No DETC at Naval Postgraduate School Free Masters

Discussion in 'Accreditation Discussions (RA, DETC, state approva' started by warguns, Oct 11, 2014.

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  1. warguns

    warguns Member

  2. LearningAddict

    LearningAddict Well-Known Member

    Hopefully, someone will challenge it.
     
  3. warguns

    warguns Member

  4. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    That's probably because they focus on the educational opportunity you would have at their institution rather than speculate on what education opportunity you might have at some other institution.
     
  5. warguns

    warguns Member

    DECT and graduate school

    And the fact that most are for-profits so they don't want to loose your money by telling the limitation.
     
  6. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    I worked for an ACICS accredited non-profit school, and it didn't go any further out of its way to persuade prospective students not to apply than for-profit ones do.
     
  7. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    The for-profit I worked at warned students that credit transfer is very limited. ITT Tech warns students that their credits aren't likely to transfer. Not only is this being a socially responsible company, but it staves off complaints that will come when students try to transfer. Transferring is something that happens regularly even from good schools.
     
  8. rebel100

    rebel100 New Member

    Not all that surprising really, there was a thread not too long ago that attempted to detail which schools (regionally accredited masters) would accept a nationally accredited bachelors...it was a rather short list.

    I think AMU/APU was among the handful of choices and they would likely be most apt to have a similiar program.

    My problem (mine not theirs), is this: "The criteria for acceptance to the CHDS Masters Degree program includes the requirement that students be employees of local, state, federal or tribal government agencies." I would love to try the program, but no longer work for local or state government but rather a private hospital system....so it was a no go for me on that bases. I did an MBA instead.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 15, 2014
  9. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    I was going to say that the list of HETA participants from CHEA is not that short a list, but CHEA's site says the directory is no longer available. That's unfortunate if it's not coming back; I've emailed CHEA to ask them what's up and will report here.
     
  10. me again

    me again Well-Known Member

    That is an attempt to get as many government workers trained (as possible) to help protect the infrastructure. Those who need the training the most are those in key governmental positions. It also helps to justify the Navy budget to keep the program afloat.
     
  11. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    I saw what you did there....
     
  12. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Apparently, this is the official CHEA announcement on this:

    It's odd, though, because I remember that it wasn't the case that only NA schools were on the list. But it's their list, they can pull it if they want.
     
  13. warguns

    warguns Member

    Just out of curiosity, I emailed the graduate admission departments of five public universities. NONE said that a DETC degree would be accepted for admission. So, take it for what it's worth.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 18, 2014
  14. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    That's not much of a sample. Meanwhile in another thread, John Bear recently reminded us that his study from 2000 found about an even split between those RA schools that probably would and those that probably wouldn't. He's right that it's past time for such a study to be freshly rerun, but I don't think it makes sense to assume things are radically worse for NA schools in this regard than they were then.
     
  15. LearningAddict

    LearningAddict Well-Known Member

    I wonder if the HETA database is just not going to be offered anymore, or if the HETA program as a whole is dead?
     
  16. warguns

    warguns Member

    The 50% does not mean much even if it's true, if the quality of the schools admitting DETC bachelors degrees for a masters is low. I have no doubt that there are lots of low quality master's schools that would admit almost any holder of a bachelor's degree just for the income. Has anyone ever been rejected for entry to a masters at AMU/ APU?
     
  17. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    By asking that, you're conflating acceptance rate with academic quality.
     
  18. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    And that may be a perfectly reasonable thing to do.

    It's generally accepted that the US higher education system (unlike those in other countries) is not highly standardized. This means that different schools may vary widely in terms of "academic quality". And obviously this point is important to potential students.

    Unfortunately, "academic quality" is something that is difficult to measure directly -- there is no universally accepted way to do it. So if we want to evaluate this factor, we are forced to use other measurements as proxies.

    It is commonly accepted that there is a general relationship between selectivity and academic quality. If that is the case, then it is perfectly reasonable to use selectivity (which is very easy to measure) as a general proxy for academic quality (which isn't). College rankings (e.g. USN&WR) commonly use multiple proxies for academic quality, including selectivity, and then average them.

    You may disagree with this approach, and that's OK. But in that case -- do you have a better way to measure "academic quality" ?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 24, 2014
  19. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    It is, hence the annual cycle of specious rankings that apparently make a lot of money for their publishers.

    Perhaps since we can't measure it, we should take that as a sign that first it should be better defined?

    That argument is entirely circular. We can use selectivity as a general proxy for academic quality because it's commonly accepted that there's a general relationship between them?

    I mean, does that mean that all community colleges are abysmal in academic quality? Does Harvard Extension School or the Open University in the UK have a complete lack of it? Selectivity as a proxy for quality collapses under the weight of these absurdities.

    The closest I think we can get is to use the tools of program evaluation to see whether specific programs do what they're designed to do. That may be more conducive to continuous improvement of specific programs than to measuring institutions against one another, but I don't see that as much of a loss.
     
  20. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    Students have to make college choices now. They can't wait around for a general consensus on a better definition.

    There is an implicit assumption here: we can identify the best schools because they attract the best students. In other words, it's a market-based approach: the best schools are most likely to be the ones that compete most successfully in the market for student talent.

    If the best students in your state, given the choice, tend to attend the state flagship university over the community colleges, then that sends a market signal.

    If Harvard applicants, given the choice, prefer to attend Harvard College over Harvard Extension, then that sends a market signal.

    If non-traditional students in the UK, given the choice, prefer to enroll in University of London International Programmes over Open University, then that sends a market signal.

    Perhaps such market signals could be meaningful.

    Is that a practical approach? If so, perhaps you could provide real-world examples.

    Here is one possibility. Law schools are designed to produce lawyers. To become lawyers, law school graduates must pass the bar exam. So maybe bar exam pass rates could be a "tool of program evaluation" for law schools.

    But if so, then it is well known that there is a strong correlation between bar pass rate and traditional measures of law school selectivity, such as average LSAT score.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 24, 2014

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