Is it OK for degree mills to give certificates?

Hi. I know that a degree from a degree mill is worthless and often substandard in its learning value as well.


My doubt is about courses that do not offer any degrees.

Let's say that Rushmore or any other mill with some content in it start offering Executive Education courses.

Those can't be used to enter a master's, a doctorate or anything. They are just courses to learn a litle more about some field. Many top US schools offer this kind of course, and at the end of 3 days of seminars or something like it you get a certificate of completion.

Would it be legal for mills to offer that?

Would it be ethical to take a course like this and list it in my resume when looking for a new job?

I am working here with a scenario where the course really exists, and works pretty much like the ones from top US schools. I 'd spend 3 days watching classes, maybe studying cases, and at the end would get a certificate of completion. This could be done online as well, with some kind of evaluation.



Here's an example of an Executive Education course:

http://www.exed.hbs.edu/programs/mfse/

 

Why in the world would you want to conduct any type of business with a fraudulent operation?

Honestly, it strikes me to see the naivette of people.
There are thousands and thousands of legitimate degrees and certificates to fit any budget, any lifestyle, any preference.... Why would you fall back on a degree mill to get any type of education? Why would you think that it would be in your advantage to associate yourself with fraudulent organization?

 

Its an hypothetical question. I don't even think that any "less than wonderful " school offers Exec Ed courses.

I think that starting with short courses can be a first step for bad schools to gain some knowledge towards becoming real schools.

Harvard's courses require presence and are all costing thousands of dollars. I can't
pay that much for seminars. Poor schools could maybe give decent seminars at low prices.


Anyway, please don't take my behavior (even hypothetical into account). What I want to know is the applicability of such a
situation. Would it be legal? Would it be ethical? Can a good course arise from a bad school? I like to inquire about those gray areas.

So what do you think?

 

Unless there is something missing from what I can see, I do not think Rushmore is a diploma mill. There are many diploma mills out there but I do not think unaccredited automatically means diploma mill.

 

Sorry about that. What I meant are schools that are not accredited, but do require some work (although usually less than the more tradiitional schools). I am not sure which ones would be good examples though.

 

So it would be kind of a soul searching exercise. If the program is real, with solid content, listing it would be OK. If its bogus, no way.


But even with a real program I think it all comes down to a school's reputation. After all, degree or not, if a school has a bad name a random course form them may even detract from a resume. If its viewed as serious, accredited or not, then its a good thing, IMO

 

"Is it OK for degree mills to give certificates?"

Simple answer, no...

The term "degree mill" should answer your question right away.

 

You say the same thing about every diploma mill mentioned on the boards, then claim that you made a mistake when someone points to specific instances of millish behavior by the entities in question.

But, why should I say anything? They say it so well themselves:

"A Master's or Bachelor's degree is not always required for the Ph.D., DBA or other Doctoral program."

"Rushmore clearly has a better curriculum than both the elite and non-elite schools......The elite American business schools include Harvard School of Business, Stanford, University of Pennsylvania (Wharton), University of Chicago, and about 20 other schools from around the world"

"Because of the failures of self-accredited schools and the success of our students, Rushmore University degrees are likely to be accepted as well or better than degrees from self-accredited universities at almost all organizations in the US and elsewhere in the world. "(You don't need me to tell you that there are, of course, a littany of professional organizations and employers who will not accept any UA degree, so this is extremely deceptive and dishonest)


http://www.rushmore.edu/index.html

 

Funny, I don't have any affiliation to these schools. My basic point is that the term diploma is used too loosely. I can accept sub-standard but not diploma mill in some cases.

 

My real thing is process. If a school has a reasonable process beyond just getting an e-mail document then it becomes more a question of standard than simply a mill.

Obviously, I can't speak for a school beyond their website, so me raising an objection about them been a mill does not mean I support them 100% and I know everything to support then. I always assume people are innocent until proven otherwise.

 

This is why I adopted the terms Diploma Mill and Degree Mill.

Some substandard schools fall in to category A wile others in to category B.

There is a range barely legal to standard and above but unaccredited.

Some schools accredited and have only 4 proctored exams out of 18 - 20 classes but they do have mid term papers for all the classes.

I heared for example about Abet open university.

They do provide some education, many would describe them as type 2 mill.

I have no problem if they issue a certificate in CRM instead of MBA,
Actually there are some vocational schools offer career diplomas that some here will describe as mill type 2.

I would respect Abet open univ more if they just award certificate of completion instead of Degree.

Any opinions?

 

Rushmore is a mill. You are an apologist.

 

Yep, it is a mill, and, morleyl, it is disappointing to read your words.

 

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion at least on this side of the world. I do not think Rushmore University is a mill by any standard definition. This is purely from what I found their website. If they are doing something else outside of that, then I can't speak to that.

 

So, the three statements that I quoted from Rushmore's website do not concern you at all? You think that their claim of having a business program that is "clearly better" than Harvard, Wharton and Stanford (among others) is accurate? Honest?

Do you agree with Rushmore that it's degrees will be accepted "at almost all organizations in the US and elsewhere in the world"?

Are you and I reading the same website?

 

Can you prove them wrong? Anyway, those statements are normal sales pitch, nothing I would call Millish. Some accredited schools make some disputed claims. My focus is purely on the process to grant the degree or certificate.

We know the big name schools are good and highly respected, but it does not mean another school could not potentially exceed them in quality.