Thread: Progressive Universal Life Church

Who dug up this old thread?

No Kojak, Matlock or Serpico needed, Ted. Appears to be a mono-post by new member Rev Kelly.

If you Google "Progressive Universal Life Church," this thread comes up first - even before the Church itself. Either Rev Kelly was really looking for the school or he's some kind of super-SEO wizard.

If you go to the Church's website, you're now directed to this new one: Spiritual Humanism - Free Online Ordination - Be an Ordained Minister Hope this helps someone.

Johann

I have a feeling that this “Rev” Kelly is none other than our fake doctor (in truth, not even a high school graduate) Theresa M. Kelly of the University of Alternative Studies scam who purchased her bogus title from Universal Life Church. She is probably interested in plagiarizing Progressive Universal Life Church’s Certified Psychic course in the same way that she stole Florida International University ’s logo.

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Hi OpalMoon34 - say, don't I remember you from DD? :)

You could be right - so let's find out. I officially invite poster Rev. Kelly to re-join the thread and tell us his/her story. Answer or no answer - we'll know the truth. "By their fruits shall ye know them." (Matthew 7:20)

Johann

Umm - does rather look like you were right, OpalMoon34. Good call!

Johann

OK Johann, it's a little bit unlike you to make such a vague, uninformative post. You think opal was correct? About what, exactly?

No, it's not like me to make vague uninformative posts - unless I want to - which is quite seldom -and not now.

I think OpalMoon34 (whom I remember from DD) is correct about who One-poster Revkelly is. And there is other info posted about this person OpalMoon named on the board. - That's all - and I'll admit I could still be wrong, but I don't think so.

I clearly said to OpalMoon34 in my prev. posting that time would tell if her speculation re: RevKelly's identity was correct. Time has now passed, with no answer. Ergo, I think she's correct.

Now please tell me - what exactly was vague, here? Not that it's really important.

Johann

I'm not a fan of this splinter from the first Universal Life Church (Modesto, CA) but any titles and degrees are not bogus maybe a bit expensive and all but as a church they can decide what internal requirements are for degrees and titles. There is the 1st Amendment Seperation of Church and State involved even if a member of my branch worships a Big Smiley Face and has his ministry around that its a ministry nevertheless. No different for any other faith group these degrees if of a religious nature are fine and well legal to use in most cases.

My advice though is if your just interested in a doctoral title join the ULC (Modesto, CA), get ordained for free it takes 48 hours or less to record and then buy the title Reverend Doctor for $10 plus shipping costs. You can then use Rev. Dr. in front of your name legally and for a minimal amount and no state could refute it as a religious title its no different than Cleric, Rabbi, Minister, Pastor, Imam and so forth. If you want a degree for a modest sum you can get one of those also but its not needed to use the title I mentioned.

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I agree 100% that the degrees are legal and allowable under the law. My problem with "degrees" such as this is that they cheapen the doctoral credential. If anyone can slap "Dr" onto their name by paying $10 it decreases the value of a doctorate degree in the minds of the public. It also contributes to the idea that all non-accredited schools are mills, which is not the case.

For example, a friend of mine has been working diligently for over four years full time to earn her PhD from an accredited B&M institution. I think giving away the "Dr" title for a small fee and no work is rather insulting to those who put in the years of hard work to earn the title. Imagine a church passing out "Medal of Honor" medals to anyone who pays them $5. Rather disrespectful to the soldiers who actually earned them, no?

So I think the "Dr" title should be reserved for medical doctors and those who complete accredited doctoral programs which require actual work. (Honorary doctorates shouldn't be used in a person's title either, which is why most people do not use them in this way.) For a church that wishes to award a credential to their minister, pastor, cleric, etc, I would say a church should just award the Rev title, like most churches do. Awarding a pseudo-doctorate title for a small fee is ridiculous, IMHO.

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Actually the ULC (Modesto) offers many titles two are Doctor sorts the Reverend Doctor and Litterarum Doctor for $10 each actually with shipping its $11.65. And what you think doesn't matter its the law that matters and for me its funny to prod the religious sorts with our odd titles from the classic Cleric to Goddess to Universal Rabbi to Magus and all manner of others. What would be a better opener to talk about ones faith I'm Reverend Smith or I'm Free Thinker Smith or Universal Philosopher of Absolute Truth Smith [UPoAT Smith]?

Contrary to popular beliefs most of us take the churches role seriously but some like me love prodding the sensibilities of the serious faiths with their titles, degrees and special knowledge of an elect. There is to much power there IMHO and if I can poke and prod it a bit I will. But that is my view.

Originally Posted by OutsideTheBox

I'm not a fan of this splinter from the first Universal Life Church (Modesto, CA) but any titles and degrees are not bogus maybe a bit expensive and all but as a church they can decide what internal requirements are for degrees and titles. There is the 1st Amendment Seperation of Church and State involved even if a member of my branch worships a Big Smiley Face and has his ministry around that its a ministry nevertheless. No different for any other faith group these degrees if of a religious nature are fine and well legal to use in most cases.

It is bogus if the so called "church" has no objective existence other than an online store that sells ridiculous titles to gullible individuals who then use the supposedly religious title in non-religious contexts and situations. Like what this Non-doctor Theresa M. Kelly is doing. Actually, you don't even have to buy the doctor title from a notorious credential mill like ULC if all you want is to to put "Dr." before your name, you won't be arrested for doing that. What is actually illegal is to call yourself "doctor" for the purpose of deceiving someone as to your skills, qualifications, or credentials, where such deception would amount to fraud.

The ULC (Modesto) does have active ministers some are pagans using the ULC as the legal cover since its practical, some are running marriage services for an income, some run websites or have alternative beliefs. The only hard doctrine: Is do only that which is right. And according to the founder that is whatever the person in their conscience believes is right and doesn't hurt anyone else.

I'm not even religious per se but what most would call a rational humanist and am among a decent number of atheists, agnostics and philosophical sorts in the church.

And there is a physical church in Modesto they have a weekly open pulpit service on Sundays I did go there once two years ago and its been there for decades.

Is it any less meritorious than Scientology, Televangelists and others that make money on religion at least the ULC (Modesto) branch is honest about it you want a title, degree or book or other item just buy it. And since we are talking the First Amendment here an attack on my church is an attack on any other one if we can be taken down and the state can dictate degrees used in faith settings what about the Baptists, Roman Catholics, Lutheran, Jewish and other faiths.

Its true the buying of the two doctor titles is fairly uncommon most either earn on the the ULC degrees, gets the honorary title Doctor of Divinity or use another title. I fancy Cleric or Free Thinker both fit me the former is a person working in the clergy I am ordained after all and the later fits my path so to speak one of rational thought and criticism of the systems humans have. But if a woman wants the title Goddess or a man the title Magus its fine by me.

Anyway is it illegal to offer the title, since no one is endorsing illegal use of them. Even on my own clerical ID has as the last line:The Universal Life Church assumes no responsibility for any actions of the bearer hereof not the use of this credential for any purpose other than the purpose it was issued. Among those its mainly as the privileges and considerations customarily granted to ministers, perform marriage within the local and state laws, performing all services preaching and conducting services and ordain new ministers into the church. I cannot break the law and not follow the laws I just get powers within ministry which can be broad by are not absolute.

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Originally Posted by OutsideTheBox

And since we are talking the First Amendment here an attack on my church is an attack on any other one if we can be taken down and the state can dictate degrees used in faith settings what about the Baptists, Roman Catholics, Lutheran, Jewish and other faiths.

C’mon, you don’t have a church. You only bought a title from the most notorious religious credential mill in the world that would “ordain” even mass murderers, dogs, cats or even a completely made-up character in exchange for a quick buck.

Universal Life Church (Modesto, CA) is a scam and everyone knows that it is. Its so-called ordained ministers have no credibility whatsoever. Clerics of the “Jewish, Roman Catholic, Baptist, Lutheran” faiths that you mentioned studied for years and have legitimate bachelor’s, master’s and at times doctorate degrees (or several) which they worked hard for and did not just buy from a website who will sell it to anybody. That is what separates your bogus “doctorate” from a real doctorate religious or otherwise—you just bought a title, you lack all the necessary education and training. Chances are, and by all means correct me if I’m wrong, you don’t even have an accredited bachelor’s degree.

To give you an idea of the difference between legitimate and bogus, here is a sample curriculum of a legitimate Master of Divinity degree from Southwestern Baptist theological Seminary (regionally accredited by SACS). Now, here is the instant ordination page of your “church” ULC, where all you need to do is fill-up and click. How dare you compare your fake religious doctorate to legitimate religious degrees as if you do not know that yours is just a joke!

Further readings:

• Marriage annulled on basis that ULC minister lacked qualifications under New York Statutes: no congregation and not appointed by head of ecclesiastical order.
  
• Marriage annulled on basis ULC minister lacked actual church or stated meeting place.
  
• New York City right to deny license to ULC ministers upheld.

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Originally Posted by Nosborne

As opposed to the Whole Life Church?

Nosborne, JD

As opposed to the Term Life Church.

Originally Posted by OpalMoon34

C’mon, you don’t have a church. You only bought a title from the most notorious religious credential mill in the world that would “ordain” even mass murderers, dogs, cats or even a completely made-up character in exchange for a quick buck.

Universal Life Church (Modesto, CA) is a scam and everyone knows that it is. Its so-called ordained ministers have no credibility whatsoever. Clerics of the “Jewish, Roman Catholic, Baptist, Lutheran” faiths that you mentioned studied for years and have legitimate bachelor’s, master’s and at times doctorate degrees (or several) which they worked hard for and did not just buy from a website who will sell it to anybody. That is what separates your bogus “doctorate” from a real doctorate religious or otherwise—you just bought a title, you lack all the necessary education and training. Chances are, and by all means correct me if I’m wrong, you don’t even have an accredited bachelor’s degree.

To give you an idea of the difference between legitimate and bogus, here is a sample curriculum of a legitimate Master of Divinity degree from Southwestern Baptist theological Seminary (regionally accredited by SACS). Now, here is the instant ordination page of your “church” ULC, where all you need to do is fill-up and click. How dare you compare your fake religious doctorate to legitimate religious degrees as if you do not know that yours is just a joke!

Further readings:

• Marriage annulled on basis that ULC minister lacked qualifications under New York Statutes: no congregation and not appointed by head of ecclesiastical order.
  
• Marriage annulled on basis ULC minister lacked actual church or stated meeting place.
  
• New York City right to deny license to ULC ministers upheld.

Go to that page in the church link for odination, go to the bottom left. Lets see a church with services every Sunday in our HQ with from my experience an open pulpit for anyone to say his or her piece. Sounds like we do in fact have a CHURCH just one in the HQ in Modesto, CA but its a church. And all degrees are issued under religious exemptions in California so in fact are legal use religious degrees. If our church is just off the wall on things compared to the other ones that is okay this is America a faith can be odd. Its out view the simple act of desiring an ordination means we are welcome as ministers in the church regardless of our path. And we have a doctrine one short bit: And do only that which is right. Our founder was brilliant he let anyone of any age be a minister finally killing off the elitism your representing with your degrees and church titles and special knowledge.

Are you saying you need a formal education or training to be a minister of a faith under the US Constitution?

And our church may be a joke but if it is at least we like to have fun and in our own respective ministry goals add to it, I'm a rational humanist not even religious and just enjoy using my credentials to show how stupid the system is by taking one to abuse the rights to prod the others. I married two sisters once who were lovers, why, no one else would but I did the whole in the faith certificate and public ceremony. If someone wanted to ordain their dog I would do it and attach him or her to my ministry even ante up for a title just because it would tick people off.

In truth we have serious members all over many pagans did complete training in their paths but use the ULC for the legal aspects such as registering to perform marriages which can be done in the majority of states easily. And others join to again since they like their enjoyment of faith very simple. And then you have people like me.

And I just want to ask a question for OpalMoon34: Is there a law anywhere in the US Requiring one have a degree or formal training to be ordained as a member of a faith or recognized as a clergy member by the government?

	George Washington University George Washington University GWU offers an online Bachelor’s Degree in Police Science; and Master’s Degrees in Education and Human Development, Paralegal Studies, Public Relations, Educational Technology Lead, MBA – Healthcare, and MPS in Security and Safety Leadership. GW University is a prestigious and well regarded school. Established in the heart of the nation's capital in 1821, GW provides innovative programs in more than 200 fields of study, including graduate certificate, master's and doctoral programs. Under the guidance of a world-renowned faculty, you will explore both theory and practice in courses that prepare you to meet the needs of an increasingly complex society. Click Here to receive FREE information on this school.

	Liberty University Liberty University Liberty offers online degrees in the following subject areas: a huge selection of programs in Religious Studies (Associate's, Bachelor's, and Master's), a Master's Degree in Human Services, Master of Science in Nursing, Business (Associate's, Bachelor's, and MBA), Education and Teaching (Bachelor's, Master's, and Doctorate), Liberal Arts (Associate's, Bachelor's, and Master's), and Counseling (Associate's, Bachelor's, and Master's). Liberty has an outstanding reputation for the quality of its education and scholarship, though the strong Christian affiliation may be objectionable to some. The school is regionally accredited, the most widely recognized accreditation. Click Here to receive FREE information on this school.

	Paralegals and Legal Assistants Paralegal and Legal Assistant Degrees One of a paralegal's most important tasks is helping lawyers prepare for closings, hearings, trials, and corporate meetings. Paralegals might investigate the facts of cases and ensure that all relevant information is considered. They also identify appropriate laws, judicial decisions, legal articles, and other materials that are relevant to assigned cases. After they analyze and organize the information, paralegals may prepare written reports that attorneys use in determining how cases should be handled. If attorneys decide to file lawsuits on behalf of clients, paralegals may help prepare the legal arguments, draft pleadings and motions to be filed with the court, obtain affidavits, and assist attorneys during trials. Paralegals also organize and track files of all important case documents and make them available and easily accessible to attorneys. •Job opportunities are projected to be better-than-average with strong employment growth; however, competition for jobs is expected. •Formally trained, experienced paralegals should have the best employment opportunities. •Most entrants have an associate’s degree in paralegal studies, or a bachelor's degree in another field and a certificate in paralegal studies. Click Here to find FREE information on schools offering this course of study.

Originally Posted by OutsideTheBox

Go to that page in the church link for odination, go to the bottom left. Lets see a church with services every Sunday in our HQ with from my experience an open pulpit for anyone to say his or her piece. Sounds like we do in fact have a CHURCH just one in the HQ in Modesto, CA but its a church. And all degrees are issued under religious exemptions in California so in fact are legal use religious degrees. If our church is just off the wall on things compared to the other ones that is okay this is America a faith can be odd. Its out view the simple act of desiring an ordination means we are welcome as ministers in the church regardless of our path. And we have a doctrine one short bit: And do only that which is right. Our founder was brilliant he let anyone of any age be a minister finally killing off the elitism your representing with your degrees and church titles and special knowledge.

Are you saying you need a formal education or training to be a minister of a faith under the US Constitution?

And our church may be a joke but if it is at least we like to have fun and in our own respective ministry goals add to it, I'm a rational humanist not even religious and just enjoy using my credentials to show how stupid the system is by taking one to abuse the rights to prod the others. I married two sisters once who were lovers, why, no one else would but I did the whole in the faith certificate and public ceremony. If someone wanted to ordain their dog I would do it and attach him or her to my ministry even ante up for a title just because it would tick people off.

In truth we have serious members all over many pagans did complete training in their paths but use the ULC for the legal aspects such as registering to perform marriages which can be done in the majority of states easily. And others join to again since they like their enjoyment of faith very simple. And then you have people like me.

And I just want to ask a question for OpalMoon34: Is there a law anywhere in the US Requiring one have a degree or formal training to be ordained as a member of a faith or recognized as a clergy member by the government?

I think many have lost the ability to laugh at themselves, not be too serious, and have some fun. I have a coworker that become ordained so he could perform the ceremony for his best friend. He did it on a dare!

	George Washington University George Washington University GWU offers an online Bachelor’s Degree in Police Science; and Master’s Degrees in Education and Human Development, Paralegal Studies, Public Relations, Educational Technology Lead, MBA – Healthcare, and MPS in Security and Safety Leadership. GW University is a prestigious and well regarded school. Established in the heart of the nation's capital in 1821, GW provides innovative programs in more than 200 fields of study, including graduate certificate, master's and doctoral programs. Under the guidance of a world-renowned faculty, you will explore both theory and practice in courses that prepare you to meet the needs of an increasingly complex society. Click Here to receive FREE information on this school.

	Paralegals and Legal Assistants Paralegal and Legal Assistant Degrees One of a paralegal's most important tasks is helping lawyers prepare for closings, hearings, trials, and corporate meetings. Paralegals might investigate the facts of cases and ensure that all relevant information is considered. They also identify appropriate laws, judicial decisions, legal articles, and other materials that are relevant to assigned cases. After they analyze and organize the information, paralegals may prepare written reports that attorneys use in determining how cases should be handled. If attorneys decide to file lawsuits on behalf of clients, paralegals may help prepare the legal arguments, draft pleadings and motions to be filed with the court, obtain affidavits, and assist attorneys during trials. Paralegals also organize and track files of all important case documents and make them available and easily accessible to attorneys. •Job opportunities are projected to be better-than-average with strong employment growth; however, competition for jobs is expected. •Formally trained, experienced paralegals should have the best employment opportunities. •Most entrants have an associate’s degree in paralegal studies, or a bachelor's degree in another field and a certificate in paralegal studies. Click Here to find FREE information on schools offering this course of study.