!
    Last edited by Ted Heiks; 08-26-2013 at 09:15 PM.
    Theo the Educated Derelict
    BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
    MBA, Entrepreneurship, City University of Seattle, 1992
    MBA, Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993

    Politics is made from two words: "poly" meaning "many" and "ticks" meaning "blood-sucking insects."

  13. #12
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Heiks View Post
    A 2-year JD?
    Reduce the degree title to MJ?
    Bring back the old LLB?
    Librarians seem satisfied with "only" a masters.

  14. #13
    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Docere View Post
    Librarians seem satisfied with "only" a masters.
    And how many years of study are required for a Master of Library and Information Science degree?
    Last edited by Ted Heiks; 08-26-2013 at 09:14 PM.
    Theo the Educated Derelict
    BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
    MBA, Entrepreneurship, City University of Seattle, 1992
    MBA, Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993

    Politics is made from two words: "poly" meaning "many" and "ticks" meaning "blood-sucking insects."

  15. #14
    Docere is offline Registered User
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    2 years. There was no expansion to 3 years to get a "doctorate" as is the case in several other professions. Hence, if the 2-year law degree proposals go through (and it probably won't)...

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  17. #15
    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Docere View Post
    2 years. There was no expansion to 3 years to get a "doctorate" as is the case in several other professions. Hence, if the 2-year law degree proposals go through (and it probably won't)...
    ... the MJ degree
    Theo the Educated Derelict
    BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
    MBA, Entrepreneurship, City University of Seattle, 1992
    MBA, Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993

    Politics is made from two words: "poly" meaning "many" and "ticks" meaning "blood-sucking insects."

  18. #16
    airtorn is offline Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Heiks View Post
    And why not?
    Without digging deep into it, centralizing control of it at the Federal level appears to go against the 10th Amendment.

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